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Old 6th July 2017, 10:29   #151
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Default Re: Power minister wants India to become 100% e-vehicle nation by 2030

Originally Posted by darklord View Post
Looks like Ministry of Petroleum and Natural Gas has other plans:

IOC, BPCL, HPCL ink $40 bn deal to set up world’s largest refinery, petrochemical complex
Not necessarily applicable to urban transport sector. Whole range of sectors will still be dependent on refined oil even post 2030.

1. Agriculture: diesel pumps, tractors, gensets
2. Shipping: big marine diesels
3. Defence: tanks, telars, reconnaisance, fighters, transport airplanes.
4. Civil Aviation: ATF will still be dominant
6. Power Sector: There will still be diesel gensets, naphta power turbines in critical peak load applications

Only personal transportation in big cities, towns, and offgrid villages need to turn totally to electric and electric hybrid/CNG by 2030.
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Old 7th July 2017, 18:41   #152
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Default Re: Power minister wants India to become 100% e-vehicle nation by 2030

They consume too much fuel.
These engines simply do not have the range needed.
They will cause too much pollution.
The engines require too many exotic minerals (today known as rare earths) to be mass produced.
The MTBO (Mean Time Between Overhaul) is poor.
The weight of the fuel is so high that there is not enough carrying capacity left for an economic payload.

Comments in 2017 on Electric Cars on T_BHP?? .....read on....

They will frighten the passengers.
The runways are not long enough.
They are way too expensive - the average airline cannot afford them.
Airports will not invest in the infrastructure to accommodate them.
(and my favourite) Why would any one want to risk flying across the Atlantic when you can sail across in the comfort of an ocean liner.

Go into the detailed history of aviation and these are comments from old (very old) magazines on whether jet engines should be introduced to airliners. These comments are all from the late 1940s. They sound very similar to comments today on electric cars.

An analogy from my profession -in 1950 aero engines were primarily pistons with the turbo-compound being at the leading edge and many top airliners (DC-6, DC-7, Constellation, Convair 440) persisted on with them. For that era they were reliable and had very good F.E. . Turbine power (ie Jets) had come into the military by mid-1940s and through the Rolls Royce Dart turbo prop engine to commercial airliners by 1953 but the pistons continued to dominate. In 2 years between 1959 and 1961 the first generation jet airliners (Boeing 707, Douglas DC-8, Caravelle) so over took the market, in one sweep, that the prime piston engine fleets of 1958 became the secondary fleet of 1961 and the cargo fleet of 1964. The change was sudden and complete. And mind you the fuel efficiency of the early jets was poor compared to the pistons but speed, passenger comfort, vibrations, cabin noise all won the day. I know retail market for cars is different but sharing a concept of how an idea whose time has come can sweep the floor.

I am not arguing here about how green is the source of original power or how the used batteries will be disposed or recycled. These are real issues and cannot be wished away. But the power of economics and law will bring about these changes eventually in a mere 20 years.

As many of us are trying to predict what will happen on E.V.'s I conclude with philosophical quotes from two leading men from my profession.

"I confess that in 1901, I said to my brother Orville that man would not fly for fifty years… . Ever since, I have distrusted myself and avoided all predictions."

— Wilbur Wright, in a speech to the Aero Club of France, 5 November 1908.

"Science has not yet mastered prophecy. We predict too much for the next year and yet far too little for the next ten."

— Neil Armstrong, speech to joint session of Congress, 16 September 1969

Last edited by V.Narayan : 7th July 2017 at 18:58.
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Old 10th July 2017, 22:56   #153
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Default Re: Power minister wants India to become 100% e-vehicle nation by 2030

As already explained electricity by solar panel feeding to grid will be easy due to lower cost of infrastructure and better throughput due to technology evolution over a period. Once combined this with energy storage and charging station availability electric vehicles will be very feasible.

Things that need to be solved are
1. Infra creation for charging stations. This means rules and laws for (STD/ISD like booths) retailers.
2. Fast charging solutions. (expensive infra is still ok since people will recover the cost periodically when clubbed by incentives via loans)
3. Rare earth material issues
4. recycling issues of Lithium batteries.
5. heavy vehicle technology for trucks and tractors, excavators etc.
6. Grid robustness to ensure high availability
7. power management for low solar energy areas (cloudy)

What will this bring
1. Very high reduction of noise pollution due to no noise from engine
2. horn volume could also be reduced since the ambient noise itself is low. (Tricky)
3. Difference engineering and maintenance skills and job creation.
4. Reduction of the ambient temperature of roads.
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