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Old 26th March 2014, 16:45   #1
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Default Government to get Maruti Suzuki Swift hybrids

Maruti Suzuki India Limited (MSIL) is believed to be gearing up to supply an undisclosed number of Swift hybrid hatchbacks to the Government of India. The supply is a part of a pilot project. Dubbed Range Extender, the Swift hybrid was displayed at Auto Expo 2014 by the company.

Range Extender hybrid uses a 658 cc, 3-cylinder, petrol engine, along with a 55 kW electric motor that is powered by a 5 kWh lithium ion battery. The battery takes about 90 minutes to charge fully, upon which, it is said to be able to give a range of 25.5 km. The car has a combined fuel economy of 48.2 km/l as per Maruti's internal test results. The battery, electrical motor and other components have been imported from Japan. The Range Extender weighs about 130 kg more than the petrol car.

The Range Extender is undergoing homologation at the moment and is expected to obtain ARAI certification soon. The dates for the supply of the cars are not known due to the upcoming elections. The company expects to have clarity regarding the situation in the first quarter of FY 2014-15.

Link to Team-BHP News Article

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Old 26th March 2014, 18:30   #2
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Default Re: Government to get Maruti Suzuki Swift hybrids

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Originally Posted by Aditya View Post
Maruti Suzuki India Limited (MSIL) is believed to be gearing up to supply an undisclosed number of Swift hybrid hatchbacks to the Government of India. The supply is a part of a pilot project. Dubbed Range Extender, the Swift hybrid was displayed at Auto Expo 2014 by the company.
Interesting. Just wondering which department within the government could order such innovative and futuristic options without worrying about calling tenders and other bureaucratic stuff? Probably the Ministry of Environment has a reason for such a move if it is part of a go green initiative.

If government is satisfied, will they subsidise hybrid cars in the interest of the environment?
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Old 26th March 2014, 18:41   #3
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Default Re: Government to get Maruti Suzuki Swift hybrids

Range Extended - Wow - Amazing - is 25.5 km extra with a battery sold as a range extender

Economy setting on pete's box + sedate drive would easily give 25.5 kms extra on a single tank of petrol.

Instead of spending high costs on battery and charging them just for 25.5kms extra, i personally feel its a waste of taxpayers money (Another scam in the making ???). If at all hybrid vehicles was the expectation, Reva or Prius could fit the bill better.

At least Reva and Prius have proven technologies for many years. Maruti hybrid is a new concept and would Maruti support those handfull of cars for atleast 5 years ? Secondly - would the Govt officials be proactive to charge the swift just for 25.5 kms extra? I honestly feel the anwer is no. If it was a BHPian or an informed community member, probably yes but the general average joe - no.

Last edited by scopriobharath : 26th March 2014 at 18:46.
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Old 26th March 2014, 18:56   #4
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Originally Posted by scopriobharath View Post
Range Extended - Wow - Amazing - is 25.5 km extra with a battery sold as a range extender Economy setting on pete's box + sedate drive would easily give 25.5 kms extra on a single tank of petrol. Instead of spending high costs on battery and charging them just for 25.5kms extra, i personally feel its a waste of taxpayers money (Another scam in the making ???). If at all hybrid vehicles was the expectation, Reva or Prius could fit the bill better. At least Reva and Prius have proven technologies for many years. Maruti hybrid is a new concept and would Maruti support those handfull of cars for atleast 5 years ? Secondly - would the Govt officials be proactive to charge the swift just for 25.5 kms extra? I honestly feel the anwer is no. If it was a BHPian or an informed community member, probably yes but the general average joe - no.
At this moment- are we sure the car is not able to regenerate battery power, as in Toyota Prius?

Just adding a battery capable of giving additional 25.5 kms once from a single recharge sounds stupid. Moreover, a 668cc engine has to now pull a 100kg swift + 130kg battery which against sounds stupid. FE might end up to be a lot worse than the regular K series engine.

I think we should gather more information on the project before calling out such harsh criticism.
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Old 26th March 2014, 21:29   #5
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Default Re: Government to get Maruti Suzuki Swift hybrids

What kind of range extender technology does this Swift plug-in hybrid use?

Does the 668cc (sounds like a Japanese kei-car engine) only act as an on-board generator to recharge the battery pack? Or does it actually power the car directly when the battery pack runs out of charge?

Range extender or plug-in or series hybrids would serve as an excellent stepping stone to full EVs. These have more in common with all-electric cars than parallel hybrids.
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Old 26th March 2014, 22:55   #6
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Default Re: Government to get Maruti Suzuki Swift hybrids

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Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
At this moment- are we sure the car is not able to regenerate battery power, as in Toyota Prius?
2014 Swift for Japanese Domestic market with brake energy regeneration technology was showcased recently. If they've already found a way to implement F1 technology like KERS in Swift, there is a high chance that there would be some way for these batteries to be recharged while running.
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Old 26th March 2014, 23:39   #7
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Default Re: Government to get Maruti Suzuki Swift hybrids

Quote:
Originally Posted by scopriobharath View Post
Range Extended - Wow - Amazing - is 25.5 km extra with a battery sold as a range extender

Economy setting on pete's box + sedate drive would easily give 25.5 kms extra on a single tank of petrol.

Instead of spending high costs on battery and charging them just for 25.5kms extra, i personally feel its a waste of taxpayers money (Another scam in the making ???). If at all hybrid vehicles was the expectation, Reva or Prius could fit the bill better.

At least Reva and Prius have proven technologies for many years. Maruti hybrid is a new concept and would Maruti support those handfull of cars for atleast 5 years ? Secondly - would the Govt officials be proactive to charge the swift just for 25.5 kms extra? I honestly feel the anwer is no. If it was a BHPian or an informed community member, probably yes but the general average joe - no.
I guess you missed the FE figures there of 48.2 kmpl.

That 25.5 km is just running on battery without any fuel in it ( good enough to reach to a nearby petrol bunk)
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Old 26th March 2014, 23:54   #8
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Default Re: Government to get Maruti Suzuki Swift hybrids

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Originally Posted by abhinav.gupta88 View Post
I guess you missed the FE figures there of 48.2 kmpl.

That 25.5 km is just running on battery without any fuel in it ( good enough to reach to a nearby petrol bunk)


Well, the low fuel lamp starts glowing when there is less than 5-10 litres of fuel in the tank. I guess it is more logical to refuel at this point than take a chance with the 25 km range. This 25 km range is in ideal test situations and in real work i would be 18 km/charge.

Regenerative braking could add some juice to the battery but it would be miniscule.
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Old 27th March 2014, 01:59   #9
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Default Re: Government to get Maruti Suzuki Swift hybrids

The 658cc engine could just be used as a generator to power the electric motor and to also charge the battery, like in the Chevrolet Volt.
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Old 27th March 2014, 06:41   #10
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Default Re: Government to get Maruti Suzuki Swift hybrids

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The 658cc engine could just be used as a generator to power the electric motor and to also charge the battery, like in the Chevrolet Volt.
Thank you! This does sound very likely - for the 658cc engine is indeed borrowed from Suzuki's JDM kei-car range, and would be too underpowered for a car like the Swift (with the added weight of the hybrid package).

It should perfectly suffice for acting as an on-board generator to supply electricity to the motor directly, after the battery runs out of charge. At the same time, the battery pack can also get charged - on a long drive, it should be possible to run solely on battery power again, after it gets fully charged.

This kind of hybrid technology would make the transition to fully electric cars that much more easy than say, the Prius parallel hybrid currently on sale in India.

Edit: I hope Maruti Suzuki eventually adds the hybrid Swift to its range of cars on sale, after the trial project is over. It would be a huge boon for the typical home-to-workplace city commute. Even for longer distances, there would be no need to constantly worry about the battery running out of charge, or finding charging points.

With 75PS available from the electric motor, along with full torque from 0 rpm, it should be one very responsive and fuel efficient machine!

Last edited by RSR : 27th March 2014 at 06:56.
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Old 27th March 2014, 08:06   #11
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Default Re: Government to get Maruti Suzuki Swift hybrids

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Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
I think we should gather more information on the project before calling out such harsh criticism.
Absolutely!

It is better to wait and watch how this project gets shape and what is the end result before we all BHPians start bashing this!

At least some activity is being done in this field so Maruti will do something to get the stuff moving.

Anurag.
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Old 27th March 2014, 10:11   #12
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Default Re: Government to get Maruti Suzuki Swift hybrids

To me it seems that the small petrol motor will operate at constant rpm generating constant current for battery recharging. The engine efficiency improves drastically when operated at constant load (which could be the case of range extender) wherein the owner will not have to worry about:

- Possible driving distance (range) per recharge (as it is charged on real time basis / continuously recharged), this will certainly be better than e2o of Mahindra wherein about 100 km is the only range possible between two recharges which will also reduce continuously year on year as the battery will start loosing efficiency.

