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Old 15th January 2016, 11:51   #16
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Default Re: Diesel SUV ban - Mahindra to refund booking amounts in Delhi

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Originally Posted by tanwaramit View Post
And Mahindra has downsized the engine to meet the ban requirements.



http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...w/50583739.cms
In my opinion, it would be too early to comment on quality & reliability of the downsized engine. Excerpts from the same article:

Quote:
The company has done the work quite fast as industry experts say it takes time to develop an engine or even downsize one. "Generally, engine downsizing takes about two years to redesign and develop the parts and for engine calibration. Complexity depends on what is being changed to downsize the engine," said IV Rao, former R&D head at Maruti Suzuki. "It takes a lot of changes in the components of the engine, and major changes are required in pistons and cylinder block," another executive, who works at a company that specialises in redesigning and developing engines, said on the condition of anonymity.
IMO M&M is fastest & steadiest improving auto major, but would suggest beta testers/ guinea pigs/ not those faint hearted type (sorry for this one ) to add on their experiences before middle class takes a plunge.

Even the XUV500 V2 is a step ahead from original one in terms of quality & ownership experience.
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Old 15th January 2016, 11:58   #17
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Default Re: Diesel SUV ban - Mahindra to refund booking amounts in Delhi

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Whats the point of ruling when manufacturer & customers both are ready to pick holes & keep the status of environment etc as before ?
+1

Also dummy plastic "Stone Guard" to show less ground clearance for lower excise duty in XUV.

http://www.team-bhp.com/news/mahindr...e-lower-excise

This is all mockery of rules, contrary to what Anand saying on twitter.
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Old 15th January 2016, 13:00   #18
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Default Re: Diesel SUV ban - Mahindra to refund booking amounts in Delhi

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Whats the point of ruling when manufacturer & customers both are ready to pick holes & keep the status of environment etc as before ?
M&M will again make scapegoats of new buyers who will become test mules for changes & its reliability in real world scenario .
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Originally Posted by ISO View Post
+1

Also dummy plastic "Stone Guard" to show less ground clearance for lower excise duty in XUV.

http://www.team-bhp.com/news/mahindr...e-lower-excise

This is all mockery of rules, contrary to what Anand saying on twitter.
May be you folks are missing the wood for the trees! Think about it. No one has an issue with a genuine effort. Reduction in pollution levels is a crying need. The question is in the approach one takes. Knee jerk reactions don't help. Just because Delhi saw some incidences of rapes in moving cars the esteemed judiciary decided to remove sunfilms altogether from the equation across India. Without taking anything else in the equation. Tomorrow if they realize that rapes are happening behind the closed confines of four walls will they order one road facing glass wall?

Similarly, to reduce pollution, suddenly deciding that personal vehicles can't be registered with diesel engines beyond 2000 CC is an incomplete decision. You do not have a clear target, a plan of action, published milestones, supporting data. You have nothing but you took a Don Quixotesque decision. Does that really help?

A better approach should have been to commission a study that should have reported back to the court after 6 months with a complete picture. You need these pieces of information to take the right decision,

1. What is the current level of pollution in the major cities?
2. What is the acceptable limit by WHO standards?
3. What is acceptable to the Govt by the Indian standards?
4. How do we define the delta for each major city?
5. What is the time period to reach the desired level and hence the major milestones?
6. Who are the major contributors and thus needs to contribute in what proportions to achieve the target?
7. When do we kickoff and how do we notify and enforce the targets for each major milestone with the respective stakeholders?
8. What is the recourse in cases of violations, failures etc?

Without taking a proper project management approach you can never achieve the bigger goals. Only things that will happen are these knee jerk reactions from time to time and then followed by rollbacks as someone else will challenge and prove how useless the measure was.

If your thoughts are that a sudden ban on 2000 CC and above mills (only for personal cars) are a solution I am sorry but its hardly going to achieve much. In the absence of point 6 above tomorrow someone will decide that we need to do more to move forward and one more decision will come out that now you cant register diesel mills beyond 1500 CC for personal vehicles. Business will rue another bad decision. Companies like M&M will lament about how they invested in the recent past on new capabilities for smaller engines of 2000 CC and below and changing rulings so frequently arbitrarily will cause immense harm to the business interests.

Enough said, but I hope you get the picture...

Last edited by Zappo : 15th January 2016 at 13:04.
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Old 15th January 2016, 13:27   #19
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Default Re: Diesel SUV ban - Mahindra to refund booking amounts in Delhi

Are they going to replace the tried and tested 2.2L engine with the 1.9L one or going to provide one more engine options for Scorpio? Anybody has any clue? I am bit worried as I am planning to book a Scorpio in February/March. I like the performance of the 2.2L mHawk
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Old 15th January 2016, 13:34   #20
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Default Re: Diesel SUV ban - Mahindra to refund booking amounts in Delhi

This downsizing and remapping, would it hamper the torquey nature of the mHawk engine that it is known for? or it remains to be seen in actuality?

It will be interesting to see petrol engines in big SUVs and how they drive. I am a sucker for petrol engines, love the way they can rev to the limit.

The ban is a knee jerk reaction by the government and the SC, no doubt. There should have been more study before a decision. However, I personally see it as a step in the right direction. Common man is a soft target and is bound to be affected before the industries and other sources of pollution. Improvisation will take place with time however a start was important. Other metros will follow suit on a mature version of this ruling, is my guess.
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Old 15th January 2016, 14:33   #21
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Default Re: Diesel SUV ban - Mahindra to refund booking amounts in Delhi

I am not aware of any reason as why 2000cc but there must be some rationale behind SC decision for identifying particular CC level ?
There may be things which we never know - how come Mahindra has very timely introduction of new range of petrol engines & has already started testing in ARAI for 1.9 ltr engines - it usually takes months of planning to just approve these kinda changes .
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Old 16th January 2016, 14:06   #22
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Default Re: Diesel SUV ban - Mahindra to refund booking amounts in Delhi

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Are they going to replace the tried and tested 2.2L engine with the 1.9L one or going to provide one more engine options for Scorpio? Anybody has any clue? I am bit worried as I am planning to book a Scorpio in February/March. I like the performance of the 2.2L mHawk
I don't think that Mahindra will take the risk of replacing the 2.2L tried and tested engine altogether with the new 1.9 L one. They will introduce a new model of Scorpio / XUV500 with this new engine.
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Old 16th January 2016, 19:44   #23
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Default Re: Diesel SUV ban - Mahindra to refund booking amounts in Delhi

I had gone to the Mahindra Showroom yesterday to inquire about the XUV A/T

The SA confirmed that they are coming up with downsized engines; however did not have any indicative timelines, but the launch is very soon

On another note, the downsizing of engines should ideally have an impact on the pricing too and if that happens then this will lead to the XUV giving even tougher competition to the likes of the Creta, Duster etc.
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Old 20th January 2016, 17:46   #24
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Default Re: Diesel SUV ban - Mahindra to refund booking amounts in Delhi

The new diesel motor in the Scorpios and XUV's may be of 1995 cc as enquired from Mahindra show room in Faridabad.
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Old 22nd January 2016, 14:56   #25
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Default Re: Diesel SUV ban - Mahindra to refund booking amounts in Delhi

Mahindra today announced the launch of mHawk 1.99-litre diesel unit. The new diesel engine is the downsized version of the mHawk 2.2-litre engine that does duty on the regular modes of both the SUVs. The 1.99-litre engined models of the SUVs will be made available very soon. While the 1.99-litre mHawk diesel engine will produce 120bhp for the Mahindra Scorpio, it will deliver 140bhp with the XUV500.

The Scorpio and XUV with the updated engines will be soon available in Delhi.

Source: Financial Express
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Old 4th February 2016, 09:05   #26
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Default Re: Diesel SUV ban - Mahindra to refund booking amounts in Delhi

Ever proactive Mahindra has started to develop petrol engines to avoid getting stuck in issues like the Delhi ban.

Quote:
Mahindra and Mahindra Ltd will offer petrol variants of all its mainstream vehicles in the next two-to-three years and plans to develop three diesel mills between 1.5 and 2.2-litre capacity, Pawan Goenka, executive director of the firm, said in an interview Wednesday.
Quote:
Have you tweaked the engine?
You cannot tweak the engine in one month. There are two very happy coincidences that happened. One was that we had a 1.99-litre diesel engine in the works for a year-and-a-half. We would have launched it in due course of time, perhaps two or three months later. We were not sure about it being launched in India. Thatís the only difference.
Good to see that they had the engine in the works for the past year and half and co-incidentally the Delhi ban also happened!

Source

Last edited by batterylow : 4th February 2016 at 09:08. Reason: Additional data
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Old 4th February 2016, 14:25   #27
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Default Re: Diesel SUV ban - Mahindra to refund booking amounts in Delhi

Mahindra Scorpio website is updated with the new 1.9L engine details.
Diesel SUV ban - Mahindra to refund booking amounts in Delhi-scorpiospec.jpg
Looks like this engine is available only in Delhi. Anybody got a chance to drive this? I am curious to know about the performance of the downsized engine.
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Old 4th February 2016, 14:50   #28
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Default Re: Diesel SUV ban - Mahindra to refund booking amounts in Delhi

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Originally Posted by lal79 View Post
Looks like this engine is available only in Delhi. Anybody got a chance to drive this? I am curious to know about the performance of the downsized engine.
Last Sunday when I visited a Mahindra showroom, the SA informed that they are actively testing this engine. It is not yet in production is what he claimed. But Mahindra seems to be working hard to launch the Scorpio and XUV with this downsized engine.

My question is -- would slashing ~300 cc from the 2.2 MHawk make any difference to the emissions? I doubt. Now only if NGT realizes this. Alas!!
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