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Old 14th July 2016, 09:03   #31
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Please don't be misled by the claimed 6 lakh price tag. The Kwid might be expensive in Brazil for the same reason that the Mustang costs 65 lakhs here - Import Taxes. Like India, Brazil taxes the hell out of imports.

The Kwid would perhaps cost the same 3 - 4 lakhs if it was built locally in Brazil.
The OP also refers to 'Made in India', but Isn't the KWID for Brazil being manufactured there?

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Old 14th July 2016, 09:08   #32
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

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Does it mean that our life is less precious compared to them?

Its high time government needs to step in and set some strict regulations.
Maybe the government has stepped in, and that too long back - In trying to utilise the services of the car (or vehicle generally) industry to bring down (or keep in check) India's ever growing population.
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Old 14th July 2016, 10:12   #33
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

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Originally Posted by volkman10 View Post
The OP also refers to 'Made in India', but Isn't the KWID for Brazil being manufactured there?
Renault India will be exporting the kits.

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“We will be making exports of Kwid to Brazil in parts starting next month,” Renault India Country CEO and MD Sumit Sawhney told reporters.

He said the company was exporting “small” numbers of its popular SUV Duster to Brazil and Kwid will be shipped as SKDs (semi-knocked down units).
Source
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Old 14th July 2016, 10:43   #34
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

I am always piqued by such conversations on the forum as somehow, the conversations in the thread do not reflect the consumer behavior in show rooms. I fully endorse Vigkey's statement that considering this is a pull market, buyers are to be blamed more.

While this does not do away with moral obligations of car makers, we have had too many such examples in the market where Indians refused to pay for stuff they can't see. Either safety or better build quality. Ameo is classic example where now it has bare metal in the boot as consumers don't care for lining as it is in the boot. Try removing the roof lining and am sure all hell will break loose.

I know of people who are not willing to shell out another 1L on a 15L car even if that additional 1L gets you 4 more airbags. The approach is - 2 is just about enough, even though they are a family of 3! This way, they align to social posturing of "we care about safety" as we have ABS and airbags, but do they understand safety? I doubt it.

And then we take a higher moral ground of how car companies are sucking the life out of us.
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Old 14th July 2016, 11:23   #35
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

Don't tell me safety was the remotest of priority for someone who bought a 700KG 5 seater car in India. It's the season of SUVs; Renault exploited it by building a light weight tin can which gives the driver a feel that he's bought himself a tough looking small SUV which in reality is less tougher than the Nano.

This isn't nothing new in India,where export quality is better than corresponding the local market one (coming out of the same factory) for a range of goods. Now we have to add safety also to that list.

Would have been good if Renault sold the improved (safety wise) Kwid in India as well with a marginal price increase. Would have built their brand image but hit their profits.
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Old 14th July 2016, 11:27   #36
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

Auto manufacturers are not running on moral obligation but regulations. Why Brazil's Kwid is better built? Their laws require that. Why ours don't? Our laws are non existent. Why should a fledgling brand like Renault go out of its way & be the 'model citizen' when even veterans like Suzuki & Hyundai give such pathetic build quality in entry level as well as a segment(s) above? They won't & they don't have to till govt makes up its mind. I bet the latest revision of Kwid is the safest among current A-segment.

I have the first batch flimsy Kwid & i clearly knew what i won't get when i purchased it. Why i bought it? Go ahead, suggest a better option in A-segment safety wise. One can't. All are tin cans in this segment, even the next segment is no better.

If anyone wanna go after manufacturers for this situation, go after Suzuki first who started this deplorable trend back in 1983. Go after the govts who turned a blind eye to it. We as a race need to be forced to do the right thing. We gotta wait around 2 more years for that to happen.
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Old 14th July 2016, 11:52   #37
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

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Its a age old debate. If I am to look at the economy of the Brazilian offer, to cough up 6 lac equivalent in Indian rupees on a car like Kwid, makes little sense as there other offerings if I am to extend my budget a bit more.

For the price it is offered, I guess Renault wants us to just 'shut up' and not ask more. Looking at the numbers this car has done, I believe we have wholeheartedly obliged.
I totally agree. We are getting what we pay for. Why single out Renault? Each and every other manufacturer would be doing the same as well especially when they see we have no idea whatsoever about safety to begin with. Cars with seatbelts came out way back when. How many of us wear them? Let's show that we are safety conscious as well and not just kmpl crazy and perhaps then, will the manufacturers give us safer cars.
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Old 14th July 2016, 11:52   #38
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

I find all this mud slinging at Renault and other car manufacturers really uncalled for. Its become our habit to hide behind excuses for our own shortcomings as a individual/society/nation. What will happen if Kwid is launched with 6 airbags/ABS/better structure and priced at a premium vis a vis the Alto. Will we buy it? No. Even the educated folks here will call it a market dud and 9.99 out of 10 people will go and buy the Alto citing innumerable excuses as its over priced, they drive only in city and every other tom dick and harry excuse they can think of. In such a scenario why should any car maker offer anything more than the absolute basic? How many people ( and I am talking outside the forum) buy a fully loaded car? So many brands these days like Ford have a feature rich car and then a top of the line model where they add all safety stuff too, in case of Ford titanium and titanium+. How many of us buy the Titanium +? Hardly any.

On top of it our rules are non-existent. And they are non-existent because we want them to be like that. If tomorrow they ban all diesel cars to improve our health, we will cry foul. If tomorrow they mandate all car makers to add safety features to all models and increase prices to whatever levels, we will cry foul.

So lets continue sipping coffee and pass time discussing these things. In a country where we still don't follow basic rules like wearing a helmet, using the ORVMs, indicating when turning etc etc, it follows that we deserve to drive cars like these only.
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Old 14th July 2016, 12:16   #39
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

>> if Kwid is launched with 6 airbags/ABS/better structure and priced at a premium vis a vis the Alto.

For a car like Kwid, and for the sweet deals that manufacturers can obtain from vendors. I would not be surprised if 6 airbags/ABS/better structure etc cost less than 50k to implement. But you see car manufacturers think differently.

If they can avoid a key lock set on one of the doors, they think that they they saved Rs. 550. And if they can avoid each and every part therefore, it will result in added savings of many thousands of rupees which when multiplied with the number of units that they can move off the dealership is what keeps them hooked .. viz profits.

It is clearly lack of legislation and some amount of connivance on part of the Govt of India, that allows these manufacturers to escape with murder.
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Old 14th July 2016, 13:23   #40
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

I think this reflects the value we place on human life collectively as a society. For a moment, let us assume Renault produced the safer Kwid and launched it in India at a 20% premium over Alto. Would the majority go for the Kwid or the Alto then?

I think the issue is deeper than manufacturers trying to cut corners. It is ingrained in the way we collectively think while putting our money on automobiles. We just don't place value on life, and the manufacturers are catering to that. I know there are a few who are willing to pay a price for safety, but in this segment, they are too few for Renault to risk loosing the market by catering to those.

I think it will be a few generations before safer cars become the norm. Starting with Government mandating safer cars, which will push up the car prices, and customers will get used to paying more for safer cars.

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Old 14th July 2016, 13:28   #41
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

Lack of govt legislation and public apathy towards vehicular safety is what has brought us here.
The silver lining is that the only way to go is towards safer cars and better govt mandates.
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Old 14th July 2016, 14:01   #42
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

I dont blame Renault or even Maruti for this. They are coming up with the products that the Indian junta wants. A 660 kg Kwid is a result of a thorough consumer behaviour study by renault, no wonder its doing great numbers. As someone already stated, Indian specced cars are frequently made lighter.

FE has been the most important criteria (Remeber 'kitna deti hai' advert ?) for an average Indian car buyer and the only way to give the best FE is to reduce the weight. Safety isnt a concern for us and now its the Govt who needs to take the right step, but again it should start from us, shouldnt it?

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Old 14th July 2016, 14:10   #43
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

Agree with most of the comments here related to consumer behavior. Renault cannot be blamed blatantly IMO. Market leaders MS and Hyundai has been doing this for years with alto, eon, i10 etc. There's no signs of slowing down in sales of this segment.

Till recent times - consumers were forced by MS, Hyundai and even renault (still) to go for the top most variant to get a passenger airbag! 15L (OR Bangalore) Duster does not get a passenger airbag except RXZ variant!

Until we get some stringent laws (possibly in 2030!!), it's up to the consumer to decide if he wants a safer car or a tin can with SUV looks - with lot of features like touch screen for the money he pays!

Sad state of affairs!
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Old 14th July 2016, 14:56   #44
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

I don't think why safety should be an option. It should an integral part of a car. No one has to pay for alloy wheels, body colored door handles or stereo to get two airbags and ABS in their car. It should be available in all the cars irrespective of what variant it is. Also, a car should be structurally well built. All those safety features and the car crumpling like a bag of crisps in a crash is not what anyone would want.
Government should enforce this on every car manufacturer. Car prices will go up, so be it. Shelling out an extra 50 grand should not be a big thing when one is spending lakhs to buy a car.
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Old 14th July 2016, 15:36   #45
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Default Re: Renault India builds a safer Kwid for Brazil - 130 kilos heavier!

Iam not sure why people are blaming the government and car manufacturer. Are you as a person not concerned about your life. When I choose a car, the mandatory requirements will be ABS and Airbags. I would not mind paying the extra 50k to 2L just to have those. I see Maruti Alto topping the charts every month, ever wonder why that one car dominates the sales ?

I have personally advised more than 20 and helped them with the overall purchase of a car. Guess what, 80% of them chose cars that are cheaper, cheaper to maintain and gives more mileage. Maruti made an advertisement that asks "kithna dethi hai", Iam sorry I just don't understand that advertisement. You ask that question to a car manufacturer or bike manufacturer its acceptable. But can you ask that question to a battleship or an aircraft or a rocket or a submarine, that's just lame and utter stupidity (please excuse the word). Every time I spoke of ABS and Airbag, they were not interested one bit.

I don't think this is a government issue or manufacturer issue, the issue is with us PEOPLE. Unless and until people start putting their life before mileage and low cost cars, neither the government nor the manufacturer can help you. People need to change the way they buy cars. If you don't care about your life, why should any government nor any manufacturer.

Simple logic, More demand - lesser production cost. Less demand - more production cost. You cannot ask for the highest quality product by paying a fraction of the cost.
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