Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > The Indian Car Scene


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 15th March 2016, 16:58   #121
BHPian
 
Hemant_Joshi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Pune
Posts: 219
Thanked: 78 Times
Default Re: Out-of-state cars can run on Karnataka roads for 1 year!

Well said, completely agree,
I have personally paid Tax for my Car in 2 states, KA - where the car was bought and MH, when I moved couple of years back, a cool 40K and I was informed that, I can get a refund from KA If I followup with the concerned RTO, but that's impossible, everybody knows that in our country,
Why cant the states or federal govt/dept work among themselves and make citizens life easy -whatever refund I could get from original state, should have been factored into my tax payment in the new state..
wishful thinking I guess,

Our Laws will remain outdated, because our lawmakers are sleeping,



Quote:
Originally Posted by Chetan_Rao View Post
Therein lies the crux of the matter!

Ownership of a tax/revenue header should be immaterial to a tax-paying end user. A citizen's contribution should begin and end at paying the necessary taxes, and if the federal and state governments want to bicker endlessly on who owns what proportion of the pie, they slug it out between themselves and leave the tax-payer out of the mess.

In a hypothetical scenario, a private employee moving states every two years and wanting to keep his car long-term will end up paying LTT road tax EIGHT times over a car's assumed lifetime of FIFTEEN years, with no practical hope of getting a dime back. In what world is that fair?

Our laws are outdated, from a time when constant mobility was restricted and rare for a variety of socio-economic-cultural reasons, not so any more. About time we brought them up-to-date with present ground realities.
Hemant_Joshi is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th March 2016, 17:25   #122
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: BANG-A-LURE.
Posts: 1,026
Thanked: 2,745 Times
Default Re: Out-of-state cars can run on Karnataka roads for 1 year!

Dear Friends,

I managed to speak to the Principal Secretary of Transport on the judgement and his reply was classic.He said he has no idea on the judgement and he will have to speak to the Transport Commissioner on the same.

A copy of the judgement was sent to the Principal Secretary of Transport as he was the primary respondent.

I wanted to check on the process of refund and how people can get their cars released which are lying in BMTC Depots and RTO offices.

Waseem
SILVERWOOD is offline   (11) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th March 2016, 17:34   #123
BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: TVM, BLR, HYD
Posts: 477
Thanked: 538 Times
Default Re: Out-of-state cars can run on Karnataka roads for 1 year!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemant_Joshi View Post

Our Laws will remain outdated, because our lawmakers are sleeping,
I'd say lawmakers are not sleeping, we are . I do not think we are even considered as a significant vote bank but as cash cows. No wonder we pay so many taxes. There is no rationalization. The life time road tax was just another e.g.

if we Indians stand together and vote for the change, I am sure we can get the lawmakers to review the laws that are outdated. To meet the deficits caused by illogical promises to the voters, the easy way out is to see more avenues of taxation. Plus law makers and officials are smart in encouraging xenophobia. Google has loads of information on those hate speeches.

And thinking aloud, how many times did a law maker fight for our cause like Waseem did ? may be even close ?
sunishsamuel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th March 2016, 22:53   #124
BHPian
 
Altocumulus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: BLR / KOL
Posts: 398
Thanked: 305 Times
Default Re: Out-of-state cars can run on Karnataka roads for 1 year!

No other state I am aware of has this problem. In Kolkata, I have seen numerous cars from KA, DL, HR, UP, AP etc which roam about freely. My boss has a TN registered car.

WB also has an option while buying a new car of paying a road tax for 5 years or Lifetime. Like my car I have for 5 years till 2019 while for the Alto till 2008, renewed in 2013 when it was 5 years. The main benefit being, I maynot keep the car for more than 5 years, why pay for 15. Two wheelers are only LTT because it is not much.

I have been in Mumbai for 5 years, never was I caught for WB registration. What I was asked for was Octroi, which I had paid. Road Tax never was an issue.

And at the end why so much ruckus. The state has allowed setting up huge businesses from whom they are earning quite a bit. If you stop others from entering, who will fill up the vacancies. The 'outside' population in Bangalore being huge, contribute quite a lot to the economy of the state. Rent houses, buy groceries, shops, fuel, etc. Why the hypocrisy ? It is just a money making farce. If even within my own country I do not have the freedom of movement, then where will be total chaos.

And personally I am not even for the residents of KA paying LTT. There should be a choice.

Last edited by Altocumulus : 15th March 2016 at 22:56.
Altocumulus is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 16th March 2016, 09:10   #125
Newbie
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 8
Thanked: Once
Default Re: Out-of-state cars can run on Karnataka roads for 1 year!

Boy! I paid the LTT for my 2010 Punto (registered in MH ) last week because the RTO guys confiscated my license on the way to work. And I also wanted to drive with peace of mind.

Original LTT paid in MH in December 2010 ~ Rs 41K ( Factory value 5,16,190 + 70,828 Tax = Total Invoice Amount )

LTT paid in Karnataka in March 2016 Rs 64K

Invoice Amount ~ 586000 ( <--- Is this correct ? )
14% tax on 69% of Invoice Amount ~ 56K
Cess on tax ~ 6K
Penalty for 3 month delay ( I came in January 2016 ) ~ 2K

I have shared the approximate details here to get an opinion on whether the calculations are even correct in the first place.

The next question I have is

(a) Is it mandatory to get a Karnataka Registration Number to use the car here for longer than a year ?

(b) Does getting a Karnataka Registration number necessitate payment of LTT in Karnataka ?

I plan to use the vehicle in Karnataka for more than a year. I have already paid the tax. If payment of tax is not mandatory, I would like to initiate legal proceedings to require the money.
lifeinpune is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 16th March 2016, 10:48   #126
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: BANG-A-LURE.
Posts: 1,026
Thanked: 2,745 Times
Default Re: Out-of-state cars can run on Karnataka roads for 1 year!

Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeinpune View Post

I plan to use the vehicle in Karnataka for more than a year. I have already paid the tax. If payment of tax is not mandatory, I would like to initiate legal proceedings to require the money.
Dear Sir,

Now that the atrocious amendment is quashed by the Honorable High Court, we are seeking clarity from the Government for refunds and the same information should be available with us by this weekend.

Stay Tuned.

Waseem Memon
SILVERWOOD is offline   (7) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 16th March 2016, 10:58   #127
Senior - BHPian
 
Spitfire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Panaji - Goa/Bangalore - Karnataka
Posts: 3,240
Thanked: 599 Times
Default Re: Out-of-state cars can run on Karnataka roads for 1 year!

Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeinpune View Post
Boy! I paid the LTT for my 2010 Punto (registered in MH ) last week because the RTO guys confiscated my license on the way to work. And I also wanted to drive with peace of mind.
Sorry to hear that. Absolutely sorry that you had to go through this, though we are citizens of the same country. But we have hope, the rotten apples among us are fewer in number and we will set them in place too.

Quote:
Original LTT paid in MH in December 2010 ~ Rs 41K ( Factory value 5,16,190 + 70,828 Tax = Total Invoice Amount )

LTT paid in Karnataka in March 2016 Rs 64K

Invoice Amount ~ 586000 ( <--- Is this correct ? )
14% tax on 69% of Invoice Amount ~ 56K
Cess on tax ~ 6K
Penalty for 3 month delay ( I came in January 2016 ) ~ 2K

I have shared the approximate details here to get an opinion on whether the calculations are even correct in the first place.
Whether the calculation is right or wrong is immaterial. They have fraudulently taken your money. Period.

Quote:
(a) Is it mandatory to get a Karnataka Registration Number to use the car here for longer than a year ?
They were after your money. Nothing else. As per civil and educated laws and rules meant for educated and civil folks in the country - a registration is changed so that fines and/or accidents can be traced to the owner easily in that state.

