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Old 28th May 2014, 09:26   #31
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

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Originally Posted by IshaanIan View Post
LOL it is 2014 mate. Show me a single D1 segment sedan on sale in our market that doesn't offer this in their base variants. The other sedans also offer 4-6 airbags with abs, ebd, esp and tcs, as you go higher up the trim levels.
You are absolutely right buddy. But from what I think is that Toyota does not seem to be concerned with what market is offering. Toyota management seems to be living in their own sweet world.
How else would one explain 1.4L D-4D in Altis: Punto 90HP hatch is producing more power than that.

But still people buy Toyota. because it is after all Toyota.

So, considering Toyota in its own World, Airbags & ABS are definitely a welcome move & improvement over previous Altis.
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Old 28th May 2014, 09:48   #32
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

My father was planning to buy this car. He always wanted to buy a Toyota. But looking at the feature kit he is in two minds. Elantra emerging as top choice.

Don't see any value in this Toyota. Should finalize in a week or two.

Can someone give me in-city mileage of Elantra? Both diesel and petrol.

Thanks!

Last edited by GTO : 28th May 2014 at 13:27. Reason: Typo
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Old 28th May 2014, 09:50   #33
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

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Originally Posted by desdemona View Post
Guys, there are many people who think a Corolla a benchmark, global, upper-middle class person's proper sedan, because its engineering and design is seen as mature, measured, not tacky, not tart-y, not a hatch-with-a-boot, not a car with flimsy build, or choppy ride, or skinny tyres. And who regard Toyota as a sort of benchmark of affordable, reliable yet prestigious automobility. Heck, I know many such people, here and abroad. My own B-in-law is one of them, and he isn't that old either. for many people even now, rightly IMO, it is a no-contest between a Hyundai, however fluidic, and a Toyota Corolla.
Well, you are NOT saying they are right, but you are quoting them. I like the misdirection. "Don't blame me, blame others because they are not smart."

Why should we not compare a Honda city D to Corolla D? The car definitely got better performance than the Corolla, which costs a whopping 6+ lacs more. I did sit in both (new Corolla) can compared - i do not see anything which i have to pay a 6 lac premium for. Now, we can argue that it had a better build and better quality. But then you have a much better build, refinement and performance in Jetta & Octavia diesels - available at same prices. I would anyday pick the Octavia backseat over the corolla one. Can you believe Corolla doesn't even come with rear AC vents? Pretty dumb, if you ask me.

Please don't underestimate the power or intelligence of buyers. They are very smart people who put their hard earned money - and they will do these comparisons.

Last edited by GTO : 28th May 2014 at 13:27. Reason: Quoted post edited
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Old 28th May 2014, 10:01   #34
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

Toyota had a nice chance to upgrade the diesel engine but they didn't. My i20 crdi engine looks more powerful compared to it. Its time for Toyota to stop bragging and banking on the Q reliability. Speaking about reliability, my i20 has completed 86K km and it still feels new. I have never faced any issues with it. Our 12 year old Omni hasn't given us any problems till now. Its still a strong workhorse. Cars from most of the manufacturers are very reliable these days. Toyota, learn a lesson or two from your competitors and upgrade your engine and equipment list.

Last edited by guyfrmblr : 28th May 2014 at 10:03.
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Old 28th May 2014, 10:59   #35
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

What crazy pricing!

I know so many well-off people who DON'T bother looking at segments. They just look at the car's design & interiors (& often to a very limited extent, the brand), the purpose of use and simply go ahead.

Toyota may have to take some tough decisions and come down its pedestal as a company IF it wants any respectable numbers (especially while the auto market is bleeding and other car-makers are trying to innovate & succeeding at it!).

IMO Sooner than later, the equation of Price : Features : Volumes WILL matter even to 'Brand' Toyota. Maybe mileage is losing its relevance, but features (especially safety features) are definitely gaining more importance.

Wake up Toyota! or else all these David competitors will beat Goliath!
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Old 28th May 2014, 11:11   #36
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

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Originally Posted by desdemona View Post
Guys, why do we insist on comparing cars from different segments and manufacturers as if they were 'aaloo-pyaaz'? This value-for-money attitude that excessively translates every car into the common currency of money, whereas cars and manufacturers have at least some untranslatable, unique traits even if fictive/imaginary, based on heritage, history, geographical origin, 'cultural' DNA.
Well all the things that you said as unique traits: based on heritage, history, geographical origin, 'cultural' DNA, gizmos etc are being sold as higher VALUE. Which fetches better price than competition (actually it eliminates competition).
Advantage: SELLER.

AS a buyer when I visit a market, I would prefer to have as many features as possible, at as lower price as possible. I would want as many competitors as possible, and bring everyone at par with respect to features and ignore the ones that set them unique. I would essentially COMMODITIZE the offering. Like ALOO PYAAZ. Because this is the only mechanism that allows free competition and best price.
Advantage: BUYER.

So tell me, I don't manufacture vehicles. Neither do I sell those.
Essentially I am always on the BUYER side. Why should I pay heed to something which a SELLER wishes to promote as the "correct" way of thinking and evaluating?
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Old 28th May 2014, 12:39   #37
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

Toyota never cease to amaze with their extremely stingy safety feature list in their ₹ 1 million+ vehicles. The new Altis is the only car in the D1 segment with only 2 airbags and ABS even on the top variant, while it's competitors also get ESP, ASR and 6 airbags (or at least 4) on their top variants.

Just when I was beginning to think that at least the barebones J (diesel) and slightly better equipped JS (petrol & diesel) were (sort of) acceptably priced for what they offer in terms of safety kit (2 airbags and ABS along with rear disc brakes - same as the base variants of rivals), comes this:

2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs-image.jpg

I do think the portion highlighted in brown is an error. Since the G petrol and above variants get front fog lamps, there is no reason why the G diesel and GL diesel variants don't get it. A small (but glaring) error on the site, I guess.

The highlighted portion in red is no error. The J diesel does not get the immobiliser+alarm.

What does this mean? Since the J diesel does not get remote locking, does it lose out only on the alarm linked to the remote locking system? Or does it also lack an ECU-controlled, transponder-on-the-key immobiliser?

I hope the official review throws more light on this.

The barebones J diesel may actually attract fleet buyers - one can expect hotels and tour operators to buy this variant and use it as an upmarket 5-seater cab for their customers (when compared to the usual fleet favourites from the lower segments).

Last edited by RSR : 28th May 2014 at 12:45.
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Old 28th May 2014, 13:03   #38
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

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Originally Posted by RSR View Post

I do think the portion highlighted in brown is an error. Since the G petrol and above variants get front fog lamps, there is no reason why the G diesel and GL diesel variants don't get it. A small (but glaring) error on the site, I guess.
Not sure about the immobiliser in the J spec but the brown part regarding teh fog lamps is no error.

None of the diesel variants have fog lamps on them. Reason is there is not enough space behind the bumper for the fog lamp assembly in the diesel due to the intercooler plumbing.

So even the GL does not get it.
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Old 28th May 2014, 13:24   #39
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

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Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
Not sure about the immobiliser in the J spec but the brown part regarding the fog lamps is no error.

None of the diesel variants have fog lamps on them.

So even the GL does not get it.


And here I was, believing it was an innocent mistake on the part of the Toyota website administrator.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
Reason is there is not enough space behind the bumper for the fog lamp assembly in the diesel due to the intercooler plumbing.
I believe this also means a genuine fog lamp kit cannot be installed by the dealer as an accessory.

Well, I guess one can always resort to one of those aftermarket fog lamp kits (that stick out like a sore thumb), should one really need front fog lamps on the Corolla Altis diesel.

Thank you for clearing this up, Vid6639!

Last edited by RSR : 28th May 2014 at 13:26.
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Old 28th May 2014, 13:55   #40
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

Toyota appears to have shot itself in the foot with these pricings. Why would anyone pay a few lakhs more for under-specced, under-powered (compared to City) diesel Corolla? Honda is no less a brand than Toyota. In fact, many rate "H" brand above "T". And the other italic "H" brand is fast catching up, too. Sorry, Toyota, ghost of Qualis/Innova success has come back to haunt you. At a time when Europeans are fast making inroads, this is the gameplan Toyota resorts to?
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Old 28th May 2014, 15:54   #41
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

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Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
None of the diesel variants have fog lamps on them. Reason is there is not enough space behind the bumper for the fog lamp assembly in the diesel due to the intercooler plumbing.

So even the GL does not get it.
Woah such a functional error on Toyota's part Are you sure? Such design faults/quirks, I would expect only from the French but certainly not from Toyota
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Old 28th May 2014, 16:07   #42
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

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Originally Posted by IshaanIan View Post
Woah such a functional error on Toyota's part Are you sure? Such design faults/quirks, I would expect only from the French but certainly not from Toyota
What is the error? It is designed like this and not a mistake.

If the most optimum plumbing meant no space for fog lamps; isn't that the right option than adding fog lamps but changing the plumbing?

Also don't forget the Altis diesel is India specific and not from Thailand.

The diesel is available only in the Auris hatchback sold in Europe which is based on Altis sedan. That may have a different bumper design altogether.
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Old 28th May 2014, 16:10   #43
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

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Originally Posted by alpha1 View Post
Well all the things that you said as unique traits: based on heritage, history, geographical origin, 'cultural' DNA, gizmos etc are being sold as higher VALUE. Which fetches better price than competition (actually it eliminates competition).
Advantage: SELLER.

AS a buyer when I visit a market, I would prefer to have as many features as possible, at as lower price as possible. I would want as many competitors as possible, and bring everyone at par with respect to features and ignore the ones that set them unique. I would essentially COMMODITIZE the offering. Like ALOO PYAAZ. Because this is the only mechanism that allows free competition and best price.
Advantage: BUYER.

So tell me, I don't manufacture vehicles. Neither do I sell those.
Essentially I am always on the BUYER side. Why should I pay heed to something which a SELLER wishes to promote as the "correct" way of thinking and evaluating?
Thanks for the very eloquent and in its own way very right riposte. Man, all I am saying is that not all commodities are the same, they are not and should not be commodities in the same way.

Aaloo-pyaaz are generic, each aaloo has next to no distinctive 'identity', but cars and their manufacturers do, or at least should, otherwise they are just appliances not a CULTURAL and engineering ART-efacts. They have many different AESTHETIC (including engineering) values they embody. So yeah, they are commodities but not in the same way.

All I am saying is that we must not, like with the Toyota-bashing, evaluate ONLY based on VFM, with only money/price being the comparative yardstick. It is as if we, as the famous quote goes, know the price or the paisa-vasool rank of everything but the (qualitative, Aesthetic, cultural) VALUE of nothing (forgive the exaggeration!).

e.g, We have damned the Corolla without (most of us) seeing it, driving it or, remembering that MAYBE this brand of sedan of this company has heritage and a certain identity that say the Etios from the same company doesn't.

I swear, rationally but ultimately only as a matter of (arguably dubious!) TASTE by Fiat. Beyond a point the VFM calculations are BESIDE THE POINT for me. Many people feel similarly about the Corolla, just like they do for (some) Fords, Skodas, Mahindra-s, Vespa-s, Yamaha-s. They are wrong to only if they buy into the manufacturers branding/advertising blindly, and/or engage in unknowing herding. It is not really about VFM, whether one's budget is big or small, rigid or elastic: it's about (debatable) TASTE. IMO we should debate the tastefulness or lack thereof of the Corolla's design, drive and heritage/image-value, rather than get overly bothered about bang-for-buck/paisa vasool.

MODS: Hope this wasn't OT. I will stop here.

Last edited by desdemona : 28th May 2014 at 16:35. Reason: spelling
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Old 28th May 2014, 16:52   #44
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

I don't favor any car company, I don't own a corolla. But for one I know its a pretty respected car globally. Yes the pricing for the new corolla altis is indeed high for what it offers, but I think we all are being too harsh.

I have test driven the new Honda City VX CVT and booked the car already as I desperately need a good automatic sedan for the family. My dad on the other hand wants me to cancel the booking and buy the new corolla altis bcoz he simply loves the new one. And there is a huge waiting period for the Honda vx CVT.

I took a closer look at the carolla yesterday being the launch day and I took my own time to get the feel of the car from within. The quality is really good inside and out. The car looks simply amazing. Like Desdemona said, most of us have not even driven or seen the car and just bcoz the price is high, we are bashing it. I just love the overall quality and build of the car and the features aren't that bad. The only thing remains now is to take it for a spin when it's available for test drive and anxiously waiting for the review by the Team-bhp experts.

Last edited by mod_to_odd : 28th May 2014 at 16:55.
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Old 28th May 2014, 16:55   #45
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Default Re: 2014 Toyota Corolla Altis (11th Gen) launched @ 11.99 lakhs

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Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
What is the error? It is designed like this and not a mistake.

If the most optimum plumbing meant no space for fog lamps; isn't that the right option than adding fog lamps but changing the plumbing?

Also don't forget the Altis diesel is India specific and not from Thailand.

The diesel is available only in the Auris hatchback sold in Europe which is based on Altis sedan. That may have a different bumper design altogether.
With all due respect, fog lamps, are not something as trivial as fake carbon-fiber trim. I am definitely not suggesting they choose between one or the other. They ought to simply alter the design of the front bumper to accommodate fog lamps while not intruding on the plumbing for the diesel's intercooler, in such a case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by desdemona View Post
e.g, We have damned the Corolla without (most of us) seeing it, driving it or, remembering that MAYBE this brand of sedan of this company has heritage and a certain identity that say the Etios from the same company doesn't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mod_to_odd View Post
I don't favor any car company, I don't own a corolla. But for one I know its a pretty respected car globally. Yes the pricing for the new corolla altis is indeed high for what it offers, but I think we all are being too harsh.
LOL what are you saying will be revealed, after seeing or driving the car? I will not comment on the diesel motor since while I have driven both previous iterations of this model in our country, they were both petrol and I know I cannot judge how tractable a car's motor is or feels until I've driven it. However, If I drive the car, will it show me that it's ABS module is magically capable of functioning as a stability program as well as a traction control system? If I crash the car, will I find that the dual airbags try to encompass the entire car including my ribs and the sides? Is there an extra bulb in the headlamp housing made to provide a downward, wide and flat spread of light mimicking a fog lamp, that I can only see in person? Will I find aircon vents concealed in a secret location when I'm checking out the rear bench?

In that case, count me in! I can't wait to test this car This definitely seems like a very worthy D1 segment competitor

Last edited by IshaanIan : 28th May 2014 at 17:18.
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