- The charging will start after a available battery charge drops below certain percentage, thus for small distances, the car can assume a complete green position without any emissions from exhaust.

- There could be some kind of control mechanism to switch off the petrol motor when the likely charge in the battery is more than the required distance to be traveled so that at the end of the journey, the car can be charged from an electric outlet.

To me this seems a technology which carries best of both worlds wherein the cost of ownership for hybrid machine will go down (as compared to complex and sophisticated Toyota cars or for that matter fully electric Tasla) and its cost effectiveness (milage – Kitna Deti Hai question) is also addressed for the developing economies like India.

This is something simple yet innovative like AMT introduced recently by MSIL for small cars. I hope this succeeds in the real world conditions (read India).

My worry is on the math: and i quote from the news

"along with a 55 kW electric motor that is powered by a 5 kWh lithium ion battery"

A 55 kW motor would consume 55 kWh in one hour while the battery is just 5 kWh this means that the battery alone can survive for about 5 minutes when the electric motor is operating at full load. I am not assuming efficiency here (chemical to electric to mechanical) - even if I take is as 1:1:1 no losses.

The simple mathematics puts me in discomfort of the additional range with battery alone or using the car in pure electric mode without running of petrol engine. Am I missing something?


Cheers

Last edited by i74js : 27th March 2014 at 10:22.
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Old 27th March 2014, 15:00   #13
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Default Re: Government to get Maruti Suzuki Swift hybrids

@i74js
This swift will have an all electric range of 25.5km when driven purely on battery ,with engine switched off.
Once the battery depletes below a certain state of charge ,the engine will kick in to simultaneously charge the batteries and also generate sufficient power for the main electric motor.

Now,the electric motor will not always consume 55kw , its only near full throttle will it deliver or consume that much power.

But unlike I.C engines ,electric motors will have its max torque available even from 1 rpm.So because of this the range of 25.5km/charge is likely.
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Old 19th February 2015, 11:29   #14
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Default Re: Government to get Maruti Suzuki Swift hybrids

Maruti Suzuki has always focused on its brand image as an affordable, fuel efficiency focused car maker. The Celerio hatchback is expected to get a diesel engine that delivers a fuel economy of over 30 km/l and a recent media report suggests that the highly successful Swift could be launched in a hybrid avatar in or after 2017.

Link to Team-BHP news article
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Old 20th February 2015, 13:12   #15
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Default Re: Government to get Maruti Suzuki Swift hybrids

Quote:
Originally Posted by scopriobharath View Post
Range Extended - Wow - Amazing - is 25.5 km extra with a battery sold as a range extender

Economy setting on pete's box + sedate drive would easily give 25.5 kms extra on a single tank of petrol.

Instead of spending high costs on battery and charging them just for 25.5kms extra, i personally feel its a waste of taxpayers money (Another scam in the making ???). If at all hybrid vehicles was the expectation, Reva or Prius could fit the bill better.

At least Reva and Prius have proven technologies for many years. Maruti hybrid is a new concept and would Maruti support those handfull of cars for atleast 5 years ? Secondly - would the Govt officials be proactive to charge the swift just for 25.5 kms extra? I honestly feel the anwer is no. If it was a BHPian or an informed community member, probably yes but the general average joe - no.
I think it works in a different way. The report reads the range will be 25.5 kms if driven on batter alone without engine running. Check with all modern vehicles like BMW i8 and find what is the actual range when running alone on battery power it is way less unlike Tesla which is a pure electric car with long range.The technology is like this in simple words, the electric motor help reduce the need of a bigger engine and this reduces fuel consumption. When engine runs, the battery gets charged up and motor also contributes a certain power to the vehicle reducing dependency on engine power alone. so the vehicle never feel in lack of power and gives better efficiency.

If this one gives 48km per every liter of petrol with the addition of a battery , this is going to be a fantastic vehicle. Even if it gives 30km/l it is good. NVH levels will be way less than diesel cars and there is also a possibility of more torque as electric motors produce instant torque. What more can be given by manufacturer? Add this with some government tax benefits and if it is launched with a realistic pricing it will be a fantastic and practical car to go for!
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