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Old 15th February 2017, 19:46   #511
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
ACE structure is a pure marketing term. lol. Pls. don't get carried away with marketing spiel. YEs the City is decent in safety but it's again the lowest when vs the Vento/Rapid and possibly even the Verna (don't remember NCAP rating).
Not sure if that is true. When tested in August 2014, City scored the highest ever points. Link (ASEAN NCAP Q3 2014 Crash Test Results (Honda City & Tata Vista))

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
There are enough posts and photos showing what happens to a city in small impacts. It's like a baleno which again on paper has decent safety but we know better that the car is wafer thin. Just comparing live examples of Vento and City in accidents on the forum and you know which car you should be in if you have an unfortunate accident.
Baleno is wafer thin? How do you know that? Structural safety cannot be assessed by looking at the sheet metal thickness.

There are no examples, that i know of, where the City performed abysmally compared to the Vento in legal speed crashes. Please cite an example if you find one. Deformed bumpers in fender benders maybe more in the City. But the chassis strength of the City being weaker than the Vento is just a myth. The City will keep the survival space as good as a Vento, in a crash.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
The frame and structure very much changes for cheap Indian countries where we don't have the same norms. Ford, Hyundai and other manufacturers add additional strength to the shell for european markets vs India. There's a thread on this. Honda for sure has different quality of parts in Thailand and India. Have seen a City in Singapore and it's not even the same car!!!
Mobilio in India and Thailand are judged to have strong structures in NCAP tests. So why do you think the City will be different? I have seen the City in Australia. It is the same car, except for the features.

I agree that the top variants of the City are over priced. But denigrating the car as inferior to others, without any evidence, is not right. The pricing is stupid, but the overall package is still great.

Last edited by deerhunter : 15th February 2017 at 19:57.
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Old 15th February 2017, 19:47   #512
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

This is how the 2017 Honda City stacks up against it's in-segment rivals, price-wise across variants:

Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs-untitled.jpg

All prices, ex-showroom Delhi, and have been taken from the respective companies' websites.

AT/CVT/DSG variants have been highlighted in BOLD and italicised.

Last edited by RavenAvi : 15th February 2017 at 19:52.
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Old 15th February 2017, 19:48   #513
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
ACE structure is a pure marketing term. lol. Pls. don't get carried away with marketing spiel. YEs the City is decent in safety but it's again the lowest when vs the Vento/Rapid and possibly even the Verna (don't remember NCAP rating).

There are enough posts and photos showing what happens to a city in small impacts. It's like a baleno which again on paper has decent safety but we know better that the car is wafer thin. Just comparing live examples of Vento and City in accidents on the forum and you know which car you should be in if you have an unfortunate accident.
So you're saying I should go on your word rather than going on tests which have been already been conducted? Latin America or wherever, the fact remains that it's a Honda City there, it's a Honda City here. ACE structure there, ACE structure here.And dents are very different to a damage on a frame.

And add 6 airbags and if you call that an unsafe car, I'll strongly disagree.

And in general to all, revolting against pricing is one thing but bringing down a car in every way is seriously uncalled for.

Last edited by The Brutailer : 15th February 2017 at 20:11.
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Old 15th February 2017, 20:25   #514
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

The top of the line diesel Ciaz is cheaper than the base City diesel

Honda still hasn't learnt anything. With this kind of an attitude even their best selling car will soon languish at the bottom of the chart.
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Old 15th February 2017, 20:54   #515
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
None of the Honda cars from the Indian market has been crash tested yet.
Small correction: Indian Mobilio did get crash tested. Got 3 stars out of 5. Bad rating but still better than zero.



Quote:
Originally Posted by adarsh76 View Post
All City owners,

We should criticize the car more. Criticism from Non City owners need not be taken care. Comments like CVT compared to scooter, tin cans and all is childish. Those can be ignored.
Non-City owners like me still get to criticize the car because I've thousands of km experience driving City thanks to Zoomcar.

Please let me complain once again that from a perspective, for price of a City CVT ZX, one could buy two cars instead:
1. Figo 1.5L with much superior dual clutch autobox,
2. Etios 1.5L base which is laden with safety featues.

Having experienced these cars myself, I can't really call City a segment above these two cars. I want to buy a City later this year. Naturally I got upset with prices and bashed it with the above argument. Nonetheless, I guess I'll get the S model, which is still nicely priced. Does feel worth paying 1.5 lac rupee extra over Etios base.

City ZX at 13.5 lac suffers from three serious problems:
1. Rear suspension- It is not just lousy but potentially dangerous. Slight dimples in roads causes violent bouncing, scaring me and passengers alike. The same road is easily covered by Figo at same speed without feeling anything wrong.
2. Build quality- My god, what a mangled mess. Bumpers are always misaligned even if the car is freshly delivered from factory. This is honestly a minor issue which Honda can fix with minimal extra cost. Why not just do it, Honda?!
3. CVT transmission- May be I just don't know how to drive a CVT car despite years of experience riding my little TVS Scooty. Power is there, sure, but when I need to overtake someone, power goes hiding somewhere. Even Ciaz with its stone-age torque converter and weak 1.4L engine feels more confident to drive.

That said, I am still hugely interested in buying City S. Stuff which I love about City-
1. Electric steering- I like it as much as my Figo's hydraulic steering. It is better than new Figo's electric steering. Well balanced and confidence-inspiring.
2. Front seats- Probably the best thing about City. That amount of side bolstering! I prefer them over Mercedes GLA's front seats.
3. Interior space and ergonomics- Honda is the best here. Even Toyota and Nissan don't feel as nice to sit in as City does.
4. Gear lever- Short throw, reassuring clunk, precise slotting. My favorite gear lever!
5. Clutch- short, precise, perfect amount of force needed. Again, my favorite clutch pedal!
6. Both the engines- The petrol one is fun to drive. I can't care what VW's 1.2L engine says on paper, it is just not as fun as City's free-revving 1.5L engine. Guess, there is indeed no replacement for displacement. It is also more fun to drive an NA engine vs a turbo-charged one. The diesel one is not fast but, that bliss of driveability! 6th gear is an icing on the cake. Can't believe that Amaze has same diesel engine. The driveability difference is day and night!
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Old 15th February 2017, 20:56   #516
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

Just got the opportunity to compare both the front ends. The new family face is apparent.
Have both the brochures in my collection.

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Old 15th February 2017, 21:06   #517
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

Sharing OTR pricing list received from Linkway Honda, Mumbai, for Mumbai and Thane:

Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs-1.jpg

Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs-2.jpg

Base = Other colour shades.

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Old 15th February 2017, 21:25   #518
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

Good god!
This is what I happened when I saw the OTR Prices for the ZX City:

I think Auto makers use the Inflation numbers from Venezuela for determining prices.

But, great job on featuring the Airbags as standard on all trims, Honda.

Last edited by aah78 : 16th February 2017 at 02:26. Reason: Deleting gif file.
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Old 15th February 2017, 21:34   #519
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

Rupee value in the last 5 years has gone down by 20 rupees. Is that having a impact on all car prices ? Ultimately the foreign companies would like make money in dollar terms. Could also be due to import content.

I think slowly people might lose interest in C segment and people would move towards SUVs. I think companies would (or should) exploit this in near future. I know quite few people who are moving towards XUV like vehicles which are VFM.

Last edited by srishiva : 15th February 2017 at 21:35.
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Old 15th February 2017, 21:41   #520
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

Oh my god, Honda is taking it to a whole new level. And what a unfair world this has become. Imagine Fiat TJet Emotion (albeit Manual) being sold at 1.7 lakh lesser than a VX MT find no takers whatsoever. What is more striking is, the difference is as stark even with the bestseller Ciaz. The story is worse comparing with available petrol AT cars, with the next most expensive high end automatic are the Vento/Rapid priced about whole two lakhs cheaper.
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Old 15th February 2017, 21:53   #521
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by prakash_ajp View Post
Oh my god, Honda is taking it to a whole new level. And what a unfair world this has become. The story is worse comparing with available petrol AT cars, with the next most expensive high end automatic are the Vento/Rapid priced about whole two lakhs cheaper.
The newly released Vento Highline Plus AT is 12.67 ex-showroom. It is feature-wise comparable to City VX CVT. Top of the line Vento diesel is 14.09 ex-showroom. Beat that!!

Last edited by deerhunter : 15th February 2017 at 21:55.
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Old 15th February 2017, 21:59   #522
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by adarsh76 View Post
All City owners,
Criticism from Non City owners need not be taken care.
Unfortunately, this is not how the business works Knowing why the company lost business is as important as taking care of an unsatisfied customer.


Quote:
Comments like CVT compared to scooter, tin cans and all is childish. Those can be ignored.
Do you sir even know what gearbox is used in the entry level scooters? I guess if you knew, you wouldn't have made this 'mature' comment against the childish comparison

Last edited by theredliner : 15th February 2017 at 22:07.
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Old 15th February 2017, 22:59   #523
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

This reminds of past. When Maruti and Hyundai were battling with the no 1 position in hatchback segment with swift and i20 respectively, Hyundai with the launch of elite i20 took it a segment(half a segment maybe) up than the swift.

Same happens with Maruti and Honda with Ciaz and New city. But I don't think the difference between both are as prominent as between swift and elite i20 when it comes to quality, fit and finish or features(except sunroof, 6 airbags and LED lamps)

Coming to the aspirational value argument, I personally find Vento more aspirational than the City. It is built better, drives better, performs better, feels plusher, has a better brand image and still looks great.

All said, Maruti will be happy with the way city is priced. If they had priced it sensibly, a lot of ciaz customers (so called poor fellows who have small budget or that is how city fan boys think lol) would buy city instead of ciaz.

But now, since Honda has placed City as a premium product just by pricing it so, ciaz sales is hardly going to be affected.
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Old 15th February 2017, 23:24   #524
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

Honda is lucky to have this premium brand image in India. If not for it they wouldn't be able to survive with this ridiculous pricing.

Guess competing with Hyundai in other segments didn't work for them, they have to milk the brand image now.

Only good thing, I guess, they are trying to show some value for the premium the customers are going to pay like airbags, improved interiors, etc.

Last few years haven't worked very well for them when they tried to aim for mass market, so this could very well be right step for them.
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Old 15th February 2017, 23:43   #525
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Default Re: Honda working on City Facelift. EDIT: Launched at Rs 8.5 lakhs

@ Vidyut - you either need to keep accompanying Ajmat on the Jetta drives or get a used sample for yourself at 8-9 lakhs then Boy, I still love the fact that I paid 16.9 OTR for my CL TDI.

Most of us in India are super suckers for Jap cars, especially Honda. I am quite glad that Honda's recent halfhearted attempts have all flopped. Not that it deterred them from extending the price of 'new' City all the way till 17 lakhs.

Don't get me wrong guys. I neither hate City, nor Honda. In fact, I think Honda is one of the better manufacturers out there. I am quite eagerly waiting for Honda to relaunch Civic - a car built for the world, to the world standards.

I am just stunned at how atrociously the top variants of City are priced. It's the underlying platform, engine, chassis that make the car, not just FEATURES.

Last edited by Abhi_Automobile : 15th February 2017 at 23:47.
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