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Old 13th January 2016, 12:47   #31
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Default re: Maruti Ertiga & Ciaz diesels with SHVS exempt from Delhi's odd-even rule

What's is surprising is the number of exceptions the Common Man Govt. & the bureaucracy dropout CM is making in the scheme, yet shouting from the hip to claim that the pollution has dipped considerably. IMO the findings are debatable & principally they too have admitted the scheme as a failure in reigning anything other than traffic (which is definitely lower these days).

Maruti exemptions saga has also proved that the generalists who work under successive Govt. have no basic idea of the action they have taken in name of easing public woes. These so called hybrids are meant to reduce fuel consumption & not the pollution numbers. The engines remain the same & by no means (of paper wars practice) one can prove that these cars emit lesser pollutants.

Definitely, few people can laugh all the way to office or family drives, but, it also shows the vulnerability of the Govt. which is clearly wilting under pressure.
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Old 13th January 2016, 13:32   #32
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Default Re: Maruti Ertiga & Ciaz diesels with SHVS exempt from Delhi's odd-even rule

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Originally Posted by StarScream View Post
This is a mild hybrid at best and looks like an attempt to benefit from well-intentioned policies be it the Delhi exemption or benefits given to true hybrid and electric cars.
Completely agreed! The SHVS on paper might be a hybrid (due to the electric boost), but its benefits are nowhere as good as that of a proper hybrid.

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Originally Posted by gaurav_3000ad View Post
My two cents to the Delhi govt would be - If you want to implement the odd-even scheme then go all out and implement it without liniencies and dilutions. Stop mimicking the caste based quota system that's already plaguing the education system. This has no end to it.
+1. Why create exemptions? In addition to hybrids, CNG cars, EVs and cars with women onboard can run freely.

Along with a demand for SHVS cars & badges, I see an overnight spike in demand for CNG kits. Spend 50k and get one installed. Even if you don't actually run your car on CNG, who's going to check it? Cheaper than buying a second car for sure. Just install the kit...but leave it disconnected.

The government should know a thing or two about loopholes and how good we Indians are at exploiting them.

Rules should be in black & white. No grey areas.

Last edited by GTO : 13th January 2016 at 13:34.
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Old 13th January 2016, 14:03   #33
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Default Re: Maruti Ertiga & Ciaz diesels with SHVS exempt from Delhi's odd-even rule

This is hilarious.

I am a Ciaz SHVS owner. I think my car pollutes more than Ciaz Petrol. But, I get the exemption.

I don't think this odd even scheme is bonafide in first place. Our Yugpurush (honesty be upon him) is using it as a smoke screen to avoid real issues.

Removing half of cars reduces almost half of the traffic on the road, not half of the pollution.
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Old 13th January 2016, 14:16   #34
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Default Re: Maruti Ertiga & Ciaz diesels with SHVS exempt from Delhi's odd-even rule

What a hilarious gimmick by the Delhi Govt. Just yesterday I read in TOI about a statement by the CM that this "Odd-Even scheme proves that the Delhi govt can govern" and today I read this.
I repeat, this is hilarious.

Half the world is exempt. Two wheelers, Lady drivers, CNG, etc etc. And now they add this.
At best , this is just a marketing gimmick. The Odd-Even trial is going to stop by 15th. And I do not see this coming back. Actually, I hope for the good people of Delhi that this does not come back.

IMO, this is a violation of my rights. I bought a car and registered it with the government by paying a fee. Registered so I can drive it legally on the roads. After this, they ask me to use it only alternate days. Definitely a violation of rights.
This can work is China, but India is still a Democracy.

I would very much like to know how many vehicles did this actually manage to reduce on Delhi roads. At any given point of time, 50% "CARS" can legally ply going by the odd-even number. To that, I would add 10%(?) lady driven, Another 15-20 on CNG. So they managed to reduce ~ 20% cars on Delhi road. Two wheelers are exempt. So net number of vehicles off road due to this scheme are not more than 10% (overall).

Whether it actually helped in the Pollution number can be a different story altogether. But they can keep adding exemptions to it (as and when the tie-ups happen), irrespective of the fact that the concept of that exemption in itself is a joke, like the Hybrid Marutis. There are better hybrids out there than these, but maybe God answers to those to ask and maybe these manufacturers do not believe in asking. Oh wait, maybe that hybrid model has been discontinued. Who cares.


What a bunch of jokers.

Last edited by vinit.merchant : 13th January 2016 at 14:30.
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Old 13th January 2016, 16:52   #35
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Default Re: Maruti Ertiga & Ciaz diesels with SHVS exempt from Delhi's odd-even rule

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Along with a demand for SHVS cars & badges, I see an overnight spike in demand for CNG kits. Spend 50k and get one installed. Even if you don't actually run your car on CNG, who's going to check it? Cheaper than buying a second car for sure. Just install the kit...but leave it disconnected.

The government should know a thing or two about loopholes and how good we Indians are at exploiting them.

Rules should be in black & white. No grey areas.
Why even spend 50k when you can get a CNG sticker for 3K odd. Just paste the sticker and 99% of the time, no one will bother you. This is the reason that the sale of CNG stickers have been limited to only 1 CNG Station.

Quote:
He said one Dipak Sen from Vivek Vihar CNG station was "caught" selling CNG stickers to non-CNG vehicles and he had "admitted" to the crime. He was selling the sticker for Rs 2,800. The Indraprastha Gas Ltd has registered a case against him at Vivek Vihar police station, Rai said.
So far, CNG stickers were available at 95 CNG stations in Delhi and another 19 stations in NCR. One LPG car owner was also caught today for driving around pasting a CNG sticker.
In the light of malpractice in issuance of CNG stickers, Transport minister Gopal Rai has directed IGL officials to issue stickers only at CGO Complex, Lodhi Road, under strict monitoring and ordered checking of vehicles bearing CNG stickers on a random basis.
Rai also announced that from 6 am tomorrow, IGL will stop issuance of CNG stickers at its stations across Delhi and NCR except CGO Complex where it will be available for 24 hours while adding that adequate number of such stickers have already been issued.
http://www.tribuneindia.com/news/del...ed/180055.html

http://www.newindianexpress.com/nati...cle3213077.ece
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Old 13th January 2016, 19:48   #36
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Default Re: Maruti Ertiga & Ciaz diesels with SHVS exempt from Delhi's odd-even rule

One simple way to gauge the "boost" Maruti's SHVS system provides is to check the power. It stays 89 bhp, with ot without. Maruti could have done better by providing a second lead acid battery for this system and its motor in the boot. That way they'd stay within cost and provide a slight bump in power.

Separately, as far as I can see odd-even hasn't done much for pollution because pollution dips when it's windy and climbs when it's not. The only thing that I can gauge is that there is lesser traffic on the roads, which also is testament to most Delhi folks following the rule.

Two stories from the land of odd-even:
1) Today, an odd day, I took my even numbered Vento TSI to work. I drove fast to avoid any hassle and reach work before 8 a.m. Half the way there a red diesel Polo came up behind me and aggressively honked and flashed his lights, trying to get ahead. Later at a red light, I realized what his problem was - he was also driving an even-numbered car and I guess in a hurry to get where he was going before 8 a.m.

2) I am writing this from office, waiting for the clock to strike 8 p.m., so that I can drive home as a good law-abiding citizen! I will have my revenge tomorrow.

Last edited by StarScream : 13th January 2016 at 19:50.
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Old 13th January 2016, 21:44   #37
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Default Re: Maruti Ertiga & Ciaz diesels with SHVS exempt from Delhi's odd-even rule

What a farce! I guess now a days anything is implementable in the name of reducing pollution. Maruti suzuki is probably one of the major gainers of the 2000 CC+ diesel ban and now a model wise deviation citing these types of reasons!
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Old 13th January 2016, 22:43   #38
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Default Re: Maruti Ertiga & Ciaz diesels with SHVS exempt from Delhi's odd-even rule

Once again the Indian Government uses 'hard logic' to find solutions to a problem which needs either a cold turkey approach or something creative. My point only reiterates what other members have said - what is the point of so many exemptions to the odd even scheme. If this is implemented full time, I guess the Delhi police would be busy doing process of elimination in the middle of the street rather than fine people. CNG, petrol, diesel - all should be included in the scheme and at the risk of being politically incorrect, even women should be under the ambit of this policy. Next thing you, people are demanding reservations for exemption. Lawyers, doctors and civil servants have already started rallying.
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Old 14th January 2016, 03:58   #39
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Default Re: Maruti Ertiga & Ciaz diesels with SHVS exempt from Delhi's odd-even rule

Quote:
Originally Posted by StarScream View Post
Nowhere did I say the SHVS system was made especially and just in time to take advantage of the odd-even rule. I cited that as an additional benefit to the various subsidies for hybrid and electric cars available in Delhi from the state and central governments.

I am very skeptical of the motor assist bit because Maruti seems to have replaced the interesting bits of this tech with cheaper, local technologies, while retaining the name and marketing spiel and there in lies the scam - lowering cost by taking govt subsidies when it doesn't deserve it.

This is how the original Suzuki SHVS system works
My apologies if I had misunderstood your post, and I guess I did misunderstand it in two aspects.

Yes, the odd-even formula exemption is only an additional benefit. The SHVS vehicles do get put into a lower excise slab because they're technically classified as hybrids, even if they only happen to be micro-hybrids. And the ISG components may also benefit from lowered import duties (if they're imported).

After your video explanation, I understood what you were trying to highlight. Suzuki's version of SHVS (as shown in the video) does have an additional battery, just like Nissan's S-HYBRID (another micro-hybrid system used in the Malaysian Serena MPV). Surprisingly, Maruti Suzuki's implementation does not use another battery (be it Li-ion or lead-acid) but only a larger capacity regular battery, even though this is also labelled as an SHVS. I wasn't aware that Maruti Suzuki's SHVS implementation happens to be different from the international SHVS used by Suzuki.

I understand your skepticism quite well now!

While I'm still inclined to give the benefit of the doubt to Maruti Suzuki that their SHVS does actually provide some assistance to power the car, I hope they make this clear soon by exhibiting a functional model / cut-away of the Multijet equipped with SHVS.

I think the definition of "hybrid vehicle" used by the government of India (GoI) also needs to be specified in a sharp and unambiguous manner. If only full hybrids are to be given benefits, then GoI needs to define a hybrid vehicle as (something on the lines of) one which is able to be powered by electricity alone upto a specified speed (say, at least 10 ~ 20 kmph) or upto a specified distance (say, at least 10 km). This would mean parallel hybrids and series hybrids would get the tax benefits, but mild-hybrids (like Honda's IMA) and micro-hybrids (like SHVS & S-HYBRID) would not.

I hope Maruti Suzuki are able to introduce the production version of the Swift plug-in hybrid they showcased earlier. That would be able to meet any definition of a hybrid vehicle.

Last edited by RSR : 14th January 2016 at 04:17.
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Old 28th January 2016, 23:48   #40
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A hybrid is vehicle that has two engines each capable of propelling the car on its own and in a combined mode as and when needed. Only two globally accepted hybrids exist in india. One is the Toyota Camry hybrid and the other is the Toyota Prius. All other vehicles advertised as hybrids are just taking advantage of the term hybrid. Example micro hybrid by mahindra, because the system switches off the engine while idling. Mercedes c class sold currently also has this feature. It also uses brake energy regeneration and uses a separate battery for start stop . So going by Maruti or mahindras marketing gimmick a C class is also a hybrid, but we don't see that advertised because the company knows it's not true. If Mercedes were to market a C class as hybrid in india they would open themselves to bring sued and ridiculed globally.

Should the ciaz shvs be exempt, in my opinion it's a joke.

Maruti and mahindras don't have to care for this because their marketing con only exists in india. Needless to say this lame strategy would not fly in regions such as Europe USA Southeast Asian countries where the customer is more aware.

A pure electric vehicle is advertised as just that ELECTRIC.
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Old 7th April 2016, 09:09   #41
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Default Re: Maruti Ertiga & Ciaz diesels with SHVS exempt from Delhi's odd-even rule

Demand for Hybrid on rise - Maruti en-cashes on its SHVS on Ciaz and Ertiga, witnesses a significant jump in sales after it being exempted on the odd-even rule.

In case of Ciaz, over 58% sales comes from smart hybrid technology while in Ertiga the contribution of SHVS technology is about 57%!

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Quote:
Maruti, which introduced what the company calls smart hybrid technology in Ciaz and Ertiga last year, said it sold more than 47,500 units of these mild hybrids in the past six to seven months.

http://auto.economictimes.indiatimes...india/51722688

Last edited by volkman10 : 7th April 2016 at 09:11.
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Old 7th April 2016, 15:00   #42
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I am planning to buy Ertiga in Delhi. Just saw the news that delhi govt has reduced VAT on hybrids.
Ertiga comes under this category but dealers in delhi have not reduced a bit.
Should I wait for a while...
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