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Old 10th August 2017, 12:29   #691
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Originally Posted by bhp_maniac View Post
It's ironic that India Inc. on one side is trying hard to attract more FDI leveraging on policies like "Make in India" and on the other side pushing in half-baked policies and then turning them upside down stating weird reasons. Can't believe the fact that the price decrease of premium models were overlooked during GST discussions! Completely agree with the sentiments of Benz CEO, how can someone knock at the head quarters door every month seeking change of plans to a potentially strategic market! What consistency and stability of govt. policies can we highlight as an aspiring country!
One more "Covfefe" moment for India. Many more might be in store for us. Sorry for the oneliner mods.
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Old 10th August 2017, 12:35   #692
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Default Re: GST effect on car prices?

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Originally Posted by bhp_maniac View Post
It's ironic that India Inc. on one side is trying hard to attract more FDI...... What consistency and stability of govt. policies can we highlight as an aspiring country!
The list of ironies can be extended to any level:

- Modi wants a bank account for every Indian; the banks cut a fine if people do not maintain minimum balance. (This counteraction can be corrected by issuing a simple order "All SB accounts are hereby declared as zero balance accounts wef today")
- Modi wants every payment via card; the payment gateways cut processing charges for every transaction, that too in percentage. (" CC processing fees are hereby capped at Rs. 5.00 per transaction" )
- Modi wants people to give up LPG subsidies; those few who gave up get double whammies with no subsidies and a far steeper price rise for unsubsidised LPG. ( A 3rd category of "Given Up" pricing should've been implemented)
- Modi wants digital India. But the ISPs are GST'ied at 18% and mobile handsets carry a higher GST than pre-GST VAT (the GST for both these should be rated down to nominal 1-3%)
- Modi wants to energize youth. Dutifully, the GST of sports goods are revised from 3-5% VAT to a mere 18% flat GST.

Let me stop this here before GST (GTO and his Supervising Team) boots me out.

Last edited by sandeepmdas : 10th August 2017 at 12:37.
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Old 10th August 2017, 12:55   #693
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Default Re: GST effect on car prices?

Foreign investors are majorly scared of one thing when it comes to third world countries: sudden and unpredictable policy changes. India keeps giving the world a reminder that we won't get out of the Muhammad-bin-Tughlak style of governance. TeamBHP isn't a political forum so I won't comment on this any further.

I am in the market for a particular SUV as well, and being the auto enthusiast that I am, the extra tax won't stop me from buying it either. It leaves me feeling cheated and stupid though, I could have easily made plans for a purchase this month instead of October and saved a good 3-4L. Well done, Mr. Jaitley.
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Old 10th August 2017, 18:56   #694
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the problem is basically with IAS officers sitting in MoF (ministry of finance), they claim to be financial wizards and know it alls but fact is they have only exhibited very limited skills in economic management. In any crisis

1. Increase taxes
2. Increase income tax.
3. banking reforms .. stealing from poor for frauds comitted by corporates in understanding with bankers
4. introduce new taxes to tame budget deficit.
5. tax automobiles with new and varying taxes.
6. Cut back on PDS, state subsidies and any subsidisation of citizen by state.

anyways you get the picture. Some retired varieties of IAS babus also come on tv programs before budget with pompous droppings on how they would 'manage the situation'.

What the finance ministry needs is technocrats who have hands on experience rather than some self-proclaimed know it all IAS babu proceeding to make a mess of things.
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Old 10th August 2017, 20:39   #695
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Mods please delete this post if you feel that I'm adding more speculation.
While juggling between dealers of Toyota to book Fortuner Pearl White, I'm told that there has been massive increase in bookings over last 2 days due to the GST impact on large or luxury cars in next few weeks. The sales manager tells me that govt might make an announcement with a retrospective tax. Meaning, those who are buying now at lower GST prices might be asked to pay the balance tax after new GST rates are announced. While this might be a fair treatment to all (those who bought Pre GST, GST, Revised GST regime) but it adds to unnecessary speculation. Is this a rumour? Or a real case on table of GST council?
If this is indeed true, what happens to those who bought with price protection guarantee? Will manufacturer pay on behalf of those customers?
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Old 10th August 2017, 23:16   #696
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Default Re: GST effect on car prices?

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The sales manager tells me that govt might make an announcement with a retrospective tax
That cannot happen, I can understand how Dealerships in particular Toyota will be enjoying with this sudden rush. Around 3 weeks, they were having too many inventories and fewer bookings in particularly for Innova and there were small discounts as well ( Post GST) but now appears they will be allocating cars who buy maximum accessories.
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Old 10th August 2017, 23:32   #697
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Default Re: GST effect on car prices?

Quote:
Originally Posted by harishpr View Post
Mods please delete this post if you feel that I'm adding more speculation.
While juggling between dealers of Toyota to book Fortuner Pearl White, I'm told that there has been massive increase in bookings over last 2 days due to the GST impact on large or luxury cars in next few weeks. The sales manager tells me that govt might make an announcement with a retrospective tax. Meaning, those who are buying now at lower GST prices might be asked to pay the balance tax after new GST rates are announced. While this might be a fair treatment to all (those who bought Pre GST, GST, Revised GST regime) but it adds to unnecessary speculation. Is this a rumour? Or a real case on table of GST council?
If this is indeed true, what happens to those who bought with price protection guarantee? Will manufacturer pay on behalf of those customers?
Looks like Toyota is utilizing the situation here.
They knew it that they are going to get huge sales for Fortuner and Innova in Karnataka post GST, that's why they have priced it way higher than that of other states. This is daylight robbery !

July Sales figures for Fortuner - 3444 & Innova - 9369

Fortuner 2.8 4x4 AT
Delhi ex-showroom price - 29,17,700/-
Bangalore ex-showroom price - 29,98,600/-
Difference is 80,900

Innova Crysta 2.8 ZX AT
Delhi ex-showroom price - 20,07,200/-
Bangalore ex-showroom price - 20,61,800/-
Difference is 54,600

Anti profiteering clause in GST is a joke !
GST - One Nation One Tax

Last edited by LionX : 10th August 2017 at 23:35.
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Old 11th August 2017, 04:48   #698
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Originally Posted by harishpr View Post
The sales manager tells me that govt might make an announcement with a retrospective tax. Meaning, those who are buying now at lower GST prices might be asked to pay the balance tax after new GST rates are announced. ?

This would go entirely against the pronouncement of our prime
Minister on the principle of GST - "GST regime is here, retrospective taxation a thing of the past"

http://zeenews.india.com/business/ne...i_1872047.html

If this kind of retrospective correction is carried out, I can visualise 100s of court cases by consumers. It would amount to almost fraud, offering a product at one price and coming back and charging more after the consumer has made a purchase.
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Old 11th August 2017, 06:31   #699
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Default Re: GST effect on car prices?

It comes down to something as simple as this - we are getting caught up by all the fancy political terms and bureaucratic procedures as explained on television (the mouthpiece of the rulers) over and over again. I'm not a political analyst, nor an enthusiast.. there are those who pride themselves on being one by delving deeper into the affairs of the Lok Sabha, Rajya Sabha etc.

Its all nonsense if you ask me, what I've always asked as a kid when I watched a political debate on television which frankly bored me out of my mind is "why should they make a venue to discuss, debate and wash dirty laundry out in full public view when they should be folding their sleeves and doing the good work of actually doing something useful". In the end all politicians, bureaucrats, IAS, IPS etc were common citizens and still are, no one becomes a god by gaining entry into the establishment.. even the mafia works in the same manner if parallels have to be drawn.

GST is SOOO confusing that even till today no one understands what has gone up and what has come down. Leave alone one nation one tax, there are multiple tax slots even within the same tax structure. It begs me to ask several questions :

1) By increasing taxes on hybrid vehicles does the government indicate that emission/environmental norms aren't a priority at all.. rather the priority is to punish people who might have the additional funds to acquire one vis-a-vis a non-hybrid variant of the same vehicle?

2) If environmental norms aren't a priority what is with the tax benefit differences for sub 1.5L (if I'm not mistaken) and > 1.5L engines with respect to both hybrid and non-hybrid vehicles?

3) What are the taxation rules as of date with regard to <1.2 and > 1.2 engines in small cars?

4) Does the 4m rule apply anymore? Rumors were that they would go away after GST.

5) How does the government propose to lower emissions when they are undecided on how to apply GST to big cars (which are the heavier polluting vehicles of course).

NOT one article is written properly on how GST has affected the life (negatively).. let me copy-paste a few paragraphs written by *popular* media :

Quote:
What changes can one foresee? Prices of some sedans and SUVs, including some large luxury vehicles, that were slashed by about 5-7% to pass on the benefit of lower cess in the initial GST round, will now be rolled back.

Effective rates that dropped from 52-54% before GST to a maximum of 43% (28% GST + 15% cess) will now be back to 53% (28% +25%), if the government implements it
One para says it'll be done, the next immediately puts a question mark "if". *facepalm*

Quote:
An increase in cess will help the government raise revenue to pay compensation to the states for any revenue loss due to GST, finance ministry had said.
Duh, why was GST even needed if they have to dole out compensation to states? Is public benefits the last on everyone's minds?

Quote:
In the pre-GST regime, the effective tax on mid-sized sedans was around 47% and that for SUVs over 55%. “The cap is being raised to enable governments to raise tax rate as and when needed...

“Increase will also not be effected at one go,” the official said, adding that the GST Council will take a final decision on the quantum of the increase.The GST Council had on Saturday empowered the Centre to raise the cess to 25% from 15% for certain types of vehicles.


Not interested in a political debate nor am I hinting at any political figure in particular here.. just another frustrated taxpayer and a helpless citizen watching as the administrators with billions in their pockets have their way. Journalism R.I.P.

Last edited by dark.knight : 11th August 2017 at 06:36.
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Old 11th August 2017, 07:56   #700
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Quick question on Ford ecosport! Even if the GST goes up will prices of Ecosport be same or revised due to strange Suv definitions? I'm keen on picking up the facelift but don't want to rush just because of unclear taxation at this moment of time.

Last edited by hondacity : 11th August 2017 at 07:57.
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Old 11th August 2017, 08:55   #701
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Originally Posted by hondacity View Post
Quick question on Ford ecosport! Even if the GST goes up will prices of Ecosport be same or revised due to strange Suv definitions? I'm keen on picking up the facelift but don't want to rush just because of unclear taxation at this moment of time.

I think the increase that's being mooted is for SUVs and all cars that are above 4m and 1500cc. I don't think the Ecosport is going to be affected by this change.


Also, I read in another article that the Increase in overall taxes may be capped under 50% and not 53% as being reported. Not sure what's the final decision.

Wondering why Auto manufacturers do not officially raise this flip flop in taxes with the government in a strong way.
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Old 11th August 2017, 10:46   #702
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I have gone ahead with my purchase decision in a rush because paying any additional penny as tax is not worth. We are being looted enough through income tax, GST and numerous other ways.
For salaried people, close to 50% goes back to govt as various tax, another 25% as bank fees and bribes. So we end up living 25% of our life anyway. Despite all these, there is a sense of well-being from the fact that we are better than most other unrest middle eastern countries. I thank our military system for that and indirectly the government that supports it. Every time I look at my tax report, I console myself thinking, I paid it to the unselfish military men who protect us.

Make the income tax voluntarily and I can imagine most people singing parses now won't even pay up their taxes. Political inclination is absolutely fine, but don't close eyes and pretend it to be dark. Look at the number of people who have given up their LPG subsidy. Money is money and nobody wants to give up unless they get something of equal value in return. I do not believe India as country will reach that state in near future irrespective of who rules us. It takes a transformation in the mindset of a generation and new leaders from that purified generation can bring the difference we all aspire for. That is what many parts of Europe has been through over the past 3000 years. When India had the most sophisticated civilization, most of Europe had only tribes literally living through blood bath.

Has any nation ever progressed and come to forefront or better livable by increasing taxes
Good governance come from the ability to spend prudently than collecting rigorously.
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Old 21st August 2017, 18:18   #703
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Default Re: GST effect on car prices?

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The government is set to promulgate an ordinance within weeks, allowing an increase in goods and services tax (GST) cess on luxury cars and SUVs, as it seeks to restore tax revenue from the automobile industry that unintentionally got affected in the transition to the new indirect tax regime
New Car buyers - Need to rush your purchase decision now before these incompetent fools loot us even more.

http://www.livemint.com/Industry/3SC...ordinance.html
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Old 23rd August 2017, 07:21   #704
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Guys those in market for an SUV or luxury car or are waiting delivery should hurry up.

Ordinance to increase cess from 15% to 25% on large cars and SUVs is lined up in today's Cabinet agenda.

Quote:
The Cabinet is likely to consider on Wednesday an ordinance to increase the cess on mid-size and large cars and sports utility vehicles to 25% from 15% under the goods and services tax (GST) regime.
Would suggest if your car has reached dealership complete the formalities, release payments etc and get it invoiced immediately. Registration can happen later. Though it is still not clear when it will be implemented, why take chances.

Quote:
The amendment would be in place before the next meeting of the GST Council, a government official said. But the council will decide when to change the cess and by how much.
Economic Times
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Old 23rd August 2017, 10:14   #705
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These "corrective steps" being taken by the government are just killing the buying experience. Knowing how the salaried class gets used to the very "taxing" earning experience, I guess we will simply get used to this "taxing" one too. Not knowing how to also add value to the thread, I am just voicing my frustration!
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