Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > The Indian Car Scene


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 17th May 2016, 07:09   #1
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Chennai
Posts: 422
Thanked: 249 Times
Default Rumour: Renault stops Kwid production due to engine problems (excessive noise)

http://m.timesofindia.com/business/i...w/52301328.cms
Quote:
According to vendor and dealer sources, the French car maker is learnt to have scrapped 1,500 engines due to high noise levels and not a single Kwid car, which has a waitlist at the consumer end of at least 5 months -- has been produced since May 11.
Surprised to see this article in the newspaper. Problems early in this stage isn't a good sign, especially with the engine. It talks about noise but not sure what exactly is the problem. May be KWID owners here can tell their personal experiences.

I hope Renault addresses this issue quickly and starts rolling out the car again. For its a wonderful product, especially with the 1 liter around the corner they should pay closer attention to vendors and quality management. It appears they identified the issue during their internal QA checks which is a good sign.

Last edited by noopster : 17th May 2016 at 14:00. Reason: Added an excerpt from the article in quotes
Chillout is offline   (11) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 17th May 2016, 08:41   #2
OSH
BHPian
 
OSH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 194
Thanked: 349 Times
Default re: Rumour: Renault stops Kwid production due to engine problems (excessive noise)

The good thing is, them acting upon the issue and trying to resolve it. The Kwid is a small peppy little car doing really good for Renault going by the monthy sales, they will surely not let it's image fall. At the same time I hope that it is not a major problem as a huge number of cars have already reached the streets, yes some minor issues are going to crop up with a newly developed engine but it should not affect reliability.

Can the owners please give their views on the noise they mentioned, have you'll faced any problem till now ?
OSH is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 17th May 2016, 08:56   #3
BHPian
 
AutoNoob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: NCR
Posts: 208
Thanked: 207 Times
Default re: Rumour: Renault stops Kwid production due to engine problems (excessive noise)

Quote:
The company for its part said that the production stoppage was part of "regular maintenance" and that delivery of the Kwid will not be impacted by the stoppage of production. "The plant conducted regular maintenance in the month of May," ... However, according to Renault filings with the Tamil Nadu state government, the planned shutdown is only from May 21-29 whereas Kwid production has stopped from May 11 onwards.
This is the worrying part, seems like the company is not telling the complete story. I just hope this is just limited to some noise issue, but scrapping 1500 engines just for noise issue ? No reworking / repair ? Something doesn't add up. I hope the vehicles in the market are not affected.
AutoNoob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th May 2016, 13:32   #4
GTO
Team-BHP Support
 
GTO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 47,755
Thanked: 89,446 Times
Default Re: Rumour: Renault stops Kwid production due to engine problems (excessive noise)

Anshuman just came back from the redi-GO drive and he complained of excessive engine noise. At first, I thought it might just be poor insulation. Hoping that it wasn't related to this problematic batch of engines. If so, that's a poor start for the redi-GO which Datsun has a lot riding on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chillout View Post
they should pay closer attention to vendors and quality management. It appears they identified the issue during their internal QA checks which is a good sign.
Well said, 100% agreed. Good of them to catch it in the factory and get rid of the problematic motors.
GTO is offline   (8) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 17th May 2016, 21:14   #5
BHPian
 
YashD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Pune, Kolkata
Posts: 301
Thanked: 262 Times
Default Re: Rumour: Renault stops Kwid production due to engine problems (excessive noise)

Brilliant move by Renault to suspend the production until the problem is rectified and it also shows how closely the manufacturer is paying attention to the Internal QA Checks but then again on the other hand scrapping 1500 engines is a huge deal! Couldn't they be repaired or had some changes? The Kwid already has a noisy engine and I can imagine how much more it would have increased that the company took such drastic step. Now, it also arises further more questions on the vehicle's long term reliability, It is quite a possibility now that the existing engine may also have this problem after a couple of years down the line! Even they could get noisier, what will the manufacturer do then? Should Renault issue a Recall for the last couple of batches produced just for being on the safe side or is it planning to change it's vendor to avoid such happenings!
The company cannot take any kind of risk with the Kwid as the demand for the vehicle is extremely high and furthermore, the manufacturer is soon launching the AMT and 1.0L variants too which means the demand is further going to increase. The manufacturer is already not able to handle such high demands and are doing their best to supply as many vehicles as possible and if such problems occurs in the future, a lot of potential customers are going to turn over to other products creating quite a negative image of the manufacturer.

Last edited by YashD : 17th May 2016 at 21:16.
YashD is offline   (3) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 18th May 2016, 03:22   #6
RSR
Distinguished - BHPian
 
RSR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Chennai
Posts: 1,621
Thanked: 4,538 Times
Default Re: Rumour: Renault stops Kwid production due to engine problems (excessive noise)

I thoroughly appreciate Renault for identifying the fault at the factory itself and taking remedial measures by scrapping an entire batch of engines. The Kwid has an extremely high level of localisation (~ 98%), and it's possible that one of Renault's vendors (or even a department within Renault-Nissan) messed up with some part(s) when they were asked to ramp up production rapidly in order to shorten the Kwid's long waiting periods.

I hope no engine from the affected batch made its way into any production version of the Kwid or its soon to be launched cousin (redi-GO).

Having said that, let me play the devil's advocate here.

According to sources from Renault's vendors & dealers:

Quote:
The French car maker is learnt to have scrapped 1,500 engines due to high noise levels and not a single Kwid car, which has a waitlist at the consumer end of at least 5 months -- has been produced since May 11.
On a related but different note, Global NCAP recently tested 3 different versions of the Kwid. Despite steady noticeable improvements in the way they fared in the 64 kmph frontal offset crash test, all of them scored 0* in adult occupant protection with structures that were classified as unstable. However, G-NCAP have added that Renault is indeed committed to improving the Kwid in order to achieve an acceptable level of safety in the G-NCAP test.

According to G-NCAP:

Quote:
Renault has confirmed that they will implement further improvements to the Kwid and Global NCAP will test these new evolutions in forthcoming crash tests.

Kwid (IV) yet to be tested by Global NCAP produced from May 9th 2016
(from VIN No. MEEBBA008G5362695)
Note the two highlighted dates. Is it a strange coincidence of the two different issues? Or is there more to it than meets the eye?

My guess - I believe the production stoppage may not be only because of the engine noise issue, but also because they're upgrading/making small changes to the production line/process in order to churn out new Kwids that would be able to score decently on the G-NCAP crash test.

I hope the new Kwids come equipped with a driver airbag as standard fitment (and a passenger airbag as an option) and that the Kwid (IV) is able to achieve at least a 2* adult occupant safety rating with G-NCAP, if not a 3* one.

And yes, I hope the structural changes to the Kwid (IV) are also carried over to the Datsun redi-GO, and that it too achieves a similar crash test rating.

If customers who've booked the Kwid have to wait a bit longer, then so be it. If the redi-GO's launch needs to be postponed as well, then so be it. If the cost of the two cars (all variants) has to be raised by a few thousand rupees or so, then so be it. If the Kwid and redi-GO put on a fair amount of weight because of the structural improvements, causing them to lose one or two kmpl on ARAI's FE test, then so be it.

Purchasing a safer Kwid or redi-GO which is able to achieve a decent G-NCAP rating would be well worth such relatively minor inconveniences. I'm sure most potential Kwid & redi-GO buyers (at least here on Team-BHP) would agree with me on this.

Last edited by RSR : 18th May 2016 at 03:41.
RSR is offline   (6) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 18th May 2016, 09:19   #7
Senior - BHPian
 
aniketi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Pune
Posts: 1,270
Thanked: 711 Times
Default Re: Rumour: Renault stops Kwid production due to engine problems (excessive noise)

That is why QA is needed. Most companies don't do it properly or ignore QA results or suggestions. If you do it internally first, chances of failing it in real world are less. QA need to be treated as end customer and their concerns should be addressed to make product better. Sometime i wonder if QA happenes or not for some silly things some companies do in real world.
aniketi is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 18th May 2016, 12:02   #8
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Tejas@perioimpl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bombay
Posts: 3,969
Thanked: 4,932 Times
Default Re: Rumour: Renault stops Kwid production due to engine problems (excessive noise)

And now it fails all NCAP safety tests! Not going well for a vehicle named car of the year by Autocar India.
Tejas@perioimpl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th May 2016, 12:06   #9
Distinguished - BHPian
 
CrAzY dRiVeR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Bangalore / TVM
Posts: 8,974
Thanked: 16,772 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tejas@perioimpl View Post
And now it fails all NCAP safety tests! Not going well for a vehicle named car of the year by Autocar India.
Was our choice as well for the Team Bhp car of the year, with a huge majority of votes in favour - 29.28% of 2363 voters.

Last edited by CrAzY dRiVeR : 18th May 2016 at 12:07.
CrAzY dRiVeR is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 18th May 2016, 14:59   #10
GTO
Team-BHP Support
 
GTO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 47,755
Thanked: 89,446 Times
Default Re: Rumour: Renault stops Kwid production due to engine problems (excessive noise)

Renault drops the following letter via email:

Quote:
Clarification: Renault India would like to bring to notice that the news article titled ‘Renault Halts KWID Output’ that appeared in Times of India yesterday is factually incorrect and misleading. The article claims that 1,500 engines have been scrapped due to high noise levels. This is incorrect and we have had no such concerns at our end.

Renault India recently ramped up production at our Chennai facility by starting third shift operations to cater to market demand. Moreover we are also increasing the speed of our production line. In addition to our maintenance shutdown planned towards the end of May Renault India have decided to slow down production since last week in order to ensure a perfect execution of the ramp up of our production volumes.

Renault India would like to reiterate and reinforce that we remain fully confident in the mid and long-term growth prospects for our business in India. Over the next few years, Renault India will further strengthen its position in the market and be a significant player in India's dynamic auto market.

Last edited by GTO : 18th May 2016 at 20:47. Reason: Updating statement
GTO is offline   (18) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 19th May 2016, 05:51   #11
BHPian
 
YashD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Pune, Kolkata
Posts: 301
Thanked: 262 Times
Default Re: Rumour: Renault stops Kwid production due to engine problems (excessive noise)

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Renault drops the following letter via email:
A brilliant move by Renault India for responding so quickly, I strongly feel TOI should apologize the manufacturer for creating mis-leading articles and setting up a negative perspective among car buyers. The auto enthusiasts will get to know about it via various social media platforms used but what about the mango people?
Renault India should sue TOI for defamation and printing false news.
YashD is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 19th May 2016, 07:53   #12
Senior - BHPian
 
girishglg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: KA-05
Posts: 1,079
Thanked: 425 Times
Default Re: Rumour: Renault stops Kwid production due to engine problems (excessive noise)

Quote:
Clarification: Renault India would like to bring to notice that the news article titled ‘Renault Halts KWID Output’ that appeared in Times of India yesterday is factually incorrect and misleading. The article claims that 1,500 engines have been scrapped due to high noise levels. This is incorrect and we have had no such concerns at our end.
Quote:
Originally Posted by YashD View Post
The auto enthusiasts will get to know about it via various social media platforms used but what about the mango people?
Renault India should sue TOI for defamation and printing false news.
Completely agree, the main stream media regularly post false news and agendas depending on their vested and commercial interests. May be its a ploy planted by Renaults biggest rivals, you guess who.

Also if there is any truth of the engine issue then more skeletons would tumble out of the closet. If so sooner or later there would be a vehicle recall to check / replace the cars that are already on road. So we have to wait and see.

But have to say after driving a Kwid for a long time, I did feel higher engine noise even more than my 2000 model year M800. I did express this to my friend who owns the car. Incidentally there are 3 of my friends who own a Kwid now and have driven all of them with a similar feeling.
girishglg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th May 2016, 08:46   #13
Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Delhi
Posts: 18
Thanked: 110 Times
Default Re: Rumour: Renault stops Kwid production due to engine problems (excessive noise)

I own a Kwid and i do believe that the Engine noise is actually quite high (by todays standards). In my opinion it is as noisy as my 14 year old Alto 1.1.

Slightly unrelated to the topic. I was one of the few peeps who pre booked a Kwid and got the delivery in October 2015. My heart sank when i watched the youtube video of Kwid (1) and how the structure collapses unlike the one on Kids produced since April 2016 where they have made structural modifications and reinforcements . Both of them scored 0 but the ones manufactured after April 2016 fare much better.

My question here is that Will Renault OR actually CAN Renault do something about the Kids produced before April 2016 ? . Since it is clear from the videos that they have very cleverly made mods and not let this news slip out in public.

Seeking appropriate action because i just feel its wrong that i have to pay the price for being one of the first believers in the brand

Thanks

Regards
Abhinav R
Abhinav R is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 19th May 2016, 21:06   #14
BHPian
 
Tanmay K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: HR-26, UK-07
Posts: 197
Thanked: 169 Times
Default Re: Rumour: Renault stops Kwid production due to engine problems (excessive noise)

Quote:
Originally Posted by YashD View Post
Renault India should sue TOI for defamation and printing false news.
Anytime I read something on TOI, I read it with a pinch of salt. Much better sources of journalism around than them for sure.

I see that India Today have taken down their article about this from their site. As of now, it's just TOI and people quoting them who are spreading around this "news".


Quote:
Originally Posted by Abhinav R View Post
I own a Kwid and i do believe that the Engine noise is actually quite high (by todays standards). In my opinion it is as noisy as my 14 year old Alto 1.1.
When I test drove the car, it didn't seem as quiet as the Wagon R's for example, but it wasn't intrusively loud either I think.

Quote:
My question here is that Will Renault OR actually CAN Renault do something about the Kids produced before April 2016 ?
Making structural changes does not seem possible at this point. Yes, it seems there is a bit of a difference between these Kwids but one should understand that these tests are not carried out on a large scale. If were to crash test 50-60 Kwid I's, I think some of them might fare better than this particular one and some perhaps even worse than the one we saw in the video. What really matters is the averages. Let's hope the averages are not too bad. We'll never know.

I wish we could do Monte Carlo simulation based crash tests.

Out in the real world, I think missing out on these "improvements" are not something that should stop you from enjoying your new vehicle. Drive safe and try to make sure you never have to use those airbags.

Last edited by Tanmay K : 19th May 2016 at 21:08.
Tanmay K is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Renault to start 3rd shift for Kwid's production Tushar The Indian Car Scene 6 8th December 2016 19:19
The Renault Kwid 1.0L. EDIT: Launched at Rs. 3.83 lakhs! Aditya The Indian Car Scene 94 28th August 2016 01:22
Excessive Tire Noise dhinchak Tyre & Alloy wheel Section 16 11th January 2013 11:30
Cabin noise at cruising speed (120) excessive or normal MB-Sting Technical Stuff 4 12th February 2009 11:44


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 18:45.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks