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Old 28th October 2016, 19:14   #121
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

I think Tata wants to continue doing the stuff the way it was doing. They have a certain ethos which I dont think is easy in modern open and competitive world. Every business of theirs needs to stand against competition and they cant do something just because they have passion.

I hope they change to being a competitive business without getting into less or no profit businesses. