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Old 3rd February 2015, 10:37   #46
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Default Re: Vehicle Quota System: Why not in India?

Instead of a Quota system, we need to have a system to ensure that only people who have enough parking space should buy cars. They need to go to local town planning authority, get certified - the parking space should be photographed and submitted to sellers and a copy to RTO before they register a car. This will, I am sure, Limit the buyers and reduce the traffic congestion to an extend and free up roads for free flow traffic.
The town planning authorities should be able to summon the owner through RTO if a vechicle is seen parked on road for days.
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Old 3rd February 2015, 10:53   #47
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Default Re: Vehicle Quota System: Why not in India?

Originally Posted by Taffy View Post
where Yes I agree that public transport is a good way to go, there is also a surge in buying cars because every family wants one. And if a car is parked outside the house it is going to be driven t some point. Therein lies the problem :-)
This isn't a problem as long as the car isn't parked on public property (like the road) when it isn't in use.

Unless public transport reaches a level of efficiency when it can cater to any emergency and at any point of time you cannot realistically stop people from driving a car once in a while. Even the highly developed welfare states that dot Europe don't have that efficient a transportation system.

What good public transport does is to discourage use of private vehicle. Let me give you a couple of examples:

Scene 1: MG Road, Bangalore

I potter around Bangalore in a two-wheeler. I stay in North Bangalore. However, if I need to go to Indiranagar (for which I have to cross MG Road), I prefer parking my vehicle at MG Road (if parking is available) and taking a metro to Indiranagar. This is because the stretch from MG Road to Indiranagar is really heavy on traffic and the metro runs half empty (I can always find a place to sit) and the journey is under 5 minutes.

Similarly if I am using other forms of public transport which are more expensive (Cabs usually) when I am in no mood to use a two wheeler, I get down at MG Road and then board a metro.

This I do because I find the metro extremely easy to use and it discourages me from using my own vehicle.

Scene 2: Mumbai

I relocated to Mumbai a few weeks back from Bangalore and don't have a vehicle here. But since I work where I live and whatever I need is easily available nearby, and the public transport (the rickshaws) is really efficient and cheap compared to Bangalore, I haven't bothered buying a bike yet.

Two things to note.

First: in this case, I avoided the need to travel by living close to where I work - this is a luxury not all can enjoy but when it is available there is nothing like it.

Second: Mumbai is an example of a really well developed public transportation system when it works. But as usual conditions apply. I cannot travel hanging from buses and local trains with a laptop bag containing electronics worth a small fortune due to the amazingly efficient thieves that dot Mumbai's mass transit systems. But I can use them efficiently when I leave my phone and wallet behind with just a handful of currency notes in my pocket.
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Old 3rd February 2015, 12:12   #48
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Default Re: Vehicle Quota System: Why not in India?

Quota system will encourage black marketing and bribe culture. Everyone remembers the waiting periods of Bajaj scooters and Premier Padmini. We love to break rules, ain't we?

Real problem is unplanned public transport. Let's see how a typical mumbai suburban resident travels to office. First take an auto to railway station, take a train to some station in mumbai, take a bus / cab / auto to office. This type of break journey reduces efficiency of a common man.

Recent example of unplanned transport is monorail first phase. Very few passengers travel from Chembur to Wadala and mono stations are also not well connected. Here in central suburbs, one cannot travel to Navi Mumbai so easily if the place of residence is beyond Thane. Either come to Thane and change train or take a bus and go via shil phata - mahape - turbhe route. Demand of mono rail on Kalyan - Mahape - Navi Mumbai / Kalyan - Ghodbunder (Thane) has been shot down by government due to lack of funds.

Enough of Mumbai, take example of pune. If you are going to Hinjewadi from Mumbai, the nearest railway station is Pimpri / Chinchwad but all 3 morning trains from Mumbai do not stop there. So you have to go till Shivaji Nagar or Pune station and take a bus from there. Time wasted, enormous. Via buses (MSRTC/Shivneri) you can go till Wakad but again you have to get down and take another bus / 6 seater or an auto to reach Hinjewadi phases.

Imagine going by car from navi mumbai to hinjewadi, a bit costly but 100% convenient. You will reach in 2 hrs easily.

Some hybrid solution is required to provide end to end connectivity for important locations. Statewide share-a-car / rent-a-car can be widely implemented and people travelling on same route can travel quicker than public transport.
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Old 3rd February 2015, 12:23   #49
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Default Re: Vehicle Quota System: Why not in India?

I am never for restricting or putting quotas on anything that can be freely available. It just opens up a Pandora's box. Rather than trying to come up with any such nightmarish ideas, we should be putting in place a proper infrastructure so that people freely start using them.
I mean there is no way a sane guy would drive to work if the Public transfort is easy, comfortable and less time consuming.
Quotas are always a bad idea, they have been and they will always be.
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Old 3rd February 2015, 12:44   #50
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Default Re: Vehicle Quota System: Why not in India?

After reading through the posts, I think rather than putting heavy taxes and implementing Quota system, what we should be looking is to make public transport more swift and affordable. At the same time find a realistic solution. For example, I remember when I was in Delhi, I once travelled from uttamnagar to Inter state bus terminus by a three wheeler in afternoon, when the traffic is comparatively less. It took me almost 2-2.5 hrs to reach there.
But once metro was started, it used to take only 40 mins to reach there, that too in the comfort of a AC compartment with minimum chances of accident. And I was a frequent on that route and it never took more than 40 mins for me. So this helped me plan my activities and I was sure that I will never be late.
Also, I have been to London, and I have seen even VPs of my company travelling in tubes(local trains) to and from the office.

And an example of really poor public transport planning is the metro rail in Bangalore, which started from Bypannahalli to MG Road. Thats only 6 km and who will travel to office on that route. So first and foremost thing would be a more efficient and effective public transport system!!
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Old 3rd February 2015, 17:24   #51
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Default Re: Vehicle Quota System: Why not in India?

Many of us will not agree in vehicle quota system. But the government can explore this option from second car onward. This will do good in the long run for our country.
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Old 3rd February 2015, 19:00   #52
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Default Re: Vehicle Quota System: Why not in India?

if this law is brought, it is just like addressing the problem at the highlest level and not at root level. People use cars because public transport is not that reliable as compared to foreign countries. Bringing this rule will NOT solve the problem.

This is same as "SUV" tax, where there is a 2% extra tax for SUVs. If Govt does not want to see more SUVs on the road, they could provide better infrastructure (like UK or Germany autobahn), where someone had an option of going in even for a low slung sedan.

Another example is to prevent using sun film for reducing crime. The best logical option was to increase policing at prime areas or installing a "booth" in interior locations. It serves dual purpose of providing new jobs and also reducing the crime.

Again, Increasing the Tax or bringing in the Quota is not the solution, but better public transport is needed. The average tax paying IT / BPO Joe expects an AC transport, which reaches on time. Again, buying a vehicle like tractor / road-roller which is subsidized would not help this tax payer either.
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Old 4th February 2015, 09:51   #53
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Default Re: Vehicle Quota System: Why not in India?

Techies would rather travel by BMTC buses
BMTC stands up to be counted, techies rejoice

Some better route planning to be done by BMTC in Electronics City and Sarjapur Road areas of Bengaluru. I would for sure give this a try, as they are implementing a few new routes.
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Old 6th February 2015, 19:32   #54
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Default Re: Vehicle Quota System: Why not in India?

Originally Posted by RGK View Post
Many of us will not agree in vehicle quota system. But the government can explore this option from second car onward. This will do good in the long run for our country.
Unfortunately, this does not solve the commute issue of everyone in the family, where cars are bought as a necessity.

So, instead of spending time and effort on these systems, it might be worthwhile spending that effort in building the basic amenities for public transport. This would do away the need for such rationing systems to a large extent.
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Old 7th February 2015, 08:44   #55
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Default Re: Vehicle Quota System: Why not in India?

Once very important point I have noticed in India, after living in Nigeria, South Africa & Dubai; abroad , every car regardless of the speed it is travelling at uses the outermost lane only for overtaking, and then immediately sifts back to the inner lane. In India you have slow moving traffic in the rightmost lane. This forces faster drivers to go to the left lane and overtake from the left whch is not safe. You will have a slow moving truck trying to overtake a slower moving truck on the flyovers, backing up traffic. All BHPians must have encountered this on one day or the other.
Slow driving on rightmost lane should not be allowed. For a few months traffic policemen should be posted at the mid point of flyovers, and random points on the highways, flag down slow drivers on the rightmost lane and fine them heavily. The Driving Public especially , Truck & Cab Drivers, should be educated on this point.
I am sure average traffic speed will increase substantially, and restrictions on car ownership can be made less onerous.
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Old 8th February 2015, 18:32   #56
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Default Re: Vehicle Quota System: Why not in India?

Quotas have never helped anyone and in future too will help no one, except promote corruption and a culture of abuse of power by a political and babu class. Its high time we refuse to come back and even discuss quotas on anything in our lives.

Instead of building new flyovers and toll roads, the government must actively build and promote fast, efficient, connected and comfortable bus and train services which cover at least 80% of the city it services.
Our government planning mentality has to change, and change fast, it seems to always play catch up, the only aberration I have seen to this is in Hyderabad, where in basic infrastructure has been built and continues to be built to a plan and is future proof to a certain extent. With the amount of double laned roads, wide traffic circles, encroachment free public footpaths, over head bridges and the excellent outer ring road, the traffic density in the city is very less indeed. Only thing they should have planned IMO is made a ring railway running commuter trains along with building the ORR so that a great public transport system would be in place.
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Old 8th May 2015, 11:27   #57
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Default India does not need Low Cost Hatchbacks

Hatchbacks are small cars; cheap, easier to maintain, better on fuel efficiency due to their smaller engines and are a great step forward for car aspiring families. While all these from a financial, economic and labour arbitrage perspective make complete sense, I’m not convinced that this applies in the here and now.

All these will be compelling and heavy facts maybe in 2035 but twenty years ahead it makes for various practical obstacles that are difficult to overcome – density of traffic, pollution, dearth of parking, unruly drivers and poor support systems. I truly believe that cars like Nano are gems and technological marvels but India does not have the education and the maturity to manage more of them each year and another 450,000 of the 800s, I10, Indica, Ritz and so on.

Here is what I propose:

A model which I saw used to great effect in Singapore. The government should not allow more than 30,000 new cars each month pan India. Currently we are close to 100,000. The RC has to be bought through an auction by the dealer. The cost should be at a reserve price of at least INR 50,000 and this should be over and above the on-road price of the vehicle.

This will kill the small car market you would say. NO!! In fact many sedan buyers will switch to better, smaller and more efficient hatches thus making it viable.

For any car that is priced more than INR 25,00,000 there should be an additional luxury tax of 5% of the car value. Any vehicle that is serving less than 6kmpl, there should be a 50% tax, irrespective if the car is a CBU or not and should also give reduced taxes to electric and hybrid cars.

The government should invest every single penny earned from here into three parts – roads, traffic police and public transport systems. It should also commit to shell out exactly the same amount as collected for the above mentioned items

Let this be run as a 10 year plan and we then take an informed judgment in 2025. Push this for another 10 such that we have gathered suficient data around buying patterns, trends, econimics of this framework.

In addition to the above all cars must have the basic safety options like ABS, Air bags and Alloy wheels. This will clearly jump the cost of the car but that is exactly what the intention is.

Each person should renew the license every 10 years. People aged above 55 should do it every 5 years. No person beyond 75 years should drive a car. Allow me to illustrate another scenario. A bloke who enjoys zipping through narrow by-lanes, snaking his way past four wheelers at signals, changing lanes with consummate ease now upgrades his Pulsar to a Nano. He feels good about himself and his newly acquired status. He tends to be cautious in his initial weeks but once he settles in and gains confidence behind the wheel, his primal instincts are bound to take over. It’s the same with so many auto rickshaw drivers in every part of India.

Maybe 10-20 years hence, when we have better roads, better public transport and more civil drivers we can discontinue some of these. Till then, give the mass an incentive to use public transport, support the environment and also help the city administration to make India sturdy and not frail.

It is absolutely fine not to be the #1 small car manufacturer in the world in 2015. But it is not fine to be among the worst managed countries.

Last edited by Eddy : 8th May 2015 at 11:57. Reason: Spacing and formatting for better readability
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Old 8th May 2015, 11:47   #58
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Default Re: India does not need Low Cost Hatchbacks

I do not know if you are right. But it surely gives food for thought. And fodder for a different imagination of the future.

It is also interesting to imagine what would happen, say, 1000 years from now. How many cars would there be, what will the air be like, where will all the cars park? Or, will it be something completely different not easy to imagine now.
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Old 8th May 2015, 11:49   #59
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Default Re: India does not need Low Cost Hatchbacks

A novel and a revolutionary way to curb pollution and irresponsible driving. However, I feel the following points will significantly impede such a plan.

1. India's public transport systems are woefully inadequate. Raising the price of cars to herd car users to public transport is not justifiable, in my opinion. The taxes collected can be used for investment in Transport facilities, as you say. But IF they are invested, the projects will take many years to complete.

2. Though this model is existing in Singapore(just taking your words, I am not aware of this), Singapore is a small country and is not representative of India. Being comprised of different states, such a plan will fall well-below its intended targets.

3. Electric cars and public transports are the way forward if we are to curb the raising pollution. Metros and many other parts of India have chronic power shortage. There is dearth of electricity to power industries and agriculture even. Car owners will certainly be apprehensive about electric cars. Regarding public transport, only Delhi has a half-decent metro rail system. In order for such an ambitious plan to fall into fruition, we need metro rail connectivity that is on par with, say, London. And it will take India several years before it even meets the initial requirements before such plan can be put into motion.

These are just few thoughts that just came out off top of my head. If we give it more thought, I am sure people will unanimously agree that India, govt and people, have to radically change before such measures are taken.
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Old 8th May 2015, 11:52   #60
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Default Re: India does not need Low Cost Hatchbacks

I'm all for restrictions on cars if mass transport is adequate. Which it is in most developed cities. In most Indian cities, it is not... but one solution can be to encourage bicycle use (I cycle to work most days, 7km and back). But why single out small hatches? Big SUVs are more polluting, occupy more space, and the drivers seem to be more aggressive.
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