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Old 6th May 2016, 12:26   #556
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Default Re: The Indian Taxi Revolution - Uber, Ola, TaxiforSure, Meru etc.

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Originally Posted by alpha1 View Post
.. It is not Uber or Ola who is raising the prices as such, it is us idiotic commuters who are raising the prices by competing among ourselves. If the prices are not raised then we will all be stuck longer without any cabs in most of the situations.

EVERY price rise of any commodity that you see can be explained by this...
I totally agree with your explanation. However, I have one doubt. How could the customers be sure whether the surge pricing is really due to gap between demand and supply ?

I have this doubt as it is very common to hoard in the commodity market, be it onions, pulses, grains or any other thing. One the same lines, I somehow doubt that similar shortage can be built into the software, e.g. at what ratio of demand and supply what surge pricing will be applicable. Initially it may be a higher demand to supply ratio, but once customers have accepted the surge pricing model, the surge pricing can be started at a lower ratio.

Moreover, taking reference from a legal battle between two app based aggregators, where one accused the other of generating false demand and then cancelling at last moment to prevent from getting real customers. What if the generated demand is unreal (generated either by a non-related third party or a conniving entity) ?
http://in.reuters.com/article/uber-o...-idINKCN0XR033

In my opinion, regulators must not stop surge pricing, as in principle it is good for both customers and providers, but the ratios (demand to supply) and corresponding rates must be controlled. And strong penal action must be proposed for any attempt to play with 'demand' aspect by any party.

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Originally Posted by Dry Ice View Post
They do charge more (surge) if there are more customers than cabs but never seen them reduce the price if there are more cabs than customers. It happens regularly in hotels (off-season), airlines (early-morning flights), buses (weekday fares) etc.
This is another aspect, but it may be related to their minimum operational costs.

Last edited by AutoNoob : 6th May 2016 at 12:30. Reason: replied to second quoted post
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Old 6th May 2016, 12:56   #557
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Default Re: The Indian Taxi Revolution - Uber, Ola, TaxiforSure, Meru etc.

They should be transparent and publish data to users on a weekly basis about the surge pricing done over the week and the reasons for the same.

Else they will also be Chennai auto drivers, fleece when possible
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Old 6th May 2016, 12:59   #558
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Default Re: The Indian Taxi Revolution - Uber, Ola, TaxiforSure, Meru etc.

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Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
People travel when they need to travel. Those who are flexible wait or go earlier. Those [in this city] who can wait an hour rather than 15 minutes call Fastrack. The cost may be a little more than the "normal" charge, but it will be nothing like a substantial surge charge.
Tell me if you agree with the following:
a) If I want a cab, and I want it now - it has a price that is Rs 30/km
b) If I want a cab, but I can wait for 1 hour - it has a price that is Rs 15/km
c) If I want a cab, but I don't have money and thus will wait forever for seat - take the bus at Rs 1.5/km

We have 3 different price points, for 3 different levels of needs.

Most people's grouse is that (a) is also sometimes available at Rs 5/km (low demand = base fare) and these greedy consumers hate it when it's price is hiked to Rs 30.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dry Ice View Post
Never seen this happening with Ola/Uber. They do charge more (surge) if there are more customers than cabs but never seen them reduce the price if there are more cabs than customers. It happens regularly in hotels (off-season), airlines (early-morning flights), buses (weekday fares) etc.
Becuase the base fare is already a glut price.
Lets work out some rough figures:

Vehicle capital cost = Rs 5 lakhs
Vehicle lifetime = 2 lakh km
Hence capital cost amortized over life = Rs 2.5/km
Interest cost @~10% = 0.5/km

So I have a capital cost of about Rs 3/km


CNG Vehicle fuel cost = Rs 2.5/km
Driver's salary = Rs 300/day => 300 km/day => Rs 1/km
Maintenance and insurance cost = Rs 1/km (I am not talking only about regular maintenance but also breakdowns and parts replacements)

And Operating cost of about Rs 4.5/km

In the glut, seller forgets his capital "sunk" cost, and works only to recover his running costs (opex)


Are you not already getting almost "reverse surge" price as base fare???

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Originally Posted by AutoNoob View Post
However, I have one doubt. How could the customers be sure whether the surge pricing is really due to gap between demand and supply ?
You don't need to.

The whole issue is we as consumers have been led to believe that there is something known as globally correct price.
It's not.

The correct price for me is something that I agree with.
You may find it too high, someone else may be willing to buy at even higher price than me!
(Apple iPhone is a prominent example)

If you find surge to be "fake", simply don't take Uber/Ola ride.
If what they are doing is "fixing", they will lose their business.

There are alternatives available right?
We have buses, metros, autos, taxis, merus etc each at different price point with different convenience factors ... don't we?

Last edited by alpha1 : 6th May 2016 at 13:28.
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Old 6th May 2016, 13:34   #559
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Default Re: The Indian Taxi Revolution - Uber, Ola, TaxiforSure, Meru etc.

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Originally Posted by alpha1 View Post
Becuase the base fare is already a glut price.
Lets work out some rough figures:

Vehicle capital cost = Rs 5 lakhs
Vehicle lifetime = 2 lakh km
Hence capital cost amortized over life = Rs 2.5/km

CNG Vehicle fuel cost = Rs 2.5/km

I have not even added maintenance cost, interest cost and driver salary and possible margins on the operations and I have already reached Rs 5/km

Are you not already getting "reverse surge" price as base fare???
Not really. Rates change once you cross 15 kms. In big metros, that is like the average joe's daily commute. Forget going to railway stations and airports.

My point being, just like their platform allows the users to bid for an available cab when supply is less, they should also allow the drivers to bid (with lower prices) when the customers are less.
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Old 6th May 2016, 14:32   #560
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Default Re: The Indian Taxi Revolution - Uber, Ola, TaxiforSure, Meru etc.

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Originally Posted by alpha1 View Post
Most people's grouse is that (a) is also sometimes available at Rs 5/km (low demand = base fare) and these greedy consumers hate it when it's price is hiked to Rs 30.
Maybe what they should have done is advertised every ride at "full price," with a Discount rate offerred at low-demand times. Maybe that would have left more people feeling like they winning, rather than "surge" payers feelling like they are loosing.

I am not at all happy with the business models here anyway. Operating at below cost as a "customer acquisition" phase could work out, or it could lead to one big bursting of a bubble. Having said that, when it suits me then, selfishly, yes, I'm along for the ride and will enjoy it as long as it lasts.

For me, the big impact has been on using autos. No haggle and meter charging. Surge charging does not apply in this sector.
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Old 6th May 2016, 14:40   #561
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Default Re: The Indian Taxi Revolution - Uber, Ola, TaxiforSure, Meru etc.

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Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
For me, the big impact has been on using autos. No haggle and meter charging. Surge charging does not apply in this sector.
OLA now has a meter in their app itself. I used their service once in Bangalore and Chennai. Bangalore guy used the app meter while the Chennai guy used the regular one.

Chennai guy's final price was 20-25 rupees more than what the App quoted

I didn't know whether to be happy that I got charged through meter or to be sad that it was through the wrong one.

Still like you say, it is better than haggling at the start and end.
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Old 6th May 2016, 18:42   #562
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Default Re: The Indian Taxi Revolution - Uber, Ola, TaxiforSure, Meru etc.

Different cities have different rates, I think?
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Old 13th May 2016, 22:38   #563
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Default Re: The Indian Taxi Revolution - Uber, Ola, TaxiforSure, Meru etc.

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Originally Posted by SchumiFan View Post
OLA now has a meter in their app itself.
Chennai guy used the regular one.

Chennai guy's final price was 20-25 rupees more than what the App quoted
Absolutely the same experience. I guess both of us got conned. I put a one star rating, ola Chennai hasn't called back.

(I got calls immediately when I've cancelled rides or rated then poorly in Bangalore/Coimbatore)
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Old 13th May 2016, 23:55   #564
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Default Re: The Indian Taxi Revolution - Uber, Ola, TaxiforSure, Meru etc.

In Delhi, I just paid Rs 383 for 7.4 km ride that was completed in 13 minutes.
2.9 surge price
:-(
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Old 14th May 2016, 00:06   #565
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Default Re: The Indian Taxi Revolution - Uber, Ola, TaxiforSure, Meru etc.

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Absolutely the same experience. I guess both of us got conned. I put a one star rating, ola Chennai hasn't called back.

(I got calls immediately when I've cancelled rides or rated then poorly in Bangalore/Coimbatore)
Will try Ola Auto again this Sunday. Hoping to get a definitive answer on that. Might write to them if there is a difference in rates between the meters again.

I am not sure if Uber will do less than 4km distances else I will choose them for any trip I make.

Did a CMBT - Thiruvanmiyur trip on Thursday morning. Paid Rs 152. For comparison sake, do note that I pay 50-60 for Thiruvanmiyur - Adyar trips in Autos.

Uber cool. Ola, I try to avoid whenever possible. Book only the Autos because that is the only way these guys in Chennai will switch on the meters.
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Old 14th May 2016, 10:27   #566
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Default Re: The Indian Taxi Revolution - Uber, Ola, TaxiforSure, Meru etc.

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Originally Posted by SchumiFan View Post
Might write to them if there is a difference in rates between the meters again.
I'll tweet to them right away. I expected their CC to call after my 1 star rating, but hasn't happened in 36 hours now.

Quote:
I am not sure if Uber will do less than 4km distances else I will choose them for any trip I make.
They will. But the trip will be exorbitantly expensive.

They always mention a "minimum fare" when you ride.

I did a 3 km ride at Rs. 85 during the night in Chennai.
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Old 14th May 2016, 11:01   #567
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Default Re: The Indian Taxi Revolution - Uber, Ola, TaxiforSure, Meru etc.

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Originally Posted by SchumiFan View Post
.

I am not sure if Uber will do less than 4km distances else I will choose them for any trip I make.
.
The drivers will be more than happy to do so. One guy initially told he was having lunch and will take time and when I told him my destination which was just 4kms away he came to pick me up in no time. Since they get incentives based on the number of trips, they will be happy to do two short trips than a single long trip.
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Old 14th May 2016, 19:31   #568
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Default Re: The Indian Taxi Revolution - Uber, Ola, TaxiforSure, Meru etc.

Honestly I think the whole app Taxi thing is stupid and inconvenient. In a city like Mumbai, especially. Sure, at times it might be same cost or lower if you have some deal/free wallet cash as an autorickshaw but with benefit of AC and comfort of a 4 wheeler.
But :
1] I have to give my card information to PayTM (cash payments exist I know but this is the main method) and also give the App authority to debit by account for any amount as and when they see fit.

2] Waste of time. I have to check and wait for availability. Often it takes atleast 10+ minutes to get a cab, often longer. Plus even after marking the location you have to speak to the driver atleast a couple of times for directions and what not.
In Mumbai at any time of the day or location it hasnt taken me more than 5 minutes to get a cab or auto even if I come across a few who reject or if I have to cross the road to go in opposite direction.
My brother and sister in law only use Uber/Ola since both dont drive. Me and my wife are usually a quarter of the way home in an auto while they have just sat in the cab.

3] You have to do unnecessary planning and time management for your journeys and causes disruption : For example you are a friends place for dinner. You think when desert is served you will call for a cab as it usually takes you 10-15 minutes to get one. You check and cabs arent available or there is a high surcharge. So instead you loaf around and overstay your welcome while waiting for a cab to become available or for a cheaper fare, instead of just heading down and grabbing a cab or auto that will be at the corner or pass by in a minute or two.

If you do manage to get one you will disturb everyone by wandering around talking loudly trying to get a good signal for the crappy VOIP call from the driver to give him directions and what not or asking the host to talk to the guy and what not causing disruptions .

4] From several threads it seems like the experience is moving towards your regular public transport with refusals, poorly maintained vehicles, rude drivers, long journeys turning into split rides, wrong charges, etc. Are you really guaranteed a superior experience anymore ? With surcharges, fares pretty much balance out

5] The only cases where I see it as beneficial is for a late night to or from trip to an airport or if you want better comfort on a medium/long trip.

Sorry if I seem a bit harsh but the way people go on about Ola and Uber and how they are so addicted to it, I still dont see them as more convenient or better experience. This is taking into account living in Mumbai and taken 8-10 rides over the last year or so and observing people in my friends circle/relatives.
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Old 14th May 2016, 20:44   #569
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5] The only cases where I see it as beneficial is for a late night to or from trip to an airport or if you want better comfort on a medium/long trip.

Sorry if I seem a bit harsh but the way people go on about Ola and Uber and how they are so addicted to it, I still dont see them as more convenient or better experience. This is taking into account living in Mumbai and taken 8-10 rides over the last year or so and observing people in my friends circle/relatives.

Uber is attractive for those folks who are taking out their cars. Instead you get a decently priced AC car, with no parking hassles. Also for the airports runs, you can get a bigger car for luggage. For pub runs, you are no longer the only guy not drinking as you have to drive the car. Also, you can call an uber to pickup/drop your family members and be assured they won't have to haggle over prices or worry about directions of they are coming from out of town. Uber is present in many cities, so incase you are visiting an unfamiliar city, you can trust uber over an auto/cab.

In Mumbai, you have good cab/auto availability. Try getting an auto/cab in chennai, or Delhi. I've lived there for 2 years each. I've had to spend considerable time convincing the cab/ auto driver to go where I want - forget them overcharging, just getting them to take you somewhere is a challenge in itself.
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Old 14th May 2016, 22:56   #570
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Default Re: The Indian Taxi Revolution - Uber, Ola, TaxiforSure, Meru etc.

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Originally Posted by Mortis View Post
Honestly I think the whole app Taxi thing is stupid and inconvenient. In a city like Mumbai, especially. Sure, at times it might be same cost or lower if you have some deal/free wallet cash as an autorickshaw but with benefit of AC and comfort of a 4 wheeler.
to .
1. I don't understand this. Unless I authorize the payment, how can they charge me? Uber especially gives you a credit until your next ride. They don't charge me immediately after the ride unless I myself pay.

2. Yes, I have to agree. It's not that fast.

Rest of it is somewhat debatable. My experience with Uber is very different compared to OLA. The former is miles ahead and the difference is noticeable. Hence if I take OLA as a reference I have to agree with you but Uber is not so.

I usually take the cab at least twice a week and sometimes more than once a day. The drivers have started to drive better and have cars in top notch condition. Rarely take OLA but when I have to, it's an average experience.
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