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Old 23rd August 2015, 10:27   #106
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Default Re: Assam bans sale of Alto, Swift, i10, Eon, Jazz and several other small cars

While rooting for safety, I think if states decide to do their own things we are heading for chaos. As it is Gujarat has been insisting on yellow stickers on Headlamps, now this, and so on ...
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Old 23rd August 2015, 15:22   #107
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@sgiitk and others - this is ban on sale of specific type of cars in state. What about cars from outside the state driving in? So I can register an Alto in Siliguri and drive in Assam? Would that not vitiate the intention? Yes such things should not be done at state level and especially when there is all India body for approval of vehicles
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Old 23rd August 2015, 15:32   #108
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Default Re: Assam bans sale of Alto, Swift, i10, Eon, Jazz and several other small cars

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@sgiitk and others - this is ban on sale of specific type of cars in state. What about cars from outside the state driving in? So I can register an Alto in Siliguri and drive in Assam? Would that not vitiate the intention? Yes such things should not be done at state level and especially when there is all India body for approval of vehicles
Well, we live in a country where we pay different taxes for the same car in different states. Even things like how long an 'out of state' car can stay safely without being fined life-time taxes is different across states. So, why should these safety regulations alone be consistent?

As long as the end consumer is screwed, its all fine. But, when big business suffers a setback, it is time to set uniform rules?
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Old 23rd August 2015, 15:40   #109
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Default Re: Assam bans sale of Alto, Swift, i10, Eon, Jazz and several other small cars

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What about cars from outside the state driving in? Yes such things should not be done at state level and especially when there is all India body for approval of vehicles
Absolutely!!! Couldn't agree more with you sir. As you have very aptly remarked, the immediate fallout of this very endeavour of Assam Govt will be that from the near future onwards, the local populace would start looking out for the ways to register their cars outside the state.

Hence, it's high time that the RTO's (Regional Transport Offices) are done away with and the entire geographical area of the country is brought under sole central transport office, managed by the central government. Implementation of highest level of safety standards is imperative and it can be better done when there is a single central monitoring authority.
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Old 23rd August 2015, 18:04   #110
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Default Re: Assam bans sale of Alto, Swift, i10, Eon, Jazz and several other small cars

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All this talk because you want courts to make laws? Because you don't believe in our democratic process so you would rather have a dictatorial government?
If you spent time and read as to what I wrote, you would realise that my objection is not on the ruling, but on the matter that courts can't and shouldn't frame laws thereby undermining the democratic process. If they do so, then every khap can legally frame laws..
Now you're equating the courts with Khap ??? Seriously???
I don't even want to refute your "out of the world" statements anymore. Good luck.
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Old 23rd August 2015, 20:27   #111
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Default Re: Assam bans sale of Alto, Swift, i10, Eon, Jazz and several other small cars

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Now you're equating the courts with Khap ??? Seriously???
I don't even want to refute your "out of the world" statements anymore. Good luck.
As far as I know I was not replying to your statement. Also this is a forum and different people will have different view points. I am sure it's not that hard to understand. Thanks
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Old 24th August 2015, 05:59   #112
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Default Re: Assam bans sale of Alto, Swift, i10, Eon, Jazz and several other small cars

Gentlemen, why so much hoopla against the Court Order? It is not even a final pronouncement by the said Court. A mere Order at that. And it is, as a result of a public interest litigation, which was filed due to total inaction on the part of Government and car makers since one and a half decades. This much time, is too much of a democracy.

The base variant of any car from any maker in this country, from now onward, should be crash tested and consisting of ABS and airbags. Engine start-stop button and air cooled glove boxes should be the luxuries.
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Old 24th August 2015, 14:57   #113
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Default Re: Assam bans sale of Alto, Swift, i10, Eon, Jazz and several other small cars

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And it is easy to blame the manufacturers for lack of safety features. Ask yourself, are you willing to pay a lac more per any model for all safety bells and whistles? There is a reason why manufacturers are making models with bling bling lights, alloy wheels and fancy gizmos instead of abs/ebd or airbags, the gizmos sell.
Well, if you ask me, I would rather pay a lakh more on safety features than the other fancy features. Because I care for my and my family's safety more than anything. Spending 6 lakhs on a safe car is anyday better than spending 5 lakhs on an unsafe one.

I hope some day all car buyers first ask the question "Kitni safe hai?" before the usual "Kitna deti hai?".
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Old 24th August 2015, 15:15   #114
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Thumbs down Re: Assam bans sale of Alto, Swift, i10, Eon, Jazz and several other small cars

Could someone "in the know" let us know the REAL reason why this order was passed? I am very sure SAFETY has nothing to do with it.

If you think the judge was concerned about safety, you are being very, very naive. So why didn't he ban badly designed roads, stupid policemen, ...

I saw some mention of quadricycles in the document - there has been a lot of controversy over allowing these into the market (because they would cut into the sales of cars; safety was used as an excuse to trip up their entry into the market).

The less you know about the Judiciary, the better. I wish they'd pack up and their 'activism' and go back to good Ol' Blighty. They've done little to improve anything in the judicial system in India. Don't take their 'commands' to the officials and politicians as proof of their sincerity. They are just part of the cosy club of the babus, politicians and the rest. [End rant ]

I am not sure the HC can ban a central govt approved car, but the HC can cause a lot of issues for people trying to get quadricycles registered, enough to put a serious financial dent on those buyers and sellers. The economic damage thus caused cannot be reversed - both the buyer and seller will never contemplate suing the parties for such a rule/law/whatever. The SC or other body will overturn this but the mischief makers will go scot free.
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Old 24th August 2015, 15:22   #115
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Default Re: Assam bans sale of Alto, Swift, i10, Eon, Jazz and several other small cars

Remember the Hon Justices are almost with an Arts + Law background, so their tech expertise is near zilch. Often they have to rely on what they hear or are told.
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Old 24th August 2015, 16:14   #116
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Default Re: Assam bans sale of Alto, Swift, i10, Eon, Jazz and several other small cars

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Remember the Hon Justices are almost with an Arts + Law background, so their tech expertise is near zilch. Often they have to rely on what they hear or are told.
You are completely right sir, the NCAP crash test results has now become the popular opinion now, and hence giving a verdict in those lines is the most logical and acceptable one for majority of the car buyers.
Now the court verdict has come out, now who should take further action? Since without any laws passed at the centre, no car manufacturer would need to take any action apart from those that boost their sales (such as, Onam specials).
Now that wouldn't happen because of a state high court verdict, probably Assam Govt can issue an order to sell such "unsafe" vehicles with a Statutory warning printed on the dashboard (at least?): "You are riding an unsafe vehicle. Drive carefully". This is the kind of solution we have already been able to come up to address the issue of increasing majority of population falling prey to liquor and cigarettes.
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Old 24th August 2015, 19:20   #117
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Default Re: Assam bans sale of Alto, Swift, i10, Eon, Jazz and several other small cars

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Originally Posted by vivek0418 View Post
Well, if you ask me, I would rather pay a lakh more on safety features than the other fancy features. Because I care for my and my family's safety more than anything. Spending 6 lakhs on a safe car is anyday better than spending 5 lakhs on an unsafe one.

I hope some day all car buyers first ask the question "Kitni safe hai?" before the usual "Kitna deti hai?".
Good thinking. Even I think alike. But unfortunately a majority of Indians don't consider safety as being primary else they wouldn't be driving along like retards not even using seatbelts or helmets. If indians had voted for safety features through their wallet, the sales figures would reflect so and manufacturers would rather provide for abs or airbags in place of bullbars and led lights!!

I personally want the government to come out with strict norms for car makers which includes crash testing all models and mandated safety features. However I don't want a high court judge passing arbitrary orders sanctioning/banning vehicles based on certain criteria, he is doing the governments job, which is scary.
His order smells of vested interest, why target vehicles below certain weight only? Does the ambassador he use very crash worthy? Are all vehicles above that weight automatically safe? Who has filed the PIL? What is the background of the appealing party? Has the court appointed professionals to research on all the cars he just banned?
As some claim if he is merely stating a fact in a directive, I am alarmed at what new directives he can give in the coming months based on fishy PIL? A double vision tax for people with spectacles may be!!!

Last edited by apachelongbow : 24th August 2015 at 19:28.
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Old 24th August 2015, 19:40   #118
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Default Re: Assam bans sale of Alto, Swift, i10, Eon, Jazz and several other small cars

Knowing people who file PILs, several of them are the "activist" sort - who keep filing one PIL after the other. Generally full of enthusiasm, and some of them even become self taught experts in their field (though for most, wikipedia or other social media remains their single source of information rather than any specific expertiese)

One such man who is a regular in the chennai courts, and of interest to TBHP for a lot of the work he has done, is one "Traffic Ramaswamy". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traffic_Ramaswamy
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Old 24th August 2015, 19:53   #119
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Default Re: Assam bans sale of Alto, Swift, i10, Eon, Jazz and several other small cars

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Could someone "in the know" let us know the REAL reason why this order was passed? I am very sure SAFETY has nothing to do with it.
Since you are VERY SURE that safety had nothing to do with this order, and are implying that there is another REAL reason for this order, do you mind elaborating on what is the real reason that you suspect?

If you read the order, the PIL asks the state to enforce the Motor Vehicle's Act amongst other things. The judge is only asking the central government to follow the law that was already drafted in 1988.

I simply cannot fathom why members of an automotive forum such as Team BHP are implying that there is more to this order than meets the eye.

I can understand these remarks from the automotive companies since they are busy designing Onam editions with snazzy stickers rather than upgrading the safety of the vehicles they sell in India, but why would a consumer not want a safer vehicle?
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Old 24th August 2015, 20:09   #120
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Post Re: Assam bans sale of Alto, Swift, i10, Eon, Jazz and several other small cars

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Originally Posted by hserus View Post
Knowing people who file PILs, several of them are the "activist" sort - who keep filing one PIL after the other. Generally full of enthusiasm, and some of them even become self taught experts in their field (though for most, wikipedia or other social media remains their single source of information rather than any specific expertiese)

One such man who is a regular in the chennai courts, and of interest to TBHP for a lot of the work he has done, is one "Traffic Ramaswamy". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traffic_Ramaswamy
Interesting! Atleast this persons heart seems to be in the right place. Unfortunately lot of PIL are filed by NGO or people with vested interests, competitors etc whose sole aim is to cause drag for others. I am not saying that is the case in the current discussion, may be the PIL holder genuinely wants to have safe cars.
IMO it would have been a spectacular decision had the court directed the central government to redraft the vehicle registration policy to include crash testing, NCAP norms and also set a deadline for the same, instead of an ambiguously worded directive which asks for all vehicles below a certain weight only to be sold after being crash tested.

On a related note, when will a directive be passed asking the licensing procedure to be cleaned up? When will a directive be asked asking police not to be corrupt? Making roads of good quality, not permitting rattle traps on roads? Never I guess. Too much money to be made...
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