But welcome to the state where greed is bigger then following rules and laws. No change in registration is required, no NOC from original state is required. You only have to pay and they will give you a Tax Card with your MH number with Karnataka State RTO background. That's it.

Imagine the blatant illegality of this by nothing less then a State Government:

1. Now you can never get a refund from your MH state, because logically you never took an NOC and are still registered there.

2. You have two tax paid receipts, that is double taxed. A CRIME!! But a state with tacit support implemented it. The blatant disregard for laws of the country is beyond imagination.

3. Now when you go to change your registration to KA. Though the RTO does not bother, they got your money already. You have to go to MH, get an NOC.
Come back to KA and then ask for a registration change. They will now change your registration. That is you will not get a new RC Card in the new state.

4. No State can ask for Tax without an NOC from the original state. But this minor law is not essential to be followed when the law is made by elected representatives who neither have the knowledge or the sense to verify that whether what we are doing is legal or not. So anything goes. With the voting public by and large behind you with vigilance being top priority of the citizens they are even more fearless.


Quote:
(b) Does getting a Karnataka Registration number necessitate payment of LTT in Karnataka ?
In Karnataka yes. In some other state no. Changing registration and paying Road Tax are two separate entities.

Quote:
I plan to use the vehicle in Karnataka for more than a year. I have already paid the tax. If payment of tax is not mandatory, I would like to initiate legal proceedings to require the money.
A bunch of owners similarly affected and planning something on these lines. Get in touch with Waseem.


NOTE: For the vigilante citizens of Bangalore city, who believe it's their duty to catch Tax Evaders. I have filed for an RTI and got list of corporators who have wealth accumulated beyond their source of Income. Your targets. How many of you can enter their houses and help the police nab them? I can send you guys the addresses and names. Please PM me your names and phone numbers.
Spitfire is offline   (21) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 16th March 2016, 15:05   #128
BHPian
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 44
Thanked: 13 Times
Default Re: Out-of-state cars can run on Karnataka roads for 1 year!

I have one question on re-registration. My two-wheeler is of Chennai registration and I already paid life time tax in Bangalore too where I am using it now. But I did not change the registration to Karnataka yet, still it is Chennai registered.
As per law, is it mandatory to change the registration to Karnataka?
sibitg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th March 2016, 15:22   #129
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: BANG-A-LURE.
Posts: 1,026
Thanked: 2,745 Times
Default

Listen to Rto Chat by Waseem Memon #np on #SoundCloud

https://soundcloud.com/waseem-memon-797449786/rto-chat

A group member went to the RTO with the Judgement copy to get his released

He was told to pay tax and get the vehicle released.

I called and this is what he had to say.

Waseem.

Last edited by SILVERWOOD : 16th March 2016 at 15:27.
SILVERWOOD is offline   (10) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 16th March 2016, 15:51   #130
BHPian
 
johannskaria's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: MH 03 / KL 08
Posts: 596
Thanked: 1,123 Times
Default Re: Out-of-state cars can run on Karnataka roads for 1 year!



A report from malayalam news channel Asianet.

The Karnataka MVD seems to still continue their old attitude ignoring the order.
Their explanation is "We have not received the order in hand officially"!
Eventhough the law was deemed illegal from the start the RTO's are not releasing the vehicles impounded last week. Instead they are insisting the victims whose vehicles impounded to either pay the taxes or get the NOC and register it in KA.

IMO a blatant disrespect of the courts.

Last edited by johannskaria : 16th March 2016 at 15:59.
johannskaria is offline   (5) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 16th March 2016, 16:00   #131
BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: TVM, BLR, HYD
Posts: 477
Thanked: 538 Times
Default Re: Out-of-state cars can run on Karnataka roads for 1 year!

That asianet news video sounds scary. Towards the end, the reporter says that to overcome the deficit faced by the RTA, they are planning to heavily penalize out station vehicles for any violation; regardless of whether they are small or big. Why such narrow mindedness ? Can't every Indian citizen be treated equal ?
sunishsamuel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th March 2016, 16:30   #132
BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: KL-CHN-BLR
Posts: 220
Thanked: 83 Times
Default Re: Out-of-state cars can run on Karnataka roads for 1 year!

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunishsamuel View Post
. Towards the end, the reporter says that to overcome the deficit faced by the RTA, they are planning to heavily penalize out station vehicles for any violation; regardless of whether they are small or big
Don't think that would be possible? Will they re-define traffic violations accordingly? e.g. for KA registered vehicles jumping a red light, the fine would be 500 bucks and for non KA registration 1000?

But you never know , anything is possible with these guys.
aajohn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th March 2016, 19:28   #133
Distinguished - BHPian
 
supremeBaleno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Weekdays@Chennai, Weekends@Kerala
Posts: 5,093
Thanked: 1,421 Times
Default Re: Out-of-state cars can run on Karnataka roads for 1 year!

Thank you Silverwood, for taking this cause up and getting a judicial remedy.
Hope this leads to a situation where one can register a vehicle in any state, pay the tax there and drive anywhere in the country without being harassed.

On one side we have a union of countries (EU) that allow smooth movement of people, vehicles, goods etc across countries.
And then we have our country, where we have states that work to make life difficult for citizens to travel across their own country.

Peel apart the very thin veil of patriotism that most of us project and you will see various divisions crop up (as seen on this thread too) - based on the state we belong to, the language we
speak, the religion we follow, the denominations within the religion, the caste we belong to, the economic strata we are part of, the profession we belong to etc etc - the list is endless.
Given all these fault-lines within us, it is surprising we still exist as one nation. With citizens like us, the country does not need any external threats to screw up things.
supremeBaleno is offline   (6) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 16th March 2016, 21:05   #134
BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 284
Thanked: 228 Times
Default Re: Out-of-state cars can run on Karnataka roads for 1 year!

Quote:
Originally Posted by poloman View Post
I am all for drive with out borders. But here the issue is how long you can stay with out registering an out of state car in Karnataka. A gentleman from Goa has reacted passionately few pages back with out giving a thought to why his own home state charge Rs250 as entry fees for every vehicle for reasons only known to them.
A period of 30 days for paying LTT will sound harsh but if you extent to 1 year, every one is gonna claim they have been in the city for less than a year. All they may need is a toll receipt from visiting another state which any way every one is going to undertake at least once in a year.
What we need rules for ease of refund from the parent state and option to pay taxes for short durations in the state where you are staying.
Once a car has been registered and tax paid anywhere in India, there should be absolutely no need to ever pay any tax anywhere later on. All states should accept the principle of reciprocity as some vehicles would pay tax in state A and move to B and others would do the reverse. After all we are one nation. Instead we should work on linking the records of RTOs across India so that a citation can be issued to an out of state vehicle in the same manner as it is issued to one from the same state. All we need is to make it compulsory to update ones address with the revlevant government body after living in another state for over one year.
Lobogris is offline   (3) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 16th March 2016, 23:11   #135
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: BANG-A-LURE.
Posts: 1,026
Thanked: 2,745 Times
Default Re: Out-of-state cars can run on Karnataka roads for 1 year!

Dear Friends,

I have received the certified copy of the Judgement from our lawyer this evening.

I will scan and upload the same tomorrow.

Waseem Memon
SILVERWOOD is offline   (9) Thanks Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Where should I sell the car: State of Registration or Current State? m_upreti The Indian Car Scene 50 12th July 2016 17:38
Buy car in state or out of state (Major price difference) autoenthusiast The Indian Car Scene 20 17th March 2016 13:45
Buying a CV from State A and registering in State B Aravindpn Commercial Vehicles 7 30th November 2010 15:04


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 15:41.

Copyright 2000 - 2016, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks