Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > The Indian Car Scene


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 8th May 2015, 08:51   #286
Senior - BHPian
 
sandeepmohan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Wellington
Posts: 1,942
Thanked: 1,624 Times
Default Re: Scoop - Fiat Punto Evo T-Jet coming up!

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayD View Post
One thing to keep in mind is that the current fiat lineup feels nothing like the power mentioned on paper.
I disagree for the Linea T Jet. The power delivery, torque that you get does line up to what is published.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayD View Post
The 90hp punto is frustratingly slow low down
Yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayD View Post
The Tjet linea again is 'adequate' not exhilarating. The weight reason provided is rubbish.
Weight does ruin what could otherwise be a quicker car. It is not slow in any sense of it when pitched with the competition.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayD View Post
The tune and the gearbox are the culprits.
The tune is surely a problem for the 90hp Punto, not the case with the T Jet. The gearbox is probably the worst on offer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayD View Post
Add to that the very uncomfortable driving position.
I'll say it is uncomfortable over extended periods of driving. Not "very" uncomfortable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayD View Post
And lack of features compared to competition. (especially compared to the i20) I think the fate of the car is already sealed.
DRL's missing, Blue tooth streaming missing (A big miss) and key less start. Other than this, I think you get pretty much everything the immediate competition offers with regard to toys.

The fate of this car is already known and that is because of how Fiat India operate. The car's are good. If only the company updated the line up much faster, worked on improving quality of support, things would have worked much better for Fiat. They have yet to figure this out even after so many years. It is no surprise they aren't any better in International markets too.
sandeepmohan is offline   (4) Thanks
Old 8th May 2015, 11:41   #287
Senior - BHPian
 
k_ajay's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,164
Thanked: 464 Times
Post Re: Scoop - Fiat Punto Evo T-Jet coming up!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vik0728 View Post
.......

How I Wish, Fiat surprises everybody and launches the Punto T-jet for Diwali.
And later be surprised that still, no one bought it. Come on, we all can guess how the punto Tjet sales will look like. Already, rumours of a 135hp has got watered down to a rumoured 105bhp.

I don't wish that Fiats don't sell but I doubt the T-Jet in the Punto Evo is going to dramatically increase the sales. However, as an enthusiast choice, 135hp sounded more appropriate than 105hp. They're anyway not a mass market car. At least play to the enthusiast's preference. (so many individuals are buying the T-Jet Lineas in spite of getting 7-8 kpl in city).

A Q1 2016 launch timeline, however, totally will piss of any waiting prospects.


Quote:
Originally Posted by sandeepmohan View Post
The tune is surely a problem for the 90hp Punto, not the case with the T Jet. The gearbox is probably the worst on offer.

....... that is because of how Fiat India operate. The car's are good. If only the company updated the line up much faster, worked on improving quality of support, things would have worked much better for Fiat. They have yet to figure this out even after so many years. It is no surprise they aren't any better in International markets too.
So true. The gearbox (and probably weight) is absolutely killing the driving experience of the 90hp Punto Mjd. I am now looking for a premium hatchback and sadly, the Punto is not even in consideration.

Spot on, Sandeepmohan. Excellent cars (mostly, sans little 'resolvable' issues, totally derailed by a vision-less or action-less manufacturer (at least in India). Look at their sales figures for the last 6 months. Just 865 cars on an average, over 3 different car models (Avventura, Punto Evo and Linea). Fiat is not concerned now of the car sales as they're making all their money on the engines. Maruti has renewed their engine purchase program with Fiat for until 2018 (I think, I read this on AutoCar India mag. Because their own diesel engine refinement isn't good enough and Maruti is still working on it). Tata made their own Revotron Turbo petrol engine. How long before they make their own diesel too?
What is Fiat going to do when the engine purchases stop? Are they going to sustain as a manufacturer of cars in India, with these sales figures? Think about the dealerships who've invested so much money on them.

They're planning (and planning and planning) to bring some Jeep variants after 2016/2017 (?) and new Linea (Grand Siena?) and Punto in 2017. For hypothetical reasons, let's say both Maruti and Tata have their own diesel engines by 2020 and don't need Fiat's anymore. What does Fiat think? They can bring in more models from 2017/18 onwards and India will suddenly warm up to them and start buying their cars like Hyundai or even VW sells?

Very poor strategy, IMO. I'm always hoping Fiat will do some miracle and bring better engines and new cars to India and become an success, but I don't get anything other than disappointment from Fiat. A SA from KHT Fiat Caffee knows this better than anyone.

Last edited by k_ajay : 8th May 2015 at 12:07. Reason: Adding response to another post.
k_ajay is offline   (4) Thanks
Old 8th May 2015, 12:59   #288
BHPian
 
abhii176's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 133
Thanked: 91 Times
Default Re: Scoop - Fiat Punto Evo T-Jet coming up!

As exciting as the news of an impending Punto T-Jet launch is, i just cant understand the reasoning behing waiting as long as Q1 '16 for this. The Fiat strategy in India just baffles me. They really do have strong products, if only they had a better focus on the market here and put in place a good sales and support setup in place.
Being a Punto owner (and a very happy one at that), am just saddened by Fiat India's strategy.
abhii176 is offline  
Old 8th May 2015, 14:28   #289
BHPian
 
sai_ace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: CBE-BLR
Posts: 290
Thanked: 184 Times
Default Re: Scoop - Fiat Punto Evo T-Jet coming up!

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayD View Post
The Tjet linea again is 'adequate' not exhilarating.

...Add to that the very uncomfortable driving position.
Absolutely agree to that ! The tjet as a package works - the ride, the road handling and the engine.

The engine alone does not feel incredibly powerful as it is made out to be - its strong and comfortably adequate. I think it does have a lot of potential though.

Reg the seating - strangely I am the most comfortable in my linea. Zero body ache or stiffness even after 5- 6 hours behind the wheel Lucky me i guess.

Back to the Punto Tjet

On the Punto Tjet - I still think the guys who revealed this have not revealed the whole story wrt power figures, Maybe to under promise and over deliver?

Last edited by sai_ace : 8th May 2015 at 14:32. Reason: Clarified
sai_ace is offline  
Old 8th May 2015, 15:54   #290
BHPian
 
Speed Pujari's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 429
Thanked: 385 Times
Default Re: Scoop - Fiat Punto Evo T-Jet coming up!

Quote:
Originally Posted by nim_peter View Post
I would have preferred the t-jet in 3 door Grande Punto avatar. Looks sporty and distinguishes it from other hatches. Not sure if anyone going for the abarth will be using it as a family car(still can seat 4). Anyways, it is still a t-jet and won't stop me from considering it once it is launched.
3-door will not be digested by our people even at this age. I asked a few of friends right now and they could not understand why some cars do not have 4 doors in 'onsite' countries lol ! .. To put it simply, 3 door has no future in India. Remember Zen Carbon and Steel?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lapis_lazuli View Post
... Look at all the sensors.....! At least 30-40 of them connected to the central analyzer. There is one on the roof, another at the exhaust, and many others, here and there, not visible in the pics.
This is where the money goes - engineering, engineering and engineering. Wish they reserve some money for better after sales and marketing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayD View Post
One thing to keep in mind is that the current fiat lineup feels nothing like the power mentioned on paper. The 90hp punto is frustratingly slow low down and not really great on the top end either. Ditto the linea and the avvy. The Tjet linea again is 'adequate' not exhilarating. The weight reason provided is rubbish. The tune and the gearbox are the culprits.
.
I cannot comment about the 90hp punto but T-Jet is indeed slow. But it depends which car you comparing it with. Honestly the T-Jet does not stand a chance in front of GTX or 1.6 sports. But T-Jet has a better grunt compared to every single enthusiast car under 20 lakhs (barring VRs).
The weight reason of Linea is imaginary illusion made by some people since the T-Jet maneuvering and grunt is like a small car. MJET is indeed sluggish.

Quote:
Add to that the very uncomfortable driving position. ...
.
I would have agreed had this comment came in before October last year.
2 years back I drove my car from Mumbai to Bangalore in a day, single driver(me) and just 2 breaks on the way. I kept on complaining about the weird driving position of my car and could not simply get best driving position. I reached Bangalore in 16 hours but never realized that I was not tired, no back pain, no any pain anywhere and I was all set for a get together even after such a long drive. Back then I was convinced that Linea's driving position is weird despite of the fact that I was not fatigued.
I realized advantage of Linea 'weird' driving position only after driving Altima in the US.

Come October last year when I drove an Altima in US for 3000 kms in a span of one week. My back, knee and the entire body started to ache only after few 100 kms of driving. Since were 2 drivers, we somehow finished our trip by switching. Both of us used to get fatigued in half a day of driving.
Speed Pujari is offline  
Old 8th May 2015, 17:21   #291
Team-BHP Support
 
suhaas307's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 8,055
Thanked: 6,601 Times
Default Re: Scoop - Fiat Punto Evo T-Jet coming up!

Well, after reading about the deferred launch and probable drop in power figures, I'm glad I got myself a Polo GT. I'm not going to wait a whole year for a car that's been de-tuned for no good reason.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Pujari View Post
3-door will not be digested by our people even at this age. I asked a few of friends right now and they could not understand why some cars do not have 4 doors in 'onsite' countries lol ! .. To put it simply, 3 door has no future in India. Remember Zen Carbon and Steel?
Agreed. 3-door cars will not do well in India. However, the Zen Carbon and Steel were special edition cars and were sold in limited numbers. It's not like Maruti had surplus stock of Carbons and Steels.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Pujari View Post
This is where the money goes - engineering, engineering and engineering. Wish they reserve some money for better after sales and marketing.
..aaand the gearbox! Why hasn't the money gone into engineering a good gearbox? They could invest a little and make the shift-action feel more positive and less clumsy. The throws are waaayyyy too long and it saps the fun out of it. How can Fiat sell an enthusiast's car and not give it a good gearbox?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Pujari View Post
I would have agreed had this comment came in before October last year.
2 years back I drove my car from Mumbai to Bangalore in a day, single driver(me) and just 2 breaks on the way. I kept on complaining about the weird driving position of my car and could not simply get best driving position. I reached Bangalore in 16 hours but never realized that I was not tired, no back pain, no any pain anywhere and I was all set for a get together even after such a long drive. Back then I was convinced that Linea's driving position is weird despite of the fact that I was not fatigued.
I realized advantage of Linea 'weird' driving position only after driving Altima in the US.
Ergonomics is not directly linked to a comfortable drive.

You were far less fatigued because of the superb seats and the brilliant ride quality. The suspension is incredibly compliant and you don't feel a damn thing!

The car is still an ergonomic disaster though!
suhaas307 is offline   (5) Thanks
Old 11th May 2015, 10:59   #292
BHPian
 
anand_lukose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Nashville,Hyder
Posts: 124
Thanked: 58 Times
Default Re: Scoop - Fiat Punto Evo T-Jet coming up!

I guess one of the funnier ways to improve the Punto TJet would be to borrow the gearbox from the swift ! I gave you Engines, you give me your gearboxes and I will give you some discount on the engines !
anand_lukose is offline   (9) Thanks
Old 11th May 2015, 11:59   #293
BHPian
 
arjab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: MAA/CCU
Posts: 647
Thanked: 1,199 Times
Default Re: Scoop - Fiat Punto Evo T-Jet coming up!

From reliable birdie:
Avventura T-Jet to step into showrooms first. Around Diwali this year. This will carry the Fiat logo.
Punto T-Jet after that: Expect Dec-15 or Jan-16. This will be badged Abarth. No Fiat logo's.
Avventura may have a little less power output compared to Abarth Punto. Abarth Punto will have 135Ps.
arjab is offline   (5) Thanks
Old 11th May 2015, 12:51   #294
BHPian
 
blackwasp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Navi Mumbai
Posts: 786
Thanked: 3,126 Times
Default

Wow this is just great news. Abarth branding will be good to enthusiasts and will help improve the Fiat image.
And if launched with a buyback scheme for existing Punto owners it'll be the icing on the cake.

Now its time to start gathering vitamin M !
blackwasp is offline  
Old 11th May 2015, 12:58   #295
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 3,717
Thanked: 425 Times
Default Re: Scoop - Fiat Punto Evo T-Jet coming up!

Punto is an existing car.
TJet has already been tested in Linea for years now.
Punto TJet has been undergoing testing for few months now.
Fiat isn't exactly a hot seller with restricted capacity for launching new cars.

So can someone tell me why the car will be launched in Dec-2015 or Jan-2016?!
amit is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 11th May 2015, 13:06   #296
BHPian
 
SchumiFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 859
Thanked: 703 Times
Default Re: Scoop - Fiat Punto Evo T-Jet coming up!

Quote:
Originally Posted by amit View Post
Punto is an existing car.
TJet has already been tested in Linea for years now.
Punto TJet has been undergoing testing for few months now.
Fiat isn't exactly a hot seller with restricted capacity for launching new cars.

So can someone tell me why the car will be launched in Dec-2015 or Jan-2016?!
Because FIAT There seems to be talks that the turbo is different from the one in Linea (I think I read it a few pages ago).

Given their condition in India, the last thing they would need is a critical part failure due to lack of testing. Hence the delay.

Ideally I would have preferred them to launch whatever version of T-Jet they currently have and then replace the existing one with the newer version.

If the newer version carries less power (comparitively) but gives better mileage, it can still be sold using that line.

But given Fiat's way of working in India, I doubt they will go towards that approach. That is where I like VW. They didn't wait to launch the GT TDi until the 1.5 diesel was ready.
SchumiFan is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 11th May 2015, 14:30   #297
Senior - BHPian
 
safari_lover's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Bengaluru / Bagdal
Posts: 1,058
Thanked: 377 Times
Default Re: Scoop - Fiat Punto Evo T-Jet coming up!

Quote:
Originally Posted by arjab View Post
From reliable birdie:
Avventura T-Jet to step into showrooms first. Around Diwali this year. This will carry the Fiat logo.
Punto T-Jet after that: Expect Dec-15 or Jan-16. This will be badged Abarth. No Fiat logo's.
Avventura may have a little less power output compared to Abarth Punto. Abarth Punto will have 135Ps.
Everything is nice except for the expected Punto T-Jet launch date. Sigh.
safari_lover is offline  
Old 11th May 2015, 18:10   #298
BHPian
 
avisidhu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Chandigarh
Posts: 618
Thanked: 456 Times
Default Re: Scoop - Fiat Punto Evo T-Jet coming up!

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayD View Post
One thing to keep in mind is that the current fiat lineup feels nothing like the power mentioned on paper. The 90hp punto is frustratingly slow low down and not really great on the top end either. Ditto the linea and the avvy. The Tjet linea again is 'adequate' not exhilarating. The weight reason provided is rubbish. The tune and the gearbox are the culprits.
....
So 105 bhp on the punto will still be significantly slower than the polo tsi...
Yes true but Punto will have manual transmission. For those looking for a turbo charged petrol hatch with MT, this might be the only option. Which might give them an advantage in the short term at least.
avisidhu is online now  
Old 11th May 2015, 19:45   #299
BHPian
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Faridabad
Posts: 57
Thanked: 88 Times
Default Re: Scoop - Fiat Punto Evo T-Jet coming up!

Quote:
Originally Posted by suhaas307 View Post

Ergonomics is not directly linked to a comfortable drive.

You were far less fatigued because of the superb seats and the brilliant ride quality. The suspension is incredibly compliant and you don't feel a damn thing!

The car is still an ergonomic disaster though!
I can vouch for that too. I drive my Linea close to 100 Kms every day and have done multiple 400-500 + kms drives. I think brilliant straight line stability and suspension dynamics play a major role. Especially on highway/expressway where you've to fight the car less to keep in line. I recently drove to the hills with 4 people on board and a boot full of luggage, However none of the dynamics got impacted much. Couple that will brilliant sound insulation, superlight clutch and excellent effortless breaks and you're in for a very comfortable car. That is even though the steering the peddle angle feels plain weird.

Last edited by kaushal21fb : 11th May 2015 at 19:54.
kaushal21fb is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 16th May 2015, 19:46   #300
BHPian
 
Vdrive's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Palakkad, Kerala
Posts: 64
Thanked: 16 Times
Default Re: Scoop - Fiat Punto Evo T-Jet coming up!

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayD View Post
One thing to keep in mind is that the current fiat lineup feels nothing like the power mentioned on paper. The 90hp punto is frustratingly slow low down and not really great on the top end either.
I assume you don't own or haven't even driven a punto 90hp. Ofcourse it is not for traffic light grand prix. Please take one if you can and test it on an exp. highway. At high speed it feels like 90-100kmph in other cars plus that superior stability. What else you want from a street legal car?


Mod Note: Post edited. Team-BHP strongly discourages unsafe driving practices that put yourself and other road users at risk. Please do NOT post about illegally high speeds on public roads.

We advise you to read the Forum Rules before proceeding any further.

Last edited by Rudra Sen : 18th May 2015 at 12:04.
Vdrive is offline   (4) Thanks
Closed Thread


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
My Terrestrial Fighter Jet : Fiat Linea T-Jet+. EDIT: 3 years, 4th Service completed KarthikK Long-Term Ownership Reviews 220 8th April 2015 00:19
Renaissance of my JET - White FIAT Linea T-Jet+ (27,000 Kms Up) Sathya_sc Test-Drives & Initial Ownership Reports 225 4th August 2014 20:29
Fuelled FIRE into my (T)JET - The Fiat Linea T-Jet bnzjon Test-Drives & Initial Ownership Reports 123 12th May 2013 00:16
Grande Punto Facelift: From baby Maserati to Punto Evo EDIT: Punto 'My Life' on pg.7 sushanthr77 The International Automotive Scene 167 25th November 2011 12:02


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 03:28.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks