Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > The Indian Car Scene


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 4th August 2008, 14:42   #241
BHPian
 
indivic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Chennai
Posts: 753
Thanked: 90 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
News is that the 1.2 features VVT, so perhaps you are right. I hope the 1.4 is the 100 bhp motor from the Indigo XL.
Steer, I heard that the 1.2 and 1.4 are from the same family in FIAT's family of engines, and I think FIAT would consider it beneath themselves to use a Tata engine in their Linea, since that would not reflect their lineage (pun intended).

But I heard that the 1.4 in Indigo XL was really good, I hope Tata can find a use for it in the X1 sedan
indivic is offline  
Old 4th August 2008, 14:50   #242
BHPian
 
indivic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Chennai
Posts: 753
Thanked: 90 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by deepakhon View Post
Any specs of the 1.2 and 1.4 petrol engines? 8v or 16v? sohc or dohc? what are the max power and torque ratings at what rpms?

Is Indica v3 slated to get 75 bhp 1.3 JTD or the VGT one?
Hoping that @paddy77 would have some, but I Googled and found that the 1242cc Super FIRE with DOHC and VVT could make upto 86 horses at 6k RPM and generate 11.4 Kg/m at 3k rpm. It was toned down to 80 horses at 5K rpm to meet EU norms.

Unfortunately this engine series is about 10 years old already, so I am wondering if Fiat-Tata can upgrade them to meet Bharat Stage IV and V norms
indivic is offline  
Old 4th August 2008, 15:07   #243
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,430
Thanked: 32 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by indivic View Post
I Googled and found that the 1242cc Super FIRE with DOHC and VVT could make upto 86 horses at 6k RPM and generate 11.4 Kg/m at 3k rpm. It was toned down to 80 horses at 5K rpm to meet EU norms.

Unfortunately this engine series is about 10 years old already, so I am wondering if Fiat-Tata can upgrade them to meet Bharat Stage IV and V norms
Having 1242cc will not fetch them tax benefits. They will have to get it within 1200cc. I am wondering whether this is an entirely new engine. This does not seem to be there in any country where Fiat is selling its cars.
deepakhon is offline  
Old 4th August 2008, 15:33   #244
BHPian
 
indivic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Chennai
Posts: 753
Thanked: 90 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by deepakhon View Post
Having 1242cc will not fetch them tax benefits. They will have to get it within 1200cc. I am wondering whether this is an entirely new engine. This does not seem to be there in any country where Fiat is selling its cars.
Fully Integrated Robotised Engine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Yes, I guess Tata's own engine from the Xeta can do that for them. I am sure they can tune it to get some more horses.

Now coming to the Super FIRE 1242cc engine, if indeed that's what they are bringing here, it is already 10 years old and is no longer offered in most mainstream markets. It is now more or less replaced by the 1.4 L in various guises.
indivic is offline  
Old 4th August 2008, 15:39   #245
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Faridabad/Delhi
Posts: 1,594
Thanked: 439 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
News is that the 1.2 features VVT
VVT as in Variable Vane Turbo or Variable Valve Timing or both?

It appears the 1.2 underwent various improvements before its introduction in the Grand Punto. Check this:

italiaspeed.com: Fiat Grande Punto

I didn't find any mention of VVT there so may be that's a subsequent development.

Last edited by directinjection : 4th August 2008 at 15:58.
directinjection is offline  
Old 4th August 2008, 15:41   #246
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: N.A
Posts: 6,834
Thanked: 1,503 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by indivic View Post
Steer, I heard that the 1.2 and 1.4 are from the same family in FIAT's family of engines, and I think FIAT would consider it beneath themselves to use a Tata engine in their Linea, since that would not reflect their lineage (pun intended).
We are talking about the Indica V3 here, not a Fiat.

If FIAT were so proud of their lineage they shouldnt have tied up with Tata.
Steeroid is offline  
Old 4th August 2008, 16:29   #247
Senior - BHPian
 
karanraheja's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Coimbatore
Posts: 1,915
Thanked: 233 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tez View Post
was the sedan camouflaged or running open like V3. That would define when can we expect the sedan.
The V3 was not camouflaged obviously cos it was showcased in the Auto Expo 08 . Previous Spy Pics of Sedan by Tushky were camouflaged.
karanraheja is offline  
Old 4th August 2008, 16:46   #248
Senior - BHPian
 
harry10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Faridabad/Delhi
Posts: 2,226
Thanked: 578 Times
Default

Does anyone has any idea about the launch date as i am in the process of buying a new car?
harry10 is offline  
Old 4th August 2008, 16:51   #249
BHPian
 
indivic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Chennai
Posts: 753
Thanked: 90 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
We are talking about the Indica V3 here, not a Fiat.

If FIAT were so proud of their lineage they shouldnt have tied up with Tata.
Sorry, I got it wrong, in the back of my mind I was thinking of the new engine assembly line that the two have set up, I was of the opinion that engines from both companies could not be assembled on the same line - not cost effective ,plus the part about Fiat using a Tata engine.
indivic is offline  
Old 4th August 2008, 17:09   #250
BHPian
 
indivic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Chennai
Posts: 753
Thanked: 90 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by directinjection View Post
VVT as in Variable Vane Turbo or Variable Valve Timing or both?

It appears the 1.2 underwent various improvements before its introduction in the Grand Punto. Check this:

italiaspeed.com: Fiat Grande Punto

I didn't find any mention of VVT there so may be that's a subsequent development.
This website is no doubt from a blogger but I find it good reading

Fiat Punto II

Check the FIRE and Super FIRE
indivic is offline  
Old 4th August 2008, 17:16   #251
BHPian
 
paddy77's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: pune
Posts: 78
Thanked: 0 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tez View Post
was the sedan camouflaged or running open like V3. That would define when can we expect the sedan.
guys hope till now everybody knows that my very close relative (vcr) works in ERC (engg. and research) so all updates about the TML vehicles are absolutely true.

tez buddy its the X1 sedan for sure yes it was wrapped in a black cover (read-masking) with masking tapes on the logo.

@ indivic and deepak here are your specs for indica safire--(mind you no VGT buddy)
Capacity 1,248cc
Number of Cylinders
4 Number of Valves
16 Bore x Stroke
69.6mm x 82mm Maximum Power
75bhp @ 4,000rpm Maximum Torque
190Nm @ 2,000rpm Fuel Distribution
Common rail Air Charging System
Fixed geometry turbo charger with intercooler Emission
BS-III Fuel Injection System
Common rail multi injection @ 1,400 bar Drive Train
DOHC Oil Filter
Green oil filter
guys will get back to you as soon as i get the next update about the engine.no idea about the petrol engines sorry about that.

NOTE TO MODS'-can i use the abbrevation VCR for (very close relative) in my posts hence forth?
paddy77 is offline  
Old 4th August 2008, 17:22   #252
Team-BHP Support
 
Jaggu's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 17,746
Thanked: 7,450 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by paddy77 View Post
NOTE TO MODS'-can i use the abbrevation VCR for (very close relative) in my posts hence forth?
VCR is video cassette recorder according to me! Jokes apart prefer if you could take time to type full or joe's like me will get confused.
Jaggu is online now  
Old 4th August 2008, 17:25   #253
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: N.A
Posts: 6,834
Thanked: 1,503 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by paddy77 View Post
Maximum Torque 190Nm @ 2,000rpm
Are you sure about these figures? 190nm from a 1.2 litre Petrol Engine???? Thats 1.5 litre Common Rail territory - that cannot be right. You're probably quoting 1.3 litre MJD figures as Saffire (which is Petrol) figures.

Last edited by Steeroid : 4th August 2008 at 17:26.
Steeroid is offline  
Old 4th August 2008, 17:25   #254
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,430
Thanked: 32 Times
Default

Thanks for the info paddy77. I am actually interested in the information about 1.2 FIRE and the 1.4 engine (FIRE?).

Is 1.2 FIRE the same as the 1242 cc engine found in Palio with certain tweaks? Or is it a different engine totally?

I am wondering because Tata has the 1.2 engine for Xeta. Why would they opt to go for Fiat's petrol engine? I can understand 1.3 JTD, but 1.2 and 1.4 FIRE will surprise me.
deepakhon is offline  
Old 4th August 2008, 17:27   #255
Senior - BHPian
 
greenhorn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: TN-14
Posts: 6,837
Thanked: 1,315 Times
Default

now that so many fiat engines are going to come in Indica bodies, I think it will be pretty hard for Fiat cars to sell on their build quality alone.
Or will the royalties from the powerplant sales offset the revenue reduction in car sales

PS: what about the gearboxes?
greenhorn is online now  
Closed Thread


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Team-BHP Meet @ Paniely Poru: 21st - 23rd August, 2015 RSUDARSANAN The Team-BHP Meet Section 72 4th December 2015 12:58
Team-BHP meet @ Sharavathi adventure camp - 23rd August 2014 RSUDARSANAN The Team-BHP Meet Section 31 15th October 2014 13:08
Help Required Indica Vista Safire or Indica Vista TDI Logical Hatchbacks 63 30th October 2011 08:57
Indica Vista Official Brochure! EDIT: Vista Now Launched sidindica The Indian Car Scene 233 24th August 2008 18:49


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 02:27.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks