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Old 17th May 2016, 18:15   #91
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Default Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Edit: ZERO for all

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Originally Posted by SoumenD View Post
I am waiting with bated breath & hope to see the results for India spec BALENO, as I have been eyeing it since its launch but was waiting for NCAP test results of the India-Spec one.
Here's the crash test of India manufactured Baleno.

It scored 3 stars. How does the Indian spec vary in terms of structural strength?

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Old 17th May 2016, 18:17   #92
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Default Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Edit: ZERO for all

And lame duck statements from Mahindra & Renault roll in. BIG FAIL!

We should tell the CEOs of these companies to use their own zero-rating cars on Indian highways. Reminds me of a board I saw in a restaurant once that went The owner of this restaurant eats here too. Am sure that doesn't apply to the guys who built these cars.

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All Mahindra Automotive products are developed and manufactured to meet or exceed the safety standards set in India for a safe driving experience. In fact, many models exceed the expected regulations of 2019.

The star rating as released by Global NCAP (GNCAP) in the latest crash test was conducted on non-airbags variant of the Scorpio. Typically, in any star rating process, non-airbag variants do not perform well on safety standards.

Most variants of the Scorpio are equipped with airbags and a safety package. Approximately 75% of Scorpio customers choose the air bags variants of the vehicle.

There is nothing more important to us than our customer’s safety. We are committed to meeting and exceeding all current and future safety norms and in most cases giving our customers choice of enhanced safety beyond the regulated standards.
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GNCAP recognizes Renault’s efforts of working towards Safer Cars in India

GNCAP announced their results today and welcomed Renault’s efforts and commitment to safety enhancement. Safety is of paramount importance for Renault and all our products meet and exceed the requisite safety standards set by Indian Regulatory Authorities. India is gradually moving towards international safety norms by including more robust safety regulations and the assurance of the Bharat NCAP is a positive step in this direction. As a customer-focused company, Renault fully supports this initiative and we are already future-ready in terms of technology, design and engineering for enhanced safety for all our vehicles. Indian Government has announced that the crash test regulation for the existing cars will come into effect in 2019 and for the new cars in 2017 . Renault is committed to comply with these timelines.

Last edited by GTO : 17th May 2016 at 18:18.
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Old 17th May 2016, 18:25   #93
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Default Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Edit: ZERO for all

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
What horrific videos! The Kwid crumpled like tissue paper, although its direct competitors (Alto, Eon etc.) fare no better.
As things stand today, if you want safety under 4 lakh rupees, your best bet is the pre-owned car market.
Absolutely! The pre-owned market has so much value to offer.
What is surprising is that car makers in India have not devoted marketing budgets for publicizing safety features. If someone wants to know the safest car in every segment, there's no metric today. Companies keep harping on about the remote-boot release and touch screen entertainment but don't realize that people will respond most positively to information about safety.

Most car buyers don't care about safety because they don't know its importance. If they knew that India tops the list of road fatalities, they would definitely care. People spend thousands on doing a good Puja for their new car. They would definitely spend a few thousands more for 2 airbags.

In the used car segment there are so many cars that did not do well in the market and yet make great purchases. There are models that are a generation old but offer 6 airbags. It is a much, much better place to shop in for budget conscious customers like me.
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Old 17th May 2016, 18:49   #94
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Thumbs up Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Edit: ZERO for all

India to introduce new car assessment program likely to be known as 'Bharat NCAP'

Details of the program will be made public in the next 10 days according to Abhay Damle, Joint Secretary, Ministry of Road Transport & Highways (MoRTH)

The proposed speed for offset frontal crash testing vehicles under Bharat NCAP is 56kph which is lower than Global NCAPís proposal of 64kph

AV Mannikar, Senior Deputy Director, Automotive Research Association of India (ARAI) confirms that the safety rating may include 2 & 3 wheelers too

http://www.autocarindia.com/auto-new...me-401943.aspx
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Old 17th May 2016, 18:51   #95
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Default Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Edit: ZERO for all

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
The star rating as released by Global NCAP (GNCAP) in the latest crash test was conducted on non-airbags variant of the Scorpio. Typically, in any star rating process, non-airbag variants do not perform well on safety standards.
So why sell those variants, knowing it could kill the driver?
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Old 17th May 2016, 18:51   #96
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Default Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Edit: ZERO for all

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
And lame duck statements from Mahindra & Renault roll in. BIG FAIL!

We should tell the CEOs of these companies to use their own zero-rating cars on Indian highways. Reminds me of a board I saw in a restaurant once that went The owner of this restaurant eats here too. Am sure that doesn't apply to the guys who built these cars.
The tests also show airbag or not Scorpio remains an unsafe car. It still cant believe how much the passenger compartment was compromised.

Last edited by Rudra Sen : 17th May 2016 at 19:06. Reason: typo corrected
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Old 17th May 2016, 18:54   #97
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Default Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Edit: ZERO for all

Are NCAP results published in the newspapers? I never read about NCAP or any other safety rating related news in the papers ever although car launch related news and car ads are always in plenty. If not, then a major factor of lack of awareness among people is low media coverage. After all, what proportion of actual car buyers visit automotive websites or forums like TBHP. So until media takes up the awareness part, no adverse rating will affect car sales and we'll continue to get sub-standard cars. Or is the media not interested in these tests because car dealers and manufacturers give them a lot of front page and back page coloured ads?
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Old 17th May 2016, 18:58   #98
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Default Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Edit: ZERO for all

This is such an eye opener for all of us!! What do the experience BHPians suggest the owners of the respective car owners? They have invested heavily and the car is not safe, including myself. I have a genx nano. How do we plan to move to a safer car ? What precautions should we take with our current unsafer cars?
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Old 17th May 2016, 18:59   #99
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Default Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Edit: ZERO for all

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Originally Posted by TD_GHY View Post
Are NCAP results published in the newspapers?
If they publish and bash cars which failed - How they will get their advertisement revenue?
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Old 17th May 2016, 19:05   #100
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Default Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Results on 17th May

No surprises here - No, not even the Scorpio.

In days when even international models see so much of corners cut in India, I do not India specific models to get any special treatment. I am always of the belief that weight of the car, thickness of panels, thud of the door are immaterial to the real-world safety of the car. Above might give you a sense of safety but may not really be safe. Safety is more about engineering and design. How else can you explain 4 star rating for Etios and 0 star for Scorpio?

Over the weekend I was telling my wife how unsafe these Kwids are when I see them flying around at 100+ kmph in the highways. This car sells so much that I saw more Kwids on highways than Cretas or Balenos. Test results just reinforces my belief. This car is not highway ready. I am really happy I managed to dissuade a friend of mine who was hell bent on buying this VFM car as it looked great and had good GC. I just told him VFM aside, VFL (L for Life - just in case you are in doubt) is too less in this car.

Seeing such lame explanations from manufacturers that they meet and in fact exceed the (nonexistent) safety regulations of the country is such a shame. Why don't they have the guts to own it up and assure that they will work on their cars being more road-worthy. I mean, they can just say "We respect the GNCAP for testing our cars and for coming up with their ratings. As a company committed to regulations, we had always designed our cars to meet and exceed the local safety regulations. However, we are extremely saddened to see that it is not meeting some global standards. As a responsible manufacturer committed for passenger safety, we will look into the findings seriously and continue working on the design to make them more safe and suitable to match global standards." Probably impossible in real world - but come on, you need to have the guts to own your actions.

In addition to the base models, I would like to see test results of mid and top variants of more Indian made premium cars like:
  • Maruti
    • Ertiga
    • Baleno
    • Brezza
    • Ciaz
    • S-Cross
  • Hyundai
    • Grand i10 / Xcent
    • i20
    • Verna
    • Creta
  • Honda
    • City
    • Mobilio / BR-V
  • Mahindra
    • TUV300
    • XUV500
  • Renault / Nissan
    • Scala / Sunny
    • Duster / Terrano
  • Ford
    • Ecosport
    • Aspire
  • Toyota
    • Corolla
    • Innova
  • Tata
    • Bolt / Zest
    • Aria / Hexa

Last edited by Vigkey : 17th May 2016 at 19:08.
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Old 17th May 2016, 19:06   #101
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Default Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Edit: ZERO for all

It is not only cars, transportation sector on the whole is so unsafe in India. Have you looked at the condition of state transport or private buses. Safety in railways is altogether a different issue.

