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Old 23rd May 2016, 22:20   #31
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Shell shocked! Why Kochi?!.
If they are serious about pollution in the first place they should ban all these buses which causes a lot more pollution than a car!. Seriously a bad idea if you ask me.

Edit: I just read "Major cities In Kerala". Kerala is a very small states and many of these cities aren't that far at all.It takes merely a few hours from one city to another. And think about it, how many people in India buy their cars just to do household errands in their village?!. Pure nonsense if you ask me.

Last edited by VRPAI : 23rd May 2016 at 22:40.
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Old 23rd May 2016, 22:21   #32
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Default re: NGT bans 10+ year old diesel vehicles in Kerala. EDIT: High Court stays ban

Nice, they excluded public transport vehicles, new ones atleast. In true NIMBY fashion, environmentalists don't know any other way, local authority vehicles are also exempt, so the tribunal members can still roll in style.

No wonder a cabinet minister was complaining about over reach by certain institutions, populated by experts without any accountability.
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Old 23rd May 2016, 22:23   #33
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Default re: NGT bans 10+ year old diesel vehicles in Kerala. EDIT: High Court stays ban

This is pretty frustrating. I am seriously thinking of canceling my Innova Crysta booking as I am worried about its future. I decided to purchase it from a purely long term perspective (atleast 10+ years of usage) and what if someone decides to ban big cars that are 5 years old in Tamilnadu tomorrow. It is getting very confusing to say the least from a long term buyer's point of view.
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Old 23rd May 2016, 22:46   #34
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Default re: NGT bans 10+ year old diesel vehicles in Kerala. EDIT: High Court stays ban

This was the very reason why I cancelled my plan to buy XUV at the very last moment.With new rules coming in there can be a day when the judiciary orders no diesel car on the roads. This is not the way to go, there should be proper scientific facts and figures before making such a judgement.
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Old 23rd May 2016, 22:56   #35
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Default re: NGT bans 10+ year old diesel vehicles in Kerala. EDIT: High Court stays ban

I am in a terrible fix after having paid for my Crysta !! The vehicle has been allotted and just waiting for insurance papers after which it will be taken for temporary registration. I have no idea if I should cancel it or go ahead with the registration.

The reason why I think I should go ahead is that if the rule is in force then people would simply start booking from non-city locations. The car can be used for 10 years and that is reasonable. Resale may be possible only to out stations.

Why I should not is reduced resale vale . Spare parts availability may be questionable if the model does not sell well. And over and above if I would be left in between hell and the sea if I do not get permanent registration after having taken the temporary registration!!!
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Old 23rd May 2016, 23:03   #36
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I have seen plenty of used innovas getting re registered in Kerala. Is this order to discourage such move by used car vendors ?
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Old 23rd May 2016, 23:23   #37
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Default re: NGT bans 10+ year old diesel vehicles in Kerala. EDIT: High Court stays ban

A verdict in the right direction. Two aspects,diesel and SUV.

Diesel-As long as fuel is subsidised, diesel cars which are also polluters should be discouraged. Diesel subsidy is from the exchequer and the tax given by an adivasi could be used to subsidise the fuel in a Landcruiser or Fortuner, ironic because the adivasi may not be able to pay for two square meals a day. Since removing diesel subsidy altogether would sent prices spiralling up,such cars have to be discouraged by other ways.Economically its wrong to extract the cost of a product from someone who has not used that commodity.

2000Cc-rules out bigger cars like SUVs from getting reregistered. In India where road space is a premium SUVs should be sold in such a way that buyers feel the pinch and think twice before buying one.

Diesel suvs will face the brunt which is a good thing. Mr Jairam Ramesh,former minister for environment had made similar remarks about Diesels.

Last edited by GTO : 24th May 2016 at 11:09. Reason: Typos
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Old 23rd May 2016, 23:32   #38
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Default re: NGT bans 10+ year old diesel vehicles in Kerala. EDIT: High Court stays ban

The NGT is headed by clowns and these rehabilitated (most are retired and rehabilitated) members of the judiciary are making a fool of themselves by issuing such dictates.

Lets only hope that a higher forum either legal or executive will come to the rescue and nullify such idiotic scraps of printed paper.
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Old 23rd May 2016, 23:37   #39
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Default re: NGT bans 10+ year old diesel vehicles in Kerala. EDIT: High Court stays ban

Quote:
Originally Posted by ece2k2 View Post
This is pretty frustrating. I am seriously thinking of canceling my Innova Crysta booking as I am worried about its future. I
Quote:
Originally Posted by kutts View Post
I am in a terrible fix after having paid for my Crysta !! !
My dad is also in a similar situation. He wanted to buy Corolla automatic instead of Crysta, now. My mom always wanted a sedan in the first place. I am the one who persuaded my mom to go for the Innova instead.

Anyway, we have put a hold on the car purchase as of now.
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Old 23rd May 2016, 23:58   #40
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Default re: NGT bans 10+ year old diesel vehicles in Kerala. EDIT: High Court stays ban

does this mean that my 9 year old indica is banned in kerala from next year ?
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Old 24th May 2016, 00:16   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Haddock View Post
A verdict in the right ditection. Two aspects,diesel and SUV.

Diesel-As long as fuel is subsidised, diesel cars which are also polluters should be discouraged. Diesel subsidy is from the exchequer and the tax given by an adivasi could be used to subsidise the fuel in a Landcruiser or Fortuner, ironic because the adivasi may not be able to pay for two square meals a day. Since removing diesel subsidy altogethet would sent prices spiralling up,such cars have to be discouraged by other ways.Economically its wrong to extract the cost of a product from someone who has not used that commidity.

OT: This is absolutely backwards. No "adivasi" who can't afford two square meals a day is paying taxes anyway - agricultural income in India is not taxed and given that only 2% of our population is paying tax, this is really NOT an issue.

The diesel subsidy is in-fact for our rural population to run their tractors / generators etc. I'm sure a Fortuner owner will willingly pay the unsubsidized cost of diesel if it's available at such price.

Also, if our roads are too narrow for SUVs how are buses and commercial vehicles ok to ply?
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Old 24th May 2016, 01:32   #42
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Default re: NGT bans 10+ year old diesel vehicles in Kerala. EDIT: High Court stays ban

Quote:
Originally Posted by phoenixash View Post
OT: This is absolutely backwards. No "adivasi" who can't afford two square meals a day is paying taxes anyway - agricultural income in India is not taxed and given that only 2% of our population is paying tax, this is really NOT an issue.

The diesel subsidy is in-fact for our rural population to run their tractors / generators etc. I'm sure a Fortuner owner will willingly pay the unsubsidized cost of diesel if it's available at such price.

Also, if our roads are too narrow for SUVs how are buses and commercial vehicles ok to ply?
An advasi may not.pay income tax but every commodity or service when bought has a tax component to it and no one.is exempted from it. Subsidy for diesel in passenger cars is a big drain on the state's financial resources.

Subsidy should be limited to commercial vehicles,ideally it should also be removed but due to concerns about inflation it is not simple.

SUVs need more space than sedans or.hatches and most are not used as people carriers but as status symbols,SUVs should not be banned but discouraged as they occupy too much space and use more fuel.

The 2000cc limit is aimed at big suvs and is spot on.

I have been to cities like Vienna and SUVs are seldom used in western europe because they clearly understand that SUVs will clog the traffic. SUVS to be honest are in some way a guilty pleasure.

The verdict of the tribunal is a way to ensure that the demand for diesel cars especially diesel guzzling SUV decreases.

P.S-I would like to humbly remind some members who have used very strong words to describe the tribunal that any observation or verdict by a judicial body can be scrutinized,questioning the credibility of the body itself can be considered as 'contempt of court'
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Old 24th May 2016, 04:04   #43
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Default re: NGT bans 10+ year old diesel vehicles in Kerala. EDIT: High Court stays ban

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Haddock View Post
I have been to cities like Vienna and SUVs are seldom used in western europe because they clearly understand that SUVs will clog the traffic. SUVS to be honest are in some way a guilty pleasure.

Well,

Europe & India are on two extremes considering the concept of "Family". I lived with a Skoda Fabia hatchbatch for 6 years before moving on to a second hand 2009 model Scorpio M-Hawk. The need of the hour was a 7 seater, as me & my brother, both got married & no sedans could accommodate my entire family consisiting of six members, including my parents. So, your notions on the use of SUVs are partly wrong.

This is yet another Short-Sighted, Autocratic & Draconian ruling by the NGT to BAN Diesel vehicles [having 2000cc or more] older than 10 years in Kerala. They have also banned the registration of new diesel vehicles above 2000cc just as in Delhi-NCR. The time frame given is 30 days. First of all, Kerala cities are the least polluted, regarding air pollution compared to other states. They just opened a bench at Kochi yesterday & they passed a ruling as an "Introductory Offer" on the same day to prove that they have reached Kerala. Someone filed a PIL & they enforced a ban like Almighty. That Simple?. Democratic nation right? If this ruling has been accepted, more than a million vehicles needs to be scrapped within the next 30 Days. In Delhi, Most of the manufacturers have already come up with Sub-2000cc engines for their cars. For.eg. Toyota & Mahindra's new engines. Some people are saying as per the ruling, we can swap the 10 year or older engine with a new engine & need not scrap the entire vehicle. But, who is gonna provide engines for these vehicles? Who will install them? What about the costs involved if at all it happens? What about the obsolete models which the company has already stopped production? Like the ever popular model Toyota Qualis. And ohh, above all, engine swapping is illegal in Kerala since decades. And the NGT believes a 1999cc diesel will not pollute? Hilarious.. If they are serious, they should have a Long-Term plan.. Say, for the next 15-20 years. Like limiting the number of new vehicles rolling out. Something like 1 family, 1 car agenda.. like LPG distribution. If Diesel is the problem, why don't they ban the sale of NEW Diesel cars entirely pan India? That would make the number of Diesel cars on road minimal after some years. And these kind of bans should be enforced on the Public service sector only. Buses, trucks & auto rikshaws are the most polluting vehicles on road. Not private cars which the owners do care for. And ohh yes, the Electric cars Like Mahindra Reva should be promoted with total exemptions from all taxes. They are definitely the FUTURE. This sudden move is to help the Global automotive giants only, who are struggling with their sales due to competition & saturation in the Indian market. They need a "push" from the govt side. They are the only ones who are going to benefit from these kind of bans, as they can roll out more & more new vehicles.. day by day, year by year.
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Old 24th May 2016, 07:19   #44
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Default re: NGT bans 10+ year old diesel vehicles in Kerala. EDIT: High Court stays ban

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hindu
“All the diesel vehicles whether light or heavy which are more than 10 years shall not be permitted to ply on the roads in the major cities like Thiruvananthapuram, Kollam, Kochi, Thrissur, Kozhikode and Kannur,” the Bench said in its order.
This doesn't make sense at all. How will they enforce it? Real time checks will create huge traffic jams resulting in more pollution.

And don't think it can be done through registration either. Its not just KL-7 vehicles that ply in the city of Kochi. And if you go 10 KM in any direction in the city, you will enter a place under a different RTO. Kerala is one big city in itself.

Besides, every private vehicle has paid the road tax for 15 years? And I don't think the govt. is in a position to refund the balance should a 10 year old car becomes defunct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hindu
In its first sitting, the Bench, also directed the state government not to register any diesel vehicle in the capacity of 2000 CC and more, except public transport and local authority vehicles.
This move will get blocked by the honorable courts themselves after a few days of confusion I think.

On a lighter note, the Volvo dealers will be quite happy with that diesel engine of the new XC90.

Source
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Old 24th May 2016, 08:35   #45
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Default re: NGT bans 10+ year old diesel vehicles in Kerala. EDIT: High Court stays ban

How stupid can people get? What stats tell these people that diesel cars over 2000cc are polluting more than other vehicles?

My suggestion on how to approach the problem of pollution:

1. Proper emission tests. (especially for CVs) The current PUC check is a joke. A vehicle which fails should be fined and should be given some time(~2 weeks) to get repairs done. After that, they should be allowed one more attempt for the test.

2. Check for Fuel adulteration. I think the NGT are scared of the fuel mafia.

3. Improve public transport.

4. Make smooth roads so that potholes/unscientific speed breakers don't create bottlenecks.
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