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Old 29th July 2015, 18:08   #16
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Default Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

There was a similar Team-BHP News report in December 2014 :
VW to adopt torque based nomenclature for Asian markets

It seems German car makers are on a nomenclature shift spree. After Audi and Mercedes-Benz, Volkswagen will reportedly be shifting over to a new nomenclature system. The new nomenclature will follow a torque based engine labeling pattern. This change has been announced in reference to Asian markets for now.

The news comes in after Volkswagen Group Malaysia (VGM) managing director, Armin Keller, announced the new system that replaces the power based naming structure used in global markets. In Malaysia, the VW Passat and CC sedans will be the first two models to adopt the new nomenclature, though no specific timeline has been mentioned.

The new system will help highlight output differences between models that produce similar figures. For example, the VW Vento 1.6 MPI makes 103.6 bhp & 153 Nm of torque. The Polo GT TSI makes the same amount of power, but 175 Nm of torque. If implemented in India, models could have names like 153 MPI & 175 TSI.

Source: http://paultan.org/2014/12/09/volksw...ine-labelling/

Last edited by Rehaan : 29th July 2015 at 22:37.
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Old 29th July 2015, 20:21   #17
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Default Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

Quote:
Originally Posted by scopriobharath View Post
There is a flip side to this too. A 30 TFSI owner, would just buy the 50 TFSI badge along with some K&N decals to attract attention

This is similar to Innova "E" taxis, adding those mock wood trims and just sticking the "V" badge. Seriously - i dont understand how those wooden stickers can match ABS and Airbags of the "V" Variant. (the Qualis tye steering wheel, gave it away, that it was an "E" variant).
Audis and the German manufacturers in general do not seem to badge their cars with the variant, so the same car in the same variant in Petrol and Diesel might have a different badge - which would be the same as if they were using Engine CC instead. Not like re-badging an Innova E as a V, because one couldn't retrofit a number of features (especially safety).

One could have in the past changed CC figure from 2.0 to a 3.0 too, for example.

Quote:
Originally Posted by arnabchak View Post
This sort of badging would be very difficult for the common man to comprehend.
I don't think it would make much of a difference. In the past it would have been 2.0 or 3.0 or whatever, and now it is a different number but still the higher one shows better performance.
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Old 29th July 2015, 20:35   #18
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Default Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

While the calculation may look complicated, its just basic physics and in fact makes things very simple. No longer will someone need to look at BHP, Weight, 0-100 times.
Higher TFSI number means greater "pushed to the seat" feeling
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Old 29th July 2015, 20:45   #19
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Default Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

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Originally Posted by VeyronSuperSprt View Post
By the look of it, once this trend catches on, and it will, the next gen would look at folks quoting cc numbers as museum pieces.
True that. I think this is probably the perfect performance badging in today's times. It had to be someone at VAG Group - they have several instances where the same engine is made available in 3 or sometimes 4 states of tune and therefore the same 2.0 or 3.0 badge will not do justice to the product.

This way you won't have to figure out which one has the FGT and which one the VGT. Or which one has a turbo and which one a twin-turbo. Or which one is a 1.2 turbo and which is a 2.0 NA.

The technology becomes irrelevant, and the user experience is prioritised - which is as it should be for the layman.
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Old 29th July 2015, 21:00   #20
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Default Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

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Originally Posted by 1100D View Post
What will the Veyron Be?
Interesting question. Had to do the Math. Calculation below to keep me honest.

Dynamic badging formula = (a*100)/g
Veyron's 0-100 time = 2.5 seconds
Therefore, a = (27.78/2.5) = 11.11

Dynamic badging = (11.11*100)/9.81 = 113.25 rounded up to 115

Hence, Veyron badging = Bugatti Veyron 115 W16 T4SI

(T4 to indicate Quad turbo, not an VW AG nomenclature yet, but I thought I'd start the trend by putting that in anyway).

Finally, badging for the cars that can rival registration numbers across the world.

I like it.

Last edited by azeemhafiz : 29th July 2015 at 21:12.
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Old 29th July 2015, 21:07   #21
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Default Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

This has to be one of the most uninteresting things I've ever come across. Another very good reason to dislike Audi's. Why not do it the Mercedes way? Badge a 6.2 V8 as a 6.3.
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Old 29th July 2015, 21:49   #22
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Default Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

My opinions differ.
And I will go on to say that this is simply Brilliant.

Like someone said its the measurement of the "feeling of getting pushed back".

Engine size has not much relevance today since we have Turbocharged and Supercharged engines now.

Labeling a car on its performance is a better approach.
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Old 29th July 2015, 22:42   #23
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Default Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

Quote:
Originally Posted by azeemhafiz View Post
Interesting question. Had to do the Math. Calculation below to keep me honest.

Dynamic badging formula = (a*100)/g
Veyron's 0-100 time = 2.5 seconds
Therefore, a = (27.78/2.5) = 11.11

Dynamic badging = (11.11*100)/9.81 = 113.25 rounded up to 115

Hence, Veyron badging = Bugatti Veyron 115 W16 T4SI

(T4 to indicate Quad turbo, not an VW AG nomenclature yet, but I thought I'd start the trend by putting that in anyway).

Finally, badging for the cars that can rival registration numbers across the world.

I like it.
Thanks For noting my question! Why I specifically mentioned the Veyron is because of two things

First one, the thread starter is coincidentally "VeyronSuperSprt"!

Secondly, according to this portion below, and rightfully so. Any car with the value exceeding 100 would have gravity defying acceleration!

Quote:
Originally Posted by VeyronSuperSprt View Post

Then on the assumption that 1g is equal to 100, the result is rounded up or down to the nearest multiple of 5, which is the number that finally gets used as the Dynamic Badge.

As a straight inference from this. If you are accelerating under gravity, it will take you 2.83 secs to reach 100kmph!

So any car that does it in less time will create dual gravity on the driver! (one vertical and the other horizontal)
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Old 29th July 2015, 23:00   #24
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Default Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

Could it be that even the Audi's of the world also perceive themselves downsizing the actual volume of their engines in the future. With that logic, it would be a hardsell for Audi to make someone shell out the big bucks for say, a 1.5 L engine on an A4, even if the torque and power are maintained. The new badging system has the potential makes the actual engine volume redundant.

Either that, or it is to make the 'paavtas' feel good about them having put their black money in the right place!
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Old 30th July 2015, 06:44   #25
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Default Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

1. Audi plans to incorporate Dynamic Badging into all models globally except for its high-performance lineup ― such as S, RS and R8 etc.

2. India is the fourth market to have the new system following China. Korea and Malaysia.

3. New technologies, such as turbochargers, hybrids etc permit cars that have the same or even smaller displacement to produce higher maximum output and torque and this means that an engine’s displacement has stopped being as useful as it once was or even logical enough to accurately evaluate a car’s performance.

4. The growing market for fully electric cars actually makes engine displacement a redundant standard.

Last edited by VeyronSuperSprt : 30th July 2015 at 06:54.
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Old 30th July 2015, 09:01   #26
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Default Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

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Originally Posted by alpha1 View Post
But then what value does a large V6 offer over puny 4 cylinder if both produce the same performance (and thus end up with the same badge).

For those who want to just know for knowledge sake, Audi will not hide the CC/BHP/Torque/RPM figures in their documents. Will they?
I think it is a very sensible move by Audi. This seems to be the future of car performance comparison.
With regards to V6 engine, it offers better smoothness and NVH levels, seamless acceleration, very little turbo lag. Remember these are luxury cars and not everyone is always looking for better fuel economy or thumping acceleration (even though it wouldn't hurt to have it). There will always be a difference between a 3 cylinder and 4 cylinder, 4 cylinder and V6, as there is between a V6 and a V8, lets not go into 12 cylinders or above. The difference may be subtle but large enough for the discerning customer.

Last edited by pamiboy : 30th July 2015 at 09:06.
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Old 30th July 2015, 09:22   #27
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Default Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

Its an interesting new development. Irrespective of the exact math, it still comes down to a bigger number means my car is faster than yours!

Maybe to add, not sure if it is available in India:

In Europe the really cool thing is to have no badge at all and with most manufacturers it is an option. So you actually have to pay to have no badge!!

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/11/au...DGES.html?_r=0

Apparently 25% of Audi's are de-badged. Various different reasons are stated. From people being ultra cool, people dont want others to know what version they driving. That last one could go either way. Some people dont want the world to know they bought the top of the range, whilst others might not want to advertise they have biught the cheapest version with the tiniest engine.

What is common, as far as I know, is that you have to pay extra to have the badge removed.


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Old 30th July 2015, 11:00   #28
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Arrow Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

Quote:
Originally Posted by VeyronSuperSprt View Post
By the look of it, once this trend catches on, and it will, the next gen would look at folks quoting cc numbers as museum pieces.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jetti View Post
While the calculation may look complicated, its just basic physics and in fact makes things very simple. No longer will someone need to look at BHP, Weight, 0-100 times.
Higher TFSI number means greater "pushed to the seat" feeling
Quote:
Originally Posted by STORM_REGALION View Post
Engine size has not much relevance today since we have Turbocharged and Supercharged engines now.

Labeling a car on its performance is a better approach.
Quote:
Originally Posted by VeyronSuperSprt View Post

3. New technologies, such as turbochargers, hybrids etc permit cars that have the same or even smaller displacement to produce higher maximum output and torque and this means that an engineís displacement has stopped being as useful as it once was or even logical enough to accurately evaluate a carís performance.
I agree.

This is THE smartest way to prepare masses, for engine down-sizing.

Who will buy an expensive car with a small engine? At the same time; if new technology can help achieve high performance output from a small engine, then why not? New badging will help change people mind-set.
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Old 30th July 2015, 11:08   #29
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Default Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

This is palatable for someone who is technically inclined but , for someone who is not ? It is absolutely killing. Imagine having to go through so much calculation just to understand the variant you are supposed to be buying and then apart from that the loan the insurance and the other financial calculations.

Only Z Germans could have gone through and come up with such a method to just badge their cars.
To be honest in this case I just prefer the Italian way. "Audi A3 #1 here , Audi A3 #2 here,here is okay!" greater the number greater everything
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Old 30th July 2015, 11:30   #30
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Default Re: Audi's "Dynamic Badging" - Based on performance, rather than displacement

Here is what mod moralfibre mentioned in the Audi A3 Team-BHP Official Review:

Quote:
Originally Posted by moralfibre View Post
Audi has done away with conventional badges that indicate the engine's size. The badging now has a number (in multiples of 5) that denotes the 'performance factor' of the model. The faster the car, the higher this number. For instance, the A3 petrol is badged 40TFSI as its 0 - 100 time of 7.3 seconds is quicker than the diesel (8.6 seconds):
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