I now have to do a return journey from Jalandhar to Delhi every week and sometimes twice. Looking at the options I have, can't help but feel that I willingly put my life in high risk atleast two times a week.

While I am at it, why are no seat belts provided in buses? Even in the high end buses, I do remember waking up from slumber because my head banged against something when the driver did a hard stop.

PS: That car Scorpio - gosh its not even funny any more. That mighty muscular thing. Oh man!

Last edited by GTO : 18th May 2016 at 08:52. Reason: Sorry, but we cannot allow running down any particular region (e.g. Jammu). Please avoid
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Old 17th May 2016, 19:09   #102
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Default Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Edit: ZERO for all

Damn, just the look of that running board on kwid 1 bending under impact is enough to give nightmares. Wonder why do these manufacturers take people for a ride in the name of making cars affordable. Seems like the body frame itself is different the way the two cars compare here
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Old 17th May 2016, 19:13   #103
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Default Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Edit: ZERO for all

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
And lame duck statements from Mahindra & Renault roll in. BIG FAIL!

Quote:
The star rating as released by Global NCAP (GNCAP) in the latest crash test was conducted on non-airbags variant of the Scorpio. Typically, in any star rating process, non-airbag variants do not perform well on safety standards.
If that's the case, why don't they ship an Scorpio S10 for a test immediately? (VW did that after the test on the base version of the Polo. The Polo with the airbags did reasonably well.)

The structure of the scorpio is unstable. Airbags are going to be of little help.

I would like to see the Baleno, Jazz, i20, Amaze, City, Ciaz, BR-V and Creta being tested.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vigkey View Post
Safety is more about engineering and design. How else can you explain 4 star rating for Etios and 0 star for Scorpio?
Exactly why I use Etios as an example when people talk about thick body panels.

Quote:
Toyota
  • Corolla
  • Innova
I don't think the Toyotas will fare poorly. If there's anything to fault, it'll be missing side airbags in the Corolla and a few missing electronic aids.

Last edited by landcruiser123 : 17th May 2016 at 19:21.
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Old 17th May 2016, 19:14   #104
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Default Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Edit: ZERO for all

I have a thought which may well be tangential to the current outrage over Indian cars failing global NCAP tests. As far as I know the NCAP tests are conducted from frontal impact at 60 odd kmph, and a lateral collision/offset collision at a particular speed and the cars to pass have to ensure cabin deformity is minimal and occupants inside are safe/suffer minimal injury.
That is all good, but what about actual Indian road conditions? A quick glance on the accidents in India thread show BMW/Mercedes/Audi and all high end cars crumpling like tin cans and killing occupants inside simply because they hit a truck/bus chassis and there was no way that the car could have protected the occupants from the impact. Our trucks/buses have zero under run protection, have metal angles attached to the chassis, the body itself is higher than most car roofs, basically we have no standards pertaining to their build let alone safety. Likewise our roads, the objects next to roads like houses, lamp posts, culverts, trees etc are not designed/placed scientifically. Most of our roads have no restriction barriers, no runoff areas, no protections for high speed travel. Yet we continue to pay obnoxious tolls just to ensure a smooth double laned journey.
We must ensure we get NCAP equivalent crash protection law, but that's not enough. Until we redesign our roads, and ensure idiotically designed trucks/buses/carts are not off the roads, the accident and death statistics will remain as it is, even if we all drive the world's safest cars with the highest NCAP ratings.
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Old 17th May 2016, 19:23   #105
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Default Re: More Indian cars face Global NCAP crash tests. Edit: ZERO for all

Scorpio not safe is not a new thing. Remember Scorpio pickup couldnt pass launch in USA due to safety failure, even with airbags.

Hence the need for Mahindra to have a better product with XUV500. I would be keen to see the results for XUV 500 version from India. Unfortunately, there is none.

Airbags in these cars, why are the manufacturers fooling people with airbags when they do nothing to save the people in frontal crash. No point in integrating the airbags, its just to fool people to think that their car is safe.

GTO rightly said, 2nd hand cars would be better, cars such as Corolla, Civic and others. But the question, how is their NCAP ratings for Indian version? We know for US version of these cars, the ratings are top notch, but have no idea on the Indian spec version.
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