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Old 13th June 2016, 03:31   #1
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Default Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?

Mod Note: Our Lexus Review has been taken live at this link (Driven: The Lexus Range (ES 300h, RX 450h & LX 450d)). Please continue the discussion over on the new thread. Thanks!

Wait for Lexus is now evidently over as Toyota has finally brought one for certification. This conforms with the expected launch in August.

A single unit of Lexus ES300h has been imported. ES300h, the hybrid variant of ES300 is a full-size sedan offering from Lexus.

Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?-capture.jpg

ES300h is powered by a 2.5L inline 4-cylinder petrol engine which along with electric motors generates a total of 200 BHP, delivered via CVT transmission.

Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?-lexuses2016102402.jpg

Source: Zauba

Last edited by GTO : 8th June 2017 at 11:11. Reason: Link to review
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Old 13th June 2016, 03:53   #2
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Default re: Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?

Thanks for the info Senna4ever.

With diesel cars facing bans, schemes like odd-even rule(with exemption for hybrids) being implemented and tax benefits on hybrids and EVs, the time couldn't have been better for Toyota to start selling Lexus cars.

I suppose only Lexus Hybrids will be sold in India.

Seems like the ES300h is sharing the powertrain with the Camry, which hopefully results in lower production cost for the powertrain which is currently imported.

The previous generations of the ES300 were based on the Camry, but this current generation is based on the larger Avalon's platform.

Last edited by landcruiser123 : 13th June 2016 at 03:59.
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Old 13th June 2016, 08:53   #3
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Default re: Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?

The Camry is already priced pretty high. Toyota would probably price this Lexus around the 40 lakh mark to go head on with the C,3 and XE. Although I think they should play safe and price it in the mid 30s to gauge the response of the Lexus brand that isn't current a marquee here unlike the Germans. But this is wishful thinking, Toyota always manages to price way too high and often times kills their products like the LC200 and Prado.
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Old 13th June 2016, 10:05   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by landcruiser123 View Post
The previous generations of the ES300 were based on the Camry, but this current generation is based on the larger Avalon's platform.

Latest generation Camry, ES and Avalon uses the same platform. Just that the wheel bases are different between Camry and ES - AVALON (ES and Avalon wheels base being same). However, ES has grown in size from Camry towards Avalon and also mechanical similarity between two is grown.

I will be very curious to see at what price point Toyota decides to bring Lexus ES. My bet is 40-45 lacs ex-showroom considering Camry Hybrid is at around 30 lacs ex-showroom.
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Old 13th June 2016, 10:16   #5
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Default re: Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?

From the few reviews and pics I could see, I don't think this cars offer that much over a Camry. If I had to shell out an extra 8-10 lakh for this car, I'd probably save the cash and buy a hybrid Camry instead.
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Old 13th June 2016, 10:22   #6
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Default re: Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sahil View Post
The Camry is already priced pretty high. Toyota would probably price this Lexus around the 40 lakh mark to go head on with the C,3 and XE. Although I think they should play safe and price it in the mid 30s to gauge the response of the Lexus brand that isn't current a marquee here unlike the Germans. But this is wishful thinking, Toyota always manages to price way too high and often times kills their products like the LC200 and Prado.
Lexus, like the LC200 and Prado is going to be a CBU - and hence unreasonably expensive too. So pricing is not just decided by the brand or its recall.

Lexus is trying to enter at the right time, when Diesels are suddenly made to look like the villains of the environment - in a country that still has lots and lots of 2-3 decade old diesel lorries ( which probably run on crude oil directly )

The Germans don't have hybrid options at the lower segments, and this is where the Hybrid Lexus can have an upper hand That said, starting a retail chain for CBU products, and ensuring proper sales and service support from scratch is an uphill task.
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Old 13th June 2016, 12:50   #7
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Default Re: Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?

Great find!

For Toyota, hybrids can be a major differentiator. This is especially important as Lexus doesn't have a wide range of diesels. My thread on the challenges that the brand will face - link.

Definitely looks striking, although the front styling is too ugly for my conservative tastes. If international reviews are anything to go by, this is a spacious + comfortable luxury barge. But it's boring as hell to drive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sahil View Post
Toyota would probably price this Lexus around the 40 lakh mark to go head on with the C,3 and XE.
Fat chance of that happening dude. The Camry Hybrid costs 40 lakhs on the road in Mumbai (35 ex-showroom). Going to be very difficult for the ES300h as Toyota will price it much higher. It will enter E-Class, 5-Series & A6 territory.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Axe77 View Post
From the few reviews and pics I could see, I don't think this cars offer that much over a Camry. If I had to shell out an extra 8-10 lakh for this car, I'd probably save the cash and buy a hybrid Camry instead.
It's all about the brand. What does the C-Class offer over the Skoda Superb? What does an A3 or A4 offer over the VW Jetta? What does a Range Rover Evoque offer over a Ford Endeavour 3.2? The law of diminishing returns hits you hard once you cross the 25 lakh price band.
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Old 13th June 2016, 12:58   #8
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Default Re: Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?

In our quest to look for a replacement for our 2010 Skoda Superb TDI, we looked at the C Class, 3 Series and A4. None of them could match the Superb in terms of power of space (rear leg room and boot). Another major issue was the silly spare tire occupying the boot.

We check out the Camry Hybrid - decent rear leg room but what a disappointing tiny boot!! I believe the hybrid pack located at the rear took most of the space. I was even more disappointed when I learnt that the electric motor is active only up to 40 kmph, after that it shifts to the petrol engine. It made no sense to us really!

So yes a valid question of what are these 40+ lakh cars really offering for the price?
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Old 13th June 2016, 13:14   #9
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Default Re: Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sahil View Post
The Camry is already priced pretty high. Toyota would probably price this Lexus around the 40 lakh mark to go head on with the C,3 and XE.
It's the IS that competes with the C, 3 & A4. The ES goes up against the E, 5 & A6. Knowing Toyota and their India strategy, I am guessing the ES will be sold at a considerable premium over the E, 5 & A6. Problem is the NGT & government's arbitrary policies may just end up helping Toyota sell their overpriced hybrids.
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Old 13th June 2016, 14:31   #10
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Default Re: Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?

Quote:
Originally Posted by amit View Post
Knowing Toyota and their India strategy, I am guessing the ES will be sold at a considerable premium over the E, 5 & A6.
Do you think Toyota will risk pricing it higher? I know the Lexus name is not all that new here, but pricing it higher than the E, 5 & A6 would be a huge gamble in my opinion, especially since all three are tried and tested products which the Indian market love. Pricing it in line with the E, 5 & A6 would be a better option. Lexus cars are known for their comfort and I'm sure that will be a huge selling point. Those who are unhappy with the reliability of the German trio might also buy a Lexus.
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Old 13th June 2016, 18:59   #11
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Default Re: Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?

I have always been a fan of Lexus, futuristic looking and really 'posh'. It seems that Maruti started the fashion of having a premium brand, and now Toyota are picking it up. Now Acura may not be far away, after all Toyota and Honda tend to follow each other very closely.

I am sure the Japanese will set up separate service facilities also. Right now the two Maruti marquees, are openly serviced at the same facility. Imagine an owner going to get work on his Lincoln and entering a run of the mill Ford showroom, or a Cadillac owner going to a Chevy facility.
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Old 13th June 2016, 22:17   #12
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Default Re: Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?

Lexus India is a confirmed news as mentioned elsewhere , but this should happen sometime around the end of this Year . We should soon see more Imports RX - Hybrid as well Petrol and a GX with a V8 Diesel
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Old 14th June 2016, 00:59   #13
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Default Re: Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sahil View Post
The Camry is already priced pretty high. Toyota would probably price this Lexus around the 40 lakh mark
Prado and the Landcruiser 200 are 'Toyota' products. They won't sell at high prices considering that the top of the line German SUVs are priced significantly lower.

The Lexus brand has a lot of fans, especially those people who've lived/traveled extensively in the middle east. This car will be priced right in A6 and E class territory.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitrous Power View Post
Just that the wheel bases are different between Camry and ES - AVALON (ES and Avalon wheels base being same).
All I wanted to say is that ES300h will be bigger and more comfortable than the Camry (by a small margin). The chassis will be different, but the powertrain will be the same. (most likely)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turbanator View Post
GX with a V8 Diesel
I don't think we'll see a diesel SUV anytime soon.

Last edited by landcruiser123 : 14th June 2016 at 01:00.
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Old 14th June 2016, 08:58   #14
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Default Re: Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?

A local dealer in my city, Nandi Toyota has confirmed Lexus are coming. They are going to start with eight dealer outlets across India and the launch will be in October. More than competing with Mercedes, BMW, Jaguar and Audi, the idea is to be present in the market. Folks down south will have to head to Bangalore to buy a Lexus. Showroom construction is under way. I do hope this last bit is wrong. The dealer did tell me that the starting price for a Lexus (Did not specify the model) will be 80lac!
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Old 14th June 2016, 09:29   #15
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Default Re: Toyota India imports an ES300h - First offering from Lexus?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sahil View Post
The Camry is already priced pretty high. Toyota would probably price this Lexus around the 40 lakh mark to go head on with the C,3 and XE. Although I think they should play safe and price it in the mid 30s to gauge the response of the Lexus brand that isn't current a marquee here unlike the Germans.
The Camry is a better chauffeur driven car than the entry level cars like C,3 or XE and even the ES300 cannot be compared with these cars. Its surprising to know the price acceptance of these entry level German cars at 40L (which are not even equivalent to D segment cars) and better products suffer as they do not have enough brand acceptance.
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