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Old 22nd September 2015, 21:57   #166
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

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Originally Posted by pgsagar View Post
It is a good move by Maruti but then how many of us in India care for environment?
No one does.

Which is exactly why it is a brilliant move that the SHVS replaces the regular diesel model and is cheaper than the earlier diesel variants and more fuel efficient on paper as well!
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Old 22nd September 2015, 22:00   #167
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

If the SHVS works like this -
Quote:
Idle engine start-stop: The idle engine start-stop function turns off the engine automatically when the car is idling. But for it to work, the car needs to come to a standstill, and you have to shift into neutral gear and take your left foot off the clutch. The engine restarts as soon as you press the clutch.
What happens to the "Turbo needs idling before turning off" theory?
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Old 22nd September 2015, 22:14   #168
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

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Originally Posted by pgsagar View Post
I remember Civic had a hybrid which did not take off. Prius did not succeed either, in India.
Civic Hybrid was too expensive to afford. It was sold like hot cakes when they reduced price to 13 lacs as far as I remember. Prius is again a very expensive sedan to buy. Even Mahindra E2O is too expensive for a tiny hatchback.
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Old 22nd September 2015, 22:52   #169
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

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Originally Posted by PatchyBoy View Post
...
What happens to the "Turbo needs idling before turning off" theory?
These things (hybrid systems) are supposed to work fine in city. Do we actually drive in the turbo zone at city speeds?

Turbo idling is suggested considering that one drives in the turbo zone for extended periods & is then allowed to cool down. This is more to do in highways.

In city, this technology can not be harmful to the turbo.

Last edited by swiftnfurious : 22nd September 2015 at 22:55.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 15:27   #170
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Unhappy Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

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Originally Posted by ptaneja View Post
In above article, they got 16 kmpl average...it is quite a drop from ARAI figures of 28!!
I was expecting atleast 20/21 in traffic, and around 25 in highway....maybe I am just too optimistic!!
Yes, it is very surprising. Could 16 be a typo? It could be since there is not mention of a shock accompanying the average figure in the article.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 19:12   #171
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

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Originally Posted by multiloop View Post
Yes, it is very surprising. Could 16 be a typo? It could be since there is not mention of a shock accompanying the average figure in the article.

Exactly ! On the other hand, while I was waiting for Test Drive, came across couple of Ciaz which just underwent servicing, and were in the washing line at service centre, and both of them showed 22 & 20 as mileage figures in MID.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 19:26   #172
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

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Originally Posted by ptaneja View Post
Exactly ! On the other hand, while I was waiting for Test Drive, came across couple of Ciaz which just underwent servicing, and were in the washing line at service centre, and both of them showed 22 & 20 as mileage figures in MID.
Guess the reviewers gunned the accelerator pedal to test the performance before arriving at that FE figure. But still 16kmpl in the city is respectable if thats the true FE and not the one displayed on the MID. Agreed that its a far deviation from the ARAI figure but the fact is that the testing method can nowhere relate to real life driving conditions. It can only be used as a relative figure from car to car.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 19:33   #173
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

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Originally Posted by audioholic View Post
Guess the reviewers gunned the accelerator pedal to test the performance before arriving at that FE figure. But still 16kmpl in the city is respectable if thats the true FE and not the one displayed on the MID. Agreed that its a far deviation from the ARAI figure but the fact is that the testing method can nowhere relate to real life driving conditions. It can only be used as a relative figure from car to car.
If we go with the % drop from ARAI, in this case Petrol models which have a figure of 20, would give approx 12/13 ? With the mileage of 12/13, its no better than my SX4
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Old 23rd September 2015, 21:07   #174
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

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Originally Posted by ptaneja View Post
If we go with the % drop from ARAI, in this case Petrol models which have a figure of 20, would give approx 12/13 ? With the mileage of 12/13, its no better than my SX4
Suppose ARAI rating of Ciaz D is 28kmpl and it delivers 16kmpl when driven in such a condition, it is 57.14% of the rating. Now the ARAI rating of my version of SX4 was 15kmpl. So in similar driving conditions, it will give 8.57kmpl, which is what I get if the car is driven with a heavy foot in traffic. Seems justifiable no?
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Old 23rd September 2015, 22:59   #175
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

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Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
These things (hybrid systems) are supposed to work fine in city. Do we actually drive in the turbo zone at city speeds?

Turbo idling is suggested considering that one drives in the turbo zone for extended periods & is then allowed to cool down. This is more to do in highways.

In city, this technology can not be harmful to the turbo.
What happens when you come to a set of signals or a toll booth after a spirited highway drive, stop, engage neutral and release clutch?
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Old 23rd September 2015, 23:12   #176
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

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Originally Posted by PatchyBoy View Post
What happens when you come to a set of signals or a toll booth after a spirited highway drive, stop, engage neutral and release clutch?
I do not think we have to get so bothered about the turbo and idling thing. 95% of people who drive turbos don't even know such a thing. So if we were to give so much of importance to this, we should have seen a lot of premature turbo failures. I, for one, have never followed this idling rule in my car and my car is going strong even after 1.2L kms. My other car has this Auto Start/Stop system and it works perfectly fine. Nowhere have they mentioned in the instruction manual that I have to idle the car before turning off the engine.

All manufacturers these days are coming up with small capacity, high output engines and turbos have become an integral part of an engine. Much money would have been put in to this research so that it can be used safely by the mango man (95% who do not know about the idling rule) before they introduced it in the market.

So relax and enjoy the mileage you get. You should be good...
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Old 24th September 2015, 00:18   #177
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

I doubt ARAI ratings are a direct reflection of the city FE. It's more of a combination of city + highway FE.

In city, you'll definitely get lesser FE, and the change can be massive depending on the traffic conditions. On highway, if you drive neat, you can actually get better FE than ARAI rating as well. Again depends on lots of parameters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PatchyBoy View Post
What happens when you come to a set of signals or a toll booth after a spirited highway drive, stop, engage neutral and release clutch?
You wouldn't come to a dead stop from high speeds right?? You will slow down and that will ensure the turbo cooling before the hybrid system kicks in. If you want to be doubly sure, keep the clutch buried, so that the system doesn't kick in. But then, we are being too finicky.

Last edited by swiftnfurious : 24th September 2015 at 00:23.
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Old 24th September 2015, 11:20   #178
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post


You wouldn't come to a dead stop from high speeds right?? You will slow down and that will ensure the turbo cooling before the hybrid system kicks in. If you want to be doubly sure, keep the clutch buried, so that the system doesn't kick in. But then, we are being too finicky.
Well you may. Think about the tolls on the express type of highways. You come to a sudden stop from 80+ speeds.
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Old 24th September 2015, 13:09   #179
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

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Originally Posted by TaurusAl View Post
Well you may. Think about the tolls on the express type of highways. You come to a sudden stop from 80+ speeds.
I haven't come across a toll without a speed breaker, in my life, especially on highways. I usually crawl for at least 100m in first gear before I reach the toll cabin for payment.

Unless you are the kind who jumps over the potholes @ 80 kmph & who screeches to a dead halt at the last moment, it should not be a concern. And in such cases, pressing the clutch will do the trick. It's detailed that unless the car comes to a dead stop and the clutch is not used, the hybrid system will not activate.
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Old 24th September 2015, 13:51   #180
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz SHVS with Integrated Starter Generator & idling start / stop system. EDIT: Now launc

Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
I haven't come across a toll without a speed breaker, in my life, especially on highways. I usually crawl for at least 100m in first gear before I reach the toll cabin for payment.

Unless you are the kind who jumps over the potholes @ 80 kmph & who screeches to a dead halt at the last moment, it should not be a concern. And in such cases, pressing the clutch will do the trick. It's detailed that unless the car comes to a dead stop and the clutch is not used, the hybrid system will not activate.
Dear Sir, No I am not a kind of person who rides speed breakers at 80 and brakes hard at the last moment. We don't leave a single chance to be sarcastic don't we ?

I drive once a month Mumbai to Goa and the toll roads on NH4 are prone to traffic snarls even much before the speed beakers. So I am talking through my experience. Also, some people (including me) like to apply the engine brakes where the RPMs are raised before stopping.

Being a Diesel car driver, I always have to wait for a minute to turn of my engine but by the time I try to, the traffic moves ahead. In this hybrid story the car will get turned off by itself without the idling.

And going by your theory, I don't get it why car makers say you have to idle car for a minute. I don't know anyone who brakes hard at 80 kmph and instantly turns his engine off. Brad Pitt in some movie, maybe
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