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Old 25th July 2014, 11:44   #931
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Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Quote:
Originally Posted by sachinpk View Post


What do you mean by harassment? RTO is legally authorised to check any vehicle. Traffic Police and Highway Police squads regularly pull up vehicles to check and see if they have violated an rules. Other state vehicles also gets pulled over. How can that be harassment? Are you expecting to roam around in your vehicle with no one going to stop you? Fat chance that is going to happen in the real world.
Sorry, RTO is not legally authorized to stop ANYONE unless they have committed an offense. Bangalore surely does not belong in India and Karnataka surely would need a visa system for any Indian to visit soon, Let me quote the RTO

"In August last year, the traffic branch had issued an elaborate set of guidelines to traffic policemen saying that no motorist or vehicle-user should be stopped unnecessarily just for the reason of checking documents or driving licences. According to the traffic department, no drives or actions are taken specifically to check driving licences. "One needs to produce one's license only in apparent cases of traffic violation like more than two persons riding on a two-wheeler, signal jumping and so on"

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/c...ow/6253890.cms

They simply can't stop you for checking UNLESS u have broken a law which in case of Road Tax they simply can't know looking at your number plate that you have paid it or not, or that you have come into the state before a week or two weeks. So randomly stopping people ITSELF is illegal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sachinpk View Post
And that is exactly what is happening now as well. RTO is identiying vehicles which are here for a long time. Hence the focus on areas where chances of getting long time stayers are high. As some one already highlighted here RTO has even asked Servicing Agencies to cough up list of non-KA vehicles which regularly come to their place. RTO is also checking for Apartment & Company parking stickers. In this entire thread I have only seen two borderline cases where the RTO *may* have jumped the gun.
OH YEAH, tomorrow they'll start coming to your our houses to check because there is a chance we might have not paid the income tax too.
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Old 25th July 2014, 11:48   #932
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Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

RTO and traffic police are two different departments. AFAIK, both have independent rules, where one doesn't overlap the other. Looks like there is some confusion in the most recent posts about who needs to follow what.
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Old 25th July 2014, 11:52   #933
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Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Quote:
Originally Posted by humyum View Post
Sorry, RTO is not legally authorized to stop ANYONE unless they have committed an offense. Bangalore surely does not belong in India and Karnataka surely would need a visa system for any Indian to visit soon, Let me quote the RTO

"In August last year, the traffic branch had issued an elaborate set of guidelines to traffic policemen saying that no motorist or vehicle-user should be stopped unnecessarily just for the reason of checking documents or driving licences. According to the traffic department, no drives or actions are taken specifically to check driving licences. "One needs to produce one's license only in apparent cases of traffic violation like more than two persons riding on a two-wheeler, signal jumping and so on"
You are mixing RTO and traffic police, they are different dept, RTOs can surely stop you and ask for vehicle papers, they may not be asking for a DL, but RC & Insurance(to check ownership/ not insurance validity), and not always RTO want to stop out of state vehicles, they may do it for in state vehicles too.
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Old 25th July 2014, 11:53   #934
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Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

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Originally Posted by humyum View Post
Sorry, RTO is not legally authorized to stop ANYONE unless they have committed an offense.
RTO can stop you. BTP (traffic cops) can't officially till they see you break some rule. But he can come up with bogus charges that you can't really prove otherwise.


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Bangalore surely does not belong in India and Karnataka surely would need a visa system for any Indian to visit soon
Lol there's a good chance of that happening!
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Old 25th July 2014, 11:56   #935
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Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Quote:
Originally Posted by humyum View Post
Sorry, RTO is not legally authorized to stop ANYONE unless they have committed an offense. Bangalore surely does not belong in India and Karnataka surely would need a visa system for any Indian to visit soon, Let me quote the RTO
Quote:
Originally Posted by dass View Post
RTO and traffic police are two different departments. AFAIK, both have independent rules, where one doesn't overlap the other. Looks like there is some confusion in the most recent posts about who needs to follow what.
+1 on this.

Both have different set of roles to play.

RTO guys can ask you any document pertaining to your vehicle during checking where as traffic policemen can ask you only DL in case of a traffic violation.

RTO guys can flag-down your vehicle for routine checks where as traffic guys should stop you only in case of a traffic violation.

Waseem.
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Old 25th July 2014, 12:09   #936
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Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Quote:
Originally Posted by humyum
OH YEAH, tomorrow they'll start coming to your our houses to check because there is a chance we might have not paid the income tax too.
It will not be the RTO who would be doing that. But the Income Tax Department. And Income Tax Department really does that. I hope you would have heard of Income tax raids happening. They generally land up at the premises when people least expect them . Income Tax Dept. how ever is a Central Govt. department.


Quote:
Originally Posted by dass
RTO and traffic police are two different departments. AFAIK, both have independent rules, where one doesn't overlap the other.
We need to blame our own education system for this mess. We can memorise n-number of theorems and economic theories, but we really don't know how our own civic agencies work. In Bangalore the Traffic Police are the favourite whipping boys; people blame them for every damn thing. That is because they are the most visible government servant. In BTP's facebook wall I have seen people complaining about bad roads. Bad roads are not BTPs problem, it is the BBMP who needs to provide good roads. Then people complain about bus breakdowns. BTP can work on clearing the mess and fine the bus driver. But it cannot verify the fitness certificate or make sure that BMTC does the regular maintenance. Same goes with building encroachments etc. In an ideal condition the City Corporation formulates the rules and guide lines. Now City Corporation is again an elected body; with staff officers who are government servants. The elected folks decide the rule and how it would be implemented, the staff officers draft the laws and make sure it is all approved. The mandate of enforcing the rule comes to the Police. Traffic Police can enforce established laws, it cannot change it or stop enforcing it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Waseem
I have written it very clearly that we want this freedom to be extended to our rides as well.
If that ride includes travel by vehicles, then there are other laws and rules applicable. Freedom of movement does not mean you can roam around in any vehicle in any part of the country without any having the rights to question you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bravo6
How will they differentiate between someone who has just entered Bangalore, and someone who has been staying here for longer? If they don't have proof to begin with, how can they take action?
They are generating proof by first stopping the vehicles, then checking up the Apartment parking stickers, or company parking stickers, or in extreme cases even by checking the Service Records of the vehicle. See this is a classic case in which the tax-defaulter would NEVER own up that he has been in Bangalore for long. He would come up with one excuse or other to prove that he/she is a short term visitor. So the onus is on the RTO to prove them wrong. This is just like the police collecting good evidence to trap a thief who insists that he has not done any crime. Last week around 250 techies saw their vehicles impounded and taken to the local BMTC bus depot. The RTO used the fact that they were caught coming out of an IT Tech. Park (and all other evidences). Assume that the vehicle owner has gone to the court. The RTO would provide their evidences to show how they feel that the owner has defaulted on the tax. The owner would have to show evidence to counter it. What evidence can he show? Do you think his own IT company would provide a fake employement record? If I were to believe that RTO is all wrong, why not even a single case been filed by these tax defaulters? Folks are paying nearly 50,000 to a lakh as tax+fine. With half of that they can get an average lawyer to challenge the RTO.

Quote:
But first, RTO should make sure such vehicles have actually violated our laws. IMHO they should track when an outside vehicle enters or leaves KA, and only those that exceed the limit should be seized.
That is impractical as we don't have check posts which track inter-state movements, especially of private vehicles. Karnataka RTO cannot wait for donkey's years for such a system to be implemented. As their revenue is getting hit every month and year. So they are using all available means to gather evidences to prove that a person is a long-timer at Bangalore.

Quote:
So if there are any relevant rulings by the Supreme Court, our govt. can be charged for contempt?
This is interesting. But how ever Supreme Court rulings had got bye-passed by the Parliament by bringing in new laws. The Shah Bano case (about divorce cases amongst Muslims) was one such famous case. The authority of courts v/s that of a Parliament is a complex and confusing subject. There are also certain privileges held by a State Legislative Assemblies, which are OUT of court's perview as well. Whether Karnataka Govt. have brought in a legislation to circumvent court orders it can only be decided once courts get involved in this. But for that a PIL should get filed. For all you know Karnataka Govt. may be going on the over-drive perhaps knowing that the courts may throw out this amendment once it comes to know of it.

Last edited by sachinpk : 25th July 2014 at 12:29. Reason: Responses to others added in..
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Old 25th July 2014, 12:15   #937
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Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Talking about non-KA pvt vehicles, what I have gathered is that RTO currently does not care about the 1 year NOC->KA registration rule after the LTT payment. Now what are the fines/penalties if they decide to enforce this rule? Will they seize the vehicles again in that case?

Last edited by BBR_SHR : 25th July 2014 at 12:16.
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Old 25th July 2014, 12:40   #938
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Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Heard that they had checked over 3000 vehicles and 700 odd out of them were in problem. So the 2700 out station vehicles were not troubled and we are talking as if everyone is being.
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Old 25th July 2014, 12:58   #939
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BBR_SHR View Post
Talking about non-KA pvt vehicles, what I have gathered is that RTO currently does not care about the 1 year NOC->KA registration rule after the LTT payment. Now what are the fines/penalties if they decide to enforce this rule? Will they seize the vehicles again in that case?
Sure they will .. that's how governments work 😆
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Old 25th July 2014, 12:58   #940
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Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

HELP NEEDED: Can anyone who got their detained vehicle released from the RTO recently let me know what documents are required? My KL registered car was detained yesterday and is parked at the Hebbal BMTC (They returned my keys). The officer incharge seemed like a tough and good government servant. (my opinion)
They have taken a photocopy of my emission certificate, my KL tax paid receipt, a copy of the RC book and the original insurance. They verified my license and returned it to me. I plan to visit the RTO today.
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Old 25th July 2014, 13:08   #941
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Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

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Originally Posted by stevie View Post
HELP NEEDED: Can anyone who got their detained vehicle released from the RTO recently let me know what documents are required? My KL registered car was detained yesterday and is parked at the Hebbal BMTC (They returned my keys). The officer incharge seemed like a tough and good government servant. (my opinion)
They have taken a photocopy of my emission certificate, my KL tax paid receipt, a copy of the RC book and the original insurance. They verified my license and returned it to me. I plan to visit the RTO today.
Are you planning to pay LTT here? If yes, details are posted yesterday in this thread.
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Old 25th July 2014, 13:13   #942
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Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

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Originally Posted by sachinpk View Post
Last week around 250 techies saw their vehicles impounded and taken to the local BMTC bus depot. The RTO used the fact that they were caught coming out of an IT Tech. Park (and all other evidences). Assume that the vehicle owner has gone to the court.
Not well versed with the RTO laws prevalent right now and hence wanted to better understand it. What is the maximum period you are allowed to stay in bangalore without having to pay the taX? Many of those techies might be residents of lets say Chennai/Kerala/Pondicherry and drive back to Chennai over the weekend. So which category do they then fall into?
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Old 25th July 2014, 13:23   #943
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Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

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Originally Posted by svsantosh View Post
Just came back from ECity RTO (Ironically its in bannerghata road, Vijaya bank colony).

Purpose - To pay tax of TN22 (Chennai) WagonR VXI June-2012 model (Exshwrm 4.03Lacs back then)

NOTE - VOLUNTARY WALK-IN, (No caught by RTO stuff)

Docs needed - CAR/BIKE RC Photocopy, Original Invoice, Insurance copy, "FORM14 of KA.RTO"

Goto ROOM-6, AUDIT OFFICER

Wait in line (1 case takes 5-7minutes)

Produce all 3 documents, answer few basic questions like where you work, how long the car is in bangalore, (we lied its a week old but in reality is here since day of purchase)

A Casio calculator does the work (Penalty is at sole-discretion of the officer). Previous case DL Alto guy spoke like a delhi'te (Seen Virat kohli?) and promptly landed a 7000Rs penalty for a 5 year DL car.

We ended up at 50,300Rs (some 90% tax and a 10% cess on tax amount, 46+4.6 approx) (100Rs Penalty for a eye wash)

Need to PAY USING A NATIONALIZED BANK DD ONLY (No cash, cheque, Private bank DD)

All the calculations were in green ink on the FORM14 with todays date, he said it will hold good for a week, so PAY ASAP


EDIT--- after reading some prev posts...

1) We did not show any address proof, company id card.
2) No originals carried
3) NOC was asked, but we said we will go back in a year or two, hence only paying tax.
I do not have my original invoice. My Director (owner of the car) is abroad for two months! They took my contact details. WIll I be able to work this out? Any advice??
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Old 25th July 2014, 13:39   #944
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Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

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Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post
Not well versed with the RTO laws prevalent right now and hence wanted to better understand it. What is the maximum period you are allowed to stay in bangalore without having to pay the taX? Many of those techies might be residents of lets say Chennai/Kerala/Pondicherry and drive back to Chennai over the weekend. So which category do they then fall into?
According to me, if they have house or rented accommodation in Bangalore, they should be treated as residents. It is tricky if it is a hotel accommodation for the weekdays.
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Old 25th July 2014, 13:41   #945
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Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

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Originally Posted by stevie View Post
I do not have my original invoice. My Director (owner of the car) is abroad for two months! They took my contact details. WIll I be able to work this out? Any advice??
They need the invoice to calculate the tax. They usually accept invoice copy of similar car of the same model and year. So you can post the car model/year here, maybe someone could help in getting the same.
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