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Old 23rd November 2015, 18:59   #1531
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Default Re: Next-gen Suzuki Baleno (YRA) unveiled. EDIT: Now launched at Rs. 4.99 lakhs

All said and done, this is bad PR for Maruti and the Baleno. Irrespective of how it happened, what was involved, who was at fault and whether the images seen are a result of just the accident or the car being cut apart for extraction of the victims, the end result is that these are the images out there available for all to see. Most people are not going to look too deep and it will definitely play in a prospective buyers mind. Probably in the circumstances any car would have ended up like this, but that is an assumption while this is a real situation.

So as a buyer, if this troubles you, you should not buy this car. If looking at all facts, your conclusion is that it could/ would have happened irrespective of which car it was, then there is nothing to worry.
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Old 23rd November 2015, 19:17   #1532
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Default Re: Next-gen Suzuki Baleno (YRA) unveiled. EDIT: Now launched at Rs. 4.99 lakhs

I know lots has been discussed about the built quality about the car and these horrendous accident pics have not helped matters either. Could we expect some light on this in the official Team-bhp reviews. Surely I don't want the team to crash test it.

But are there really other ways to check for a layman than merely pressing hard on various body panels? Or just blindly believe that the so called high tensile steel being marketed by Maruti Suzuki is good enough. I know its the crumple zone which matters more, but having light weight doors and easily retractable on pressure body panels are surely not confidence inspiring in any sense.

In other news, having seen many Ray blue colored Balenos on road and almost all other colors too, I think silver and dark grey look much better in real than the blue which is generating lots of demand. Maybe just my personal preference.
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Old 23rd November 2015, 19:32   #1533
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Default Re: Next-gen Suzuki Baleno (YRA) unveiled. EDIT: Now launched at Rs. 4.99 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rajeevraj View Post
So as a buyer, if this troubles you, you should not buy this car. If looking at all facts, your conclusion is that it could/ would have happened irrespective of which car it was, then there is nothing to worry.
It comes down to psychology.
Every time you think about Baleno, if this image crops up in your mind, then there is no fun in owning one, and it may not be possible to drive it peacefully, with scary thoughts cropping now and then inside the head.
Without having any technologies such as ABS, airbags, or without any latest advances in structural strength, crumple zones, our last generation lived a life of luxury in their dream cars such as Maruti 800s and Fiats.
Swifts sell a lot even after scoring 0 in NCAP tests - this actually is a result of a methodical test conducted to assess the standard safety of a car, instead of visually inspecting a photo of the car, without knowing much details of what exactly was done to the car (as is the case with Baleno).
We shall see in the next coming months how much Baleno gets affected or remains unaffected due to such images surfacing on the internet.
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Old 23rd November 2015, 19:33   #1534
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Default Re: Next-gen Suzuki Baleno (YRA) unveiled. EDIT: Now launched at Rs. 4.99 lakhs

No direct conclusions can be drawn from light (or heavy) weight construction alone. The structural design matters, and so does the behavior of the construction material under varied conditions and loads.

One can die in a heavily built 'tank-like' vehicle of yesteryear at relatively low-speed shunts, while we've all seen racers walk away from lightweight carbon-fiber and composite alloy chassis cars even after 300 kmph shunts with as little as a sore neck. Extreme examples I know, but serves the point.

I won't defend or accuse Maruti of anything (it's all un-provable without proper safety testing anyway), but drawing conclusions about a car's structure just by a physical 'weight' inspection is a pretty pointless exercise, it does nothing except reaffirming preconceived notions.


P.S. If proper test results emerge proving the worth (or lack of it) of the Baleno's structural integrity, I'd be more than happy to have a firm opinion either way. Pointless still, because a 5-star rating elsewhere means nothing in India as 'different builds for different markets' is hardly a secret in the automotive industry.

Last edited by Chetan_Rao : 23rd November 2015 at 19:38.
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Old 23rd November 2015, 21:07   #1535
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Default Re: Next-gen Suzuki Baleno (YRA) unveiled. EDIT: Now launched at Rs. 4.99 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by madhav14 View Post
I regret to say this but -

I was already in a dilemma regarding the safety aspect of the car after reading many discussions and arguments on this thread. Now, I'm totally shattered after seeing that crash pic of Baleno, and I was in 2nd thoughts as I had booked a white diesel Alpha variant. Unfortunately, my parents also happened to see the same and just now we had a long, heated discussion on buying an alternative one (read - i20 elite).

Somehow, I'm getting a feeling that i20 may be a far safer car than Baleno, given the both cars face a same situation.

This is just my opinion. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Quote:
Originally Posted by volkman10 View Post
Never buy a car with the mindset of it being unsafe. Suggest you buy the Elite.

No one can answer your question on which car would be safer unless both are crash tested, all the rest will be mere speculations.
Hey Madhav! While many have agreed with what Volkman has to say regarding the topic, I would like to offer some different advice. Firstly as we all know, the details of said accident are not yet out there and in my honest opinion, even a Jazz or an Elite i20 would perform in much the same way (it is my firm belief that all Asian car manufacturers offer serious compromise in terms of safety of their sub 15 lakh products) and if you want any tangible improvement in safety, you would have to look toward cars like the Figo, Polo etc.

If the buying decision is understandably restricted only to the i20 and Baleno as they are both reliable cars backed by an extensive service network and support, I would still recommend the Baleno simply because it drives far better. Hyundai cars and their numb steering has always had me feeling very nervous while piloting them. I find myself making several correctional steering inputs mid-corner that I would never do in any other car. I am never confident taking a Hyundai to its limits simply because of the lack of feedback levels and subsequently control that I have over the car. In comparison, a Baleno would perform far better in high-speed maneuvers and at the end of the day, forget seatbelts, airbags, structural rigidity etc. Being in control of the vehicle, is your primary safety.

Last edited by IshaanIan : 23rd November 2015 at 21:12.
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Old 23rd November 2015, 22:49   #1536
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Default Re: Next-gen Suzuki Baleno (YRA) unveiled. EDIT: Now launched at Rs. 4.99 lakhs

Auto Express UK who tested the 3 cylinder 1 liter petrol Baleno with manual transmission, says the car weighs in at 950kgs.

I have tried hard but its been a struggle to get the specs of the international Baleno from the Suzuki UK or global website.

The Indian Baleno with MT just weighs 865 to 890kgs even with the 4 cylinder engine. 100 kilos is a lot of missing metal!!

There could be other reasons but I have my doubts that Suzuki India are skimping on the structural strength of the Indian market Baleno.

Not that it will stop people from buying them, but I would be interested to Suzuki's official announcement on this matter.
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Old 23rd November 2015, 23:36   #1537
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Default Re: Next-gen Suzuki Baleno (YRA) unveiled. EDIT: Now launched at Rs. 4.99 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by shortbread View Post
Auto Express UK who tested the 3 cylinder 1 liter petrol Baleno with manual transmission, says the car weighs in at 950kgs.

I have tried hard but its been a struggle to get the specs of the international Baleno from the Suzuki UK or global website.

The Indian Baleno with MT just weighs 865 to 890kgs even with the 4 cylinder engine. 100 kilos is a lot of missing metal!!

There could be other reasons but I have my doubts that Suzuki India are skimping on the structural strength of the Indian market Baleno.

Not that it will stop people from buying them, but I would be interested to Suzuki's official announcement on this matter.
The Ecosport Ecoboost( 1.0 L 3 cylinder) is heavier than the 4 cylinder 1.5 L Petrol Ecosport. The turbocharger is the reason for this difference.
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Old 23rd November 2015, 23:48   #1538
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Default Re: Next-gen Suzuki Baleno (YRA) unveiled. EDIT: Now launched at Rs. 4.99 lakhs

Can a Baleno-owning BHPian review the car? Something that can be pitted against the elaborate review on the Jazz. It would really help me decide!

What I can say so far is, Nexa's customer response is pretty bad. I've tried getting in touch with them at 2 different showrooms in Mumbai now and it seems like walking in is the only way to illicit a response since they don't respond to calls and mails. High footfall means staggered attention and a general air of arrogance owing to high demands.

I agree with most on the safety aspect - circumstances of the much-hyped Baleno accident are unknown so let's just leave that out on this post
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Old 23rd November 2015, 23:57   #1539
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SRK View Post

I think these lights get turned on while reversing but not sure. Even I noticed them after checking out the pics online. Will inquire when I go to NEXA showroom next time.

And Yes, I have booked a Baleno Alpha Petrol in Pearl Arctic White
Firstly, Congratulations for booking a new Baleno. Btw, what is the expected waiting period quoted by NEXA dealership ?

Secondly, the difference in tail-lamp design is there & is highlighted by various automotive websites too. The difference is between Top end variant of Baleno(Alpha, i guess) & rest of the variants and basically that white element is a rear fog lamp strip in top end alpha variant while the rest of the variants doesn't have this feature, so those variant carries simpler inverted Red element-U tail-lamp design.


Quote:
Originally Posted by WRXXX View Post
Now I really begin to wonder, is there anywhere in official documents it is mentioned that it is K12M VVT engine? Especially after seeing that massive feeder into the intake system. Anyone please? Does the Baleno manual say this is a K12M engine?
Lol(no offense meant, please).
Engine shape does determine something & it is immediately recognizable once you lift up its bonnet.
Maruti Suzuki has only two localized 1.2 litre petrol engines in their Indian lineup, one is 1.2 K-Series VVT Petrol doing duty in Swift, Swift Dzire & another one is 1.2 litre G-series engine which powers EECO petrol, it is basically a scaled down 1.3 litre G-Series petrol engine from Esteem& Gypsy King.
Obviously, Baleno's petrol engine must belongs to K-series engine family shared with Swift range.
I'm sure a Test Drive or Live demo comparison should tell it more clearly than words about this fact.
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Old 24th November 2015, 00:04   #1540
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Default Re: Next-gen Suzuki Baleno (YRA) unveiled. EDIT: Now launched at Rs. 4.99 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whichcarnow View Post
The Ecosport Ecoboost( 1.0 L 3 cylinder) is heavier than the 4 cylinder 1.5 L Petrol Ecosport. The turbocharger is the reason for this difference.
Are you kidding me, the weight difference between the ecoboost and the regular petrol is only 20 kilos. What is suzuki's turbo made of...GRANITE?!

Moreover Suzuki's statement for the boosterjet engine at Geneva was..

Quote:
....fuel efficiency has been improved by reducing engine displacement, and output and torque are boosted with a turbocharger. In addition to fulfilling fuel efficiency and dynamic performace expectations, the layout has been optimised and various technologies used to reduce weight......
My question stays, why is the India Baleno lighter by more than 100KGS?!
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Old 24th November 2015, 00:28   #1541
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Default Re: Next-gen Suzuki Baleno (YRA) unveiled. EDIT: Now launched at Rs. 4.99 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by shortbread View Post
My question stays, why is the India Baleno lighter by more than 100KGS?!
Your question is a non starter. 950 vs 865-890 is no way = 100kgs.

We also do not know what is the variant that was tested. So wait until it happens and then it can be discussed all along.
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Old 24th November 2015, 02:19   #1542
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Originally Posted by hybridpetrol View Post
The car is mangled beyond recognition like a crushed water bottle!
Unfortunate for Maruti, that the photos of such crushed car surfaces. Honestly, the car doesn't look like it suffered an accident, but looks like it was crushed on purpose by some heavy industrial equipment.
In India, we love speed over safety. Be it a humble Nano or a Land rover, I see the same driving behaviour - i.e push the vehicle to its limits, and try to overtake the vehicles in front, even though if the vehicle in front is already speeding at 120 kmph, without bothering about the speed of oncoming traffic.
To those who see these pictures of a crushed Baleno, and say Baleno is structurally unsafe, I want to ask, whether any other hatchback on sale would have faced a similar accident (if at all we know the exact details) and still retained the shape.
The prime reason for such unfortunate events are not the cars we drive, but the way we drive our cars, whether it is Omni or Audi.

Excatly my point, people here are commenting on the structural integrity of the Baleno by looking at this picture. I wonder if any car would have been in a similar accident, would it retain its shape ??
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Old 24th November 2015, 03:17   #1543
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Default Re: Next-gen Suzuki Baleno (YRA) unveiled. EDIT: Now launched at Rs. 4.99 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by shortbread View Post
Are you kidding me, the weight difference between the ecoboost and the regular petrol is only 20 kilos. What is suzuki's turbo made of...GRANITE?!

Moreover Suzuki's statement for the boosterjet engine at Geneva was..



My question stays, why is the India Baleno lighter by more than 100KGS?!
Let me simplify it for you.

950-865= 85 kg

Variant tested is top variant so actual weight difference
950-890= 60 kg

1.0 L turbocharged Engine- 1.5 L Engine= 22kg

now a 1.2 L engine will weigh less than a 1.5 L Engine

Hence, 1.0 L turocharged Engine- 1.2 L Engine can be 60 kgs

So I don't see any problem here. That being said, whatever the weights, we can't say if the Indian version is as safe as the European one or actually exactly how safe the European car itself is as of now.

Last edited by Whichcarnow : 24th November 2015 at 03:20.
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Old 24th November 2015, 05:21   #1544
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whichcarnow View Post
Let me simplify it for you.

950-865= 85 kg

Variant tested is top variant so actual weight difference
950-890= 60 kg

1.0 L turbocharged Engine- 1.5 L Engine= 22kg

now a 1.2 L engine will weigh less than a 1.5 L Engine

Hence, 1.0 L turocharged Engine- 1.2 L Engine can be 60 kgs
Actually add to this side air bags and SHVS which will usually house a large battery or additional li-ion than normal?
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Old 24th November 2015, 09:26   #1545
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Default Re: Next-gen Suzuki Baleno (YRA) unveiled. EDIT: Now launched at Rs. 4.99 lakhs

While coming to office this morning noticed a Baleno in IRVM. It was not an Alpha variant as tha headlights were simple. To be very fair, the headlights reminded me too much of a Swift, without a doubt, only smaller.

This car can also be sold as Swift+ or something and perhaps, not many will cry hoarse.

I let him overtake to check out the rear and I did not like it. The tailgate is too small, narrow and too high. Heck, even the rear bumper is sitting un-naturally higher.

Looked weird, no offense to any owners, that's my first impression of the car after seeing in flesh.
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