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Old 15th March 2016, 20:54   #121
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Default Re: Will Tata Motors Dare to Challenge Toyota Innova (Crysta) again with new Aria (Hexa)?

I am not holding my breath on Tata Hexa.
It is a good car, but I am sure Tata will screw it up somehow.

Look at the Tiago and Kite5, two brilliant looking cars powered by anemic engines, while the Bolt and the Zest get proper engines.
Who in the right mind would do that.

Prove me wrong Tata, launch Hexa at a mouth watering price and improve your service standards. I will put my money on Hexa.
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Old 15th March 2016, 21:53   #122
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Default Re: Will Tata Motors Dare to Challenge Toyota Innova (Crysta) again with new Aria (Hexa)?

A huge majority of Tata market is for Taxis. Instead of trying to shed that image, they should just embrace it. What is wrong if you cater to taxis?
With the new Innova being priced more that 20lakh, this is fantastic opportunity for Tata to capture the tourist market.
Secondly the 10-20 lakh rupees people mover range is completely empty right now - with Ertiga/Lodgy at lower end and the new Innova at higher end. Another market for Tata to aggressively target. In my society itself there are three Innovas currently. The owners will not be going for 20 lakh+ vehicles when the times comes to upgrade while Ertiga will be a step down. A top variant Hexa with all bells and whistles at 15lakh mark will completely dominate this market.
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Old 15th March 2016, 22:20   #123
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Default Re: Will Tata Motors Dare to Challenge Toyota Innova (Crysta) again with new Aria (Hexa)?

The Hexa, which is based on the Aria, promises to be a good vehicle.

The quality issues and niggles that seem to affect random examples of every Tata vehicle should have been sorted out by now.

Tata dealership and service experience is really sour in my part of the country. The oldest Tata dealer in my city and their service centre are most untrustworthy to say the least. The Concorde dealership has a somewhat PSU attitude. But their workshop is rather good. But to tell the truth, after dealing with the Toyota / Innova service centre, this 'somewhat good' becomes really underwhelming.

If I were in a market for a product in a particular segment, would I go for the trusted proven product (in this case the Innova) or a hit or miss product (that would be Hexa)? Definitely the first one.

So where does this leave Tata with Hexa prices?

Take a look at the rounded off ex- showroom prices of mainstream 2WD M/T variants within the segment:

Aria: 11L - 13.5L
Innova: 11.5L - 17L
XUV: 12.25L - 16.25L

It would be unfair to ask Tata to price the Hexa below the current Aria. And the upcoming Innova Crysta is sure to move up the price ladder.

So I would suggest Tata to price the Hexa at the current Aria levels with a premium of 50k - 1L.

Since there is no top of the range Aria 'Pride' variant in 2WD form, maybe a fully loaded 2WD M/T variant at 16L maximum could round off the price list.

I suggest Tata better spare the effort with 4WD variants. Very few people look for a 4WD MPV in India.

An automatic gearbox, on the other hand, might be a good thing, but not many takers would be there until it proves to be reliable in the medium term.

Captain seats in the 2nd row, a spacious footwell for the driver, and fewer roof storage bins would also be very much appreciated.
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Old 15th March 2016, 22:47   #124
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Default Re: Will Tata Motors Dare to Challenge Toyota Innova (Crysta) again with new Aria (Hexa)?

I am a fan of Toyota Innova for it's superior reliability, cheap running costs and high resale value.
A fan of Tata Aria for it's sheer driveability, comfort, better handling than Innova and safety.

I am not even saying about economy because both of them give around 12-15 km/l. It is all about a personal perspective to what car you wanna drive and own. To me it has always been Aria. The ride is just too good in an Aria. Power is available instantly and engine doesn't run out of breath after 120. A tad quiet too than any other MPV.

Tata is degraded by the "taxi" car image, well Toyota too have taxis here and abroad alike. Maruti Dzire's are taxis but that doesn't make them not suited for private use. SO it's just in our personal preference. And it is the homegrown brand that dares to lock its fist with international brands, so that it gives Tata a deserving 10 points in my book!
(JLR aspects or iterations are hidden, but nowadays who does not have a JV)

Now to Hexa and Crysta-

Hexa- Looks amazing, well lay out, proportions are on point, butch, muscular.
A touch of Aria is present, to embrace the past and conquer the future I suppose!
Interior are well put together with some JLR technologies thrown in, functional
Seats and good ergonomics.
Engine is tried and tested in Storme and Aria. A bump up in power is welcome.
Reliability if compared with Aria and Storme should also be a notch higher.
After sales need to improve, more experienced technicians, service advisers
And to an extent sales people who can explain the vehicle properly.

Crysta- Looks appealing to masses. Still have the silhouette of previous generation Innova so that people won't get too detached from Innova.
Interiors really top quality, fresh and modern design, looks like a proper
20Lakh MPV inside. Toyota just doesn't know how to screw up certain things, such as seats and plastic quality.
Engine- a most welcomed unit with the much needed power output. Ample insulation should keep the clatter at bay. Previous gen was not meant to carve corners, I hope this one at least lets us try like an almost sedan feel?
After sales- Now just two words 5 star!!! You will have a grin every time your pick it up after service paying only Rs.5000/- for a 20Lakh MPV.

Food for thought- Itís not just about travel from point A to B all the time, itís not always about km/ltr, Itís about how you look at yourself, what you wear, what you see, who you are with, what you drive. Now that is your soul. For me Hexa has that soul even if it costs more for service or less economy I can see myself in one exploring, making everyone turn around in city, and just smiling as miles are passed on.

P.S. All of my views about both are cars are purely based upon what I read in forums and magazines.
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Old 15th March 2016, 23:41   #125
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Default Re: Will Tata Motors Dare to Challenge Toyota Innova (Crysta) again with new Aria (Hexa)?

Its a fact that the 10-20L space is open but then, pricing and variant positioning is absolutely critical. Tata has to price it at least 3L below the Crysta, variant to variant, for it to be even considered. For one simple reason - RESALE

Innova might be boring but buying one makes terrific business sense. You pick one for 16L, use it for 75k km, pay for fuel and basic service(it wont break down!) and after 4 years, it will get you a good 10-12L when you sell it.

Contrast this to the Tatas, which sell for a pittance. If a similarly used Aria sells for an optimistic 7L, that is still a net loss of 3-4L in comparison. That's a lot of money. And this is assuming the ownership experience and maintenance costs are identical, which they aren't

You are willing to pay more for Toyota because you know it will pay you back when you sell it. Period.

Hexa needs to be exceptionally good as a product, and be priced with shock-and-awe strategy. That is the only way it stands a chance in the market.
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Old 15th March 2016, 23:51   #126
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Default Re: Will Tata Motors Dare to Challenge Toyota Innova (Crysta) again with new Aria (Hexa)?

Price undercutting does seem the way to go, but it would be double edged sword.

This could limit the Customer's long term perception of the Hexa as a lower level Innova - which then makes the latter even more prime. (Remember the Nano story - 1L badge; something akin to that).

So if the Hexa priced considerably lower than the Innova, just takes the market by the throat; it's Diwali time for Tata. However, any numbers less than awesome, and Tata would have another mid card fighter unable to challenge the Champ.
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Old 16th March 2016, 01:42   #127
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Default Re: Will Tata Motors Dare to Challenge Toyota Innova (Crysta) again with new Aria (Hexa)?

The truth :
When Toyota develops a products & sends it for manufacturing, its not just the amount of work that's gone into engineering & the development of the product thats phenomenal, its also the impeccable quality of manufacturing that is Extremely high with an almost unlikely possibility of a non-optimal piece being manufactured & rolled out.

When I visited the Tata Factory, another member was a person involved in their truck making wing, & she confirmed that that(as above) wasn't the case with Tata Motors. Not atleast before Mr. / Dr. Slym took over. Once the new MD came over, he had to almost completely re-jig the manufacturing process. Which he did, with his sternly implemented policy not to "accept-build-ship defects". So, back then I'd have said maybe not yet.

But now, things have changed

The Good Part! :
firstly, its very encouraging of having heard that Mr. Cyrus Mistry has, not just encouraged (probably better pay), but gone as far as to warn component vendors against supply of sub-standard parts. Moreover the newly announced MD, Mr. Guenter Butschek has had a past in the Airline Industry, where processes are very well monitored & controlled with great precision. This IMO should bring sterility to the manufacturing processes.

What I'm not yet sure of !:
Service center commitment. Captain Haddock's recent experience reminded me of the SA's misbehaviour during my last visit to Concorde Motors during my Nano's brake failure. (I'd even found their emergency Helpline useless & irresponsible [if not cheatful], about towing.) Some things just wouldn't happen at Toyota A.S.S.

What I'd suggest TATA if they wanted to grow the car to its true potential :
An encouraging introductory price. And a way to get the initial lot of cars sold to Auto-enthusiasts who regularly speak about how they enjoy their cars. In short : People who're affluent & who regularly Tweet/FB/Blog about how they travel.

What I'd want if I were choosing the Hexa over Crysta :
  • Commitment : A 5 year 2Lakh km warranty period & a 5 yr Gold AMC package, as standard, being issued complementary for the initial 6 months. Btw, the car, having thus being maintained well, would even command a better resale value.
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Old 16th March 2016, 08:14   #128
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Well, I'm one of the guinea-pig for Tata from the past decade who was subjected to extreme amount of depression and loss for buying Tata (then flagship product) Manza in 2008. Cut to 2016, I hardly see any strong revival of this brand. Despite having capable products such as bolt, Tata is struggling to sell. Hexa has been in news for several years now and there is no firm update on its launch. It's a usual habit of Tata to take way too long for launch and end up dud.
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Old 16th March 2016, 08:42   #129
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Default Re: Will Tata Motors Dare to Challenge Toyota Innova (Crysta) again with new Aria (Hexa)?

Originally Posted by drsingh View Post
If Tata targets top 30 cities with stand out customer experience and service with a stand out product, they may stand a better chance. Actually a chain of flagship COCO dealerships is what they need. If they want to target Toyota, that's what they need to do.
Its hard to beat that.
It is really a great idea. I wonder why manufacturers do not start more company owned and operated dealerships. TATA would absolutely benefit from that. I think Concorde was an attempt at that. However it failed in execution. Besides the obvious advantage in quality and customer experience, it would be a great way to get first hand data regarding long term performance of the vehicles. Feedback of this data to the design team could vastly improve product performance and quality in the long term.
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Old 16th March 2016, 10:45   #130
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

Originally Posted by harishpr View Post
Well, I'm one of the guinea-pig for Tata from the past decade who was subjected to extreme amount of depression and loss for buying Tata (then flagship product) Manza in 2008.
It would be helpful if you explain the reasons behind your depression and loss. Prospective buyers like me will gain out of your experience.
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Old 18th March 2016, 15:31   #131
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

It may be that I am exception to think like this ( which to most would sound odd ), but the cessation of first generation Innova gives Tata the opportunity to have a two-pronged strategy. I understand that running two products like the way I have opined is not easy, but the current scenario makes a fertile environment for such moves.

First is to continue with current Aria for cab market, and market it aggressively. I did come across a few Aria cabs in my city, which is not a bad vehicle. Tata motors has made improvements overall in quality which is evident in Zest, Bolt and Tiago is likely improve upon further. The base variant of Aria does not have ABS which can be added at the same level and it could be a good seller if marketed aggressively then. Its tough to have any change in propensity of consumers to opt for Innova, but an attempt could be well timed at this instance. Very few travelers have actually experienced Aria unlike Innova which has been tried and tested so Innova is their natural preference while putting a request for cab.
If the cab customers experience Aria, they might ask for the same again as its certainly more silent, comfortable.

Second, price Hexa very sensibly, a lesson Tata must have learnt by now and its critical for Tata not to make mistake at this juncture of their business operations. Again, a good marketing campaign can have Hexa in potential buyer's radar. There was a time when Tata Motor's advertisement campaign was simply excellent, very innovative. Example : Tata Safari. Such campaigns for Aria and Hexa should help Tata overall.

Last edited by aaggoswami : 18th March 2016 at 15:33.
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Old 28th March 2016, 01:23   #132
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

HEXA Tuff displayed at the 2016 Geneva Motor show.
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Old 28th March 2016, 09:30   #133
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

From the Geneva show video, I see that the centre of the inner chassis pops upside too badly, as in a car. Was Aria similar in interiors too?? This then makes sense for a captain seat. Else with conventional 2nd row seat, the person in the centre would literally be having his/ her knees looking up to the face.
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Old 31st March 2016, 09:46   #134
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

Originally Posted by power ranger View Post
Well, with 19 inches wheels, what are Tata's trying to prove ? Are they hoping to get Audi or BMW customers ? This is an extremely foolish move by Tatas. The way I look at this brand is provide value for money for customers like me. Imagine a running cost of 3 Rs per kilometer only for tires
Mate, chill. They are currently testing with smaller size wheels. Check this
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Old 7th April 2016, 13:04   #135
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Default Re: Tata Hexa @ Auto Expo 2016

With the Tiago pricing, I am inclined to believe that Tata has learnt a lesson or two from the Aria pricing. I am praying that Hexa is priced sensibly.
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