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Old 2nd September 2016, 10:40   #451
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

Well contrary to the popular belief, I clearly see an Aria here with some more design elements thrown in. I don't know how this car will work when the Aria flopped so badly. I guess they will be shooting themselves in the foot if they try to go for the Innova. Hopefully it will be a safari replacement and not priced over it.
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Old 2nd September 2016, 11:06   #452
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I have information from my birdie that launch will be in Diwali for sure. Only thing remains is that Tata should price it sensibly. Aria was a very competent vehicle but pricing was horribly wrong. Same thing with Bolt.

@Sam911, Thanks for the awesome post. How I hate the chrome at the back. Makes the car so blingy. Hopefully would be tempered else where

Last edited by ampere : 2nd September 2016 at 11:57. Reason: Back to back posts merged
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Old 2nd September 2016, 11:35   #453
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

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Originally Posted by RavenAvi View Post
To be offered in the top/top 2 variants.

Attachment 1549604

Position of the DRLs (in the corners and on the surface, not recessed) makes it vulnerable to damages. Looks like an afterthought.
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Old 2nd September 2016, 20:11   #454
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

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Originally Posted by RavenAvi View Post
Now, the Hexa will be launched in the first week of October, and the Kite5 will arrive after Diwali 2016.
Absolutely perfect. I sincerely hope that Tata's provide a fully loaded top end variant with the Auto gearbox. Hope they don't end up where the customer has to make choices between the top end variant and lower variants just to gain some and lose some. Like the XUV it should have 'everything' that the Hexa has to offer. All the best to Tata's. Hope they get this spot-on this time with the versions - pricing - marketing strategy.
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Old 2nd September 2016, 21:37   #455
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

Isn't the Hexa to the Aria what the BR-V was to the Mobilio? Isn't it a souped-up Aria?

Mobilio was launched in 2014, BR-V in 2016.
Aria was launched in 2010, Hexa is scheduled to launch in 2016.

So, what is excitingly new in the Hexa and why it takes 6 years for a souped-up version of Aria apart from the supposedly new auto box?
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Old 2nd September 2016, 22:24   #456
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

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Originally Posted by searacer932 View Post
Isn't the Hexa to the Aria what the BR-V was to the Mobilio? Isn't it a souped-up Aria?

Mobilio was launched in 2014, BR-V in 2016.
Aria was launched in 2010, Hexa is scheduled to launch in 2016.

So, what is excitingly new in the Hexa and why it takes 6 years for a souped-up version of Aria apart from the supposedly new auto box?
Tata started work on Hexa late.

The criticism of BR-V is not that it shares the same platform as the MPV Mobilio. It gets the flak because it (apparently) looks like the Mobilio from the side. Innova/Fortuner and Xylo/Scorpio are other examples of platform sharing between MPV and SUV body styles.

Not many on the road will say "Hexa looks like Aria" - primarily because not many people have seen a Tata Aria!
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Old 2nd September 2016, 23:21   #457
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

Tata Hexa will have a tough time due to price expectation mis-match of the potential customer base.

Based on numerous post on this thread, the expectation is that TATA should provide a car as reliable as Innova, with minimum 5 years warranty, more feature loaded than Innova Crysta and atleast 3-4 lakhs less than Innova Crysta. Even if we assume Crysta is overpriced by 2 lakhs. How are we expecting TATA to provide a more feature loaded car with lesser price tag than Innova?

The current TOP model ARIA after all the price cuts done by TATA cost 20 lakhs on road ( in Mumbai). How are we expecting the TOP model of HEXA to cost less than 20 lakhs with the new Terrain Management System, improved interiors, and all the bells and whistles. Leave apart the mechanical improvement and the exterior cosmetic changes.

Part of the customer base waiting for HEXA are the ones who hate innova for the pricing and that's where lies the problem.
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Old 3rd September 2016, 00:10   #458
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

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Originally Posted by LoneWolf9 View Post
How are we expecting TATA to provide a more feature loaded car with lesser price tag than Innova?
The answer lies to this chart which i found in the official Tata Aria review.
Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016-uv-comparo.jpg

When the Aria was launched, it was around 27% costlier than the top-end Innova (comparing top-end models for simplicity) - one of the primary reasons for its Dead-On-Arrival outcome. This time around things are different.

If we look at the Safari pricing (the Dicor then vs Storme now), the prices have gone up from 11.97L then to 13.9L (400NM Varicor version) - an increase of 16%. A similar increment in the Hexa (or then the Aria) would take it to around 18L (considering its already inflated launch price).

On the other hand, Toyota got greedier (and kept increasing the Innova prices). The top-end Innova now costs close to 21L (ex-showroom Delhi).

So you get a straight 3L difference - assuming Tata Motors did not learn anything from their Aria pricing debacle. Considering how well they priced the Zest and (more recently) the Tiago, we can hope for a much better priced Hexa.

Of course, we then have the Bolt pricing incident, so it keeps the topic alive. Until then, we can enjoy the spy pics

Last edited by sachinayak : 3rd September 2016 at 00:14.
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Old 3rd September 2016, 01:07   #459
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

Tata Hexa is generating enough positive vibes.

Looks wise Tata cars generally don't disappoint and Tata usually gives yummy looking alloys.

I am sure the pricing would be a killer one going by Tiago.

The only and real fight for Tata would be with their image with public especially with reliable and fuss free ownership which is very critical to me.

P.S. - I always consider Hexa as Aria as it surely is one.
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Old 3rd September 2016, 01:16   #460
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

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Originally Posted by sachinayak View Post
So you get a straight 3L difference - assuming Tata Motors did not learn anything from their Aria pricing debacle. Considering how well they priced the Zest and (more recently) the Tiago,
And the well priced Zest is still struggling and the extremely competent Tiago is slowly picking up pace, numbers still much less than what it deserves. Because people still consider it a risky proposition to save a few thousands on a TATA.

When we talk about 20 - 25L, a 3L margin wont be enough IMO. Considering the extent of the failure of Aria, and the negative publicity that it created online - a good five lakhs less than the sticker price of the Innova is what it should really aim for, if they hope to sell in decent (Atleast a 3 digit figure per month, I hope) numbers.
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Old 3rd September 2016, 09:57   #461
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

Let's do a SWOT analysis :

What strength does Tata have ?
Known to keep costs low initially. When Aria was launched, it had much more power and a plethora of features (safety & gadgetry) leagues ahead of the then Innova, seeming (to many) to be worth atleast a 30% premium over Innova.

What weakness does the Innova Crysta have ?
It's overpriced by atleast 10%, even by Toyota standards. Also, they're not offering 2nd row bench seats in the top variant (c'mon, counts!)

What weakness does Tata have compared to Toyota ?
Distrust. Justified concerns in terms of durability & longevity, after sales experience at ASC, post purchase cost of upkeep.

What opportunity does Tata have ?
Probably the absolute last chance to redeem itself among enthusiasts. The CEO finally admits that the masses do not shortlist Tata cars in their choices.

Tiago had a super-massive advantage in input cost due to the benefits of a near free govt loan (@0.1%), near free govt land at Sanand, VAT holidays etc, and it was easy to price it low with no serious risk to profitability of that car.

Threats :
They have such little market share

If not for the Tiago, they were already out of the market (even with 1 competent product like Zest doing dismal numbers), so there's no market share left to lose as such, only shareholder money (if it comes to that), they only need to offer a simple, yet durable product at a great price to attract some crowds.

Then they need to build trust, which, as having owned a Tata product & having experienced the ASCs, in my opinion should be granted only if they're offering an exceptional warranty period..

They've been testing the Hexa since 2.5 years after it was revealed at the Geneva Motor show. And I'm very hopeful that a product thats probably taken 3.5 years (42 months!) to develop, should be backed by such exceptional warranty.

I believe that if Toyota starts seeing it's marketshare fall, it can and will react, and for the first time, cut prices heavily to retain marketshare. Eventually Hexa should look to not be left with 15% marketshare, as that again would hit resale values, service center viability & put off Tata customers.

It'll be a gamble to buy either the Hexa or the Crysta. Tata needs to build a strong company with great after sales support, Toyota has all its basics strong & only needs to cut prices to annihilliate competition.

Let's see.
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Old 3rd September 2016, 10:41   #462
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

If the Hexa AT displayed at the auto expo could be launched at around 15.5 laks then it should be able to do around 600 units per month. My analogy for that is since 50% of Innova Crysta sales are for the automatic variant which comes to around 3000 units per month. If Hexa manages to get 20% of those customers this number is easily achievable. Another 200-300 odd numbers from the manual variants takes this to 900 units per month.
My assumption for that price is since the automatic gearbox and engine is being shared with the upcoming Xenon facelift displayed at the recent Bangkok motor show, the development costs should not be that high.

Last edited by damodar : 3rd September 2016 at 10:55.
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Old 3rd September 2016, 11:10   #463
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

Let's consider the costing. The engine (2.2 Dicor) is already tested in the Aria and the Varicor 400 in the Storme. It's manufacturing is already depreciated and the engine shouldn't cost as much as a new engine. The chassis is the same Aria chassis, and the mechanical bits are again from either the Aria or the Storme. So about 60% of the cost is already sunk into the production line. The only new bits are the body, interior trim, fittings and probably the automatic box. The whole gamut of testing is to ensure that fit and finish is acceptable, there are no rattles or squeaks and the car holds up to abuse and usage. Their image is so low that a rattletrap Mahindra is acceptable but small squeaks from a Tata is low quality. They need to change this perception by giving a Zest or Tiago like fit and finish from the Hexa. This is the whole reason for the extended testing and delay before launch. I am sure Tata realise their price point versus Toyota and they should launch at a price which makes Innova feel like an overpriced van which it is.
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Old 3rd September 2016, 11:26   #464
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

Quote:
Originally Posted by damodar View Post
...My analogy for that is since 50% of Innova Crysta sales are for the automatic variant which comes to around 3000 units per month. If Hexa manages to get 20% of those customers this number is easily achievable. Another 200-300 odd numbers from the manual variants takes this to 900 units per month...
Quote:
Originally Posted by apachelongbow View Post
Let's consider the costing...
How low can they go ?

What if Toyota managed to *temporarily* (for a year) cut prices by 10-12% ? They can probably afford it. They have the brand following. They have the numbers. They have their processes tightly knitted & dealers at a tight leash. They even offer a 7 year limited-warranty. Only thing they shouldn't take for granted, is their first mover advantage, with which they've caught the people's attention & admiration.

The moment you (try to) hit the big opponent where it hurts most, is the moment the big guy turns around and kicks you into oblivion. You'll only make one sound, *Puff*.

Innova Crysta is Toyota's cash cow. It's one of the only cars from their stable that has the potential to do huge numbers at a high premium for upto a decade. I'm sure they're watching Hexa closely.

Tata will want to sneak up from behind. Offer exceptionally high quality and tech (like suspension - terrain response system, not an AT), at bare minimum prices. Slowly grow their marketshare & only then put up variants that directly compete with Crysta.

Things are going to get interesting!

Last edited by GrammarNazi : 3rd September 2016 at 11:44.
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Old 3rd September 2016, 11:37   #465
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

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Originally Posted by smartcat View Post
Tata started work on Hexa late.

The criticism of BR-V is not that it shares the same platform as the MPV Mobilio. It gets the flak because it (apparently) looks like the Mobilio from the side. Innova/Fortuner and Xylo/Scorpio are other examples of platform sharing between MPV and SUV body styles.

Not many on the road will say "Hexa looks like Aria" - primarily because not many people have seen a Tata Aria!
Also, unlike the BR-V, the Hexa 'could' be a capable vehicle off road.
With body on frame construction, 4x4, terrain response and a torquey engine, the hexa is a lot more capable than most MPVs. In a way, it would be unfair to say that the Hexa isn't an SUV considering that the term SUV is itself being so grossly misused of late!

And I don't think Tata will be targeting the Innova this time around, they would be better off trying to eat into the XUV sales pie. A more achievable target!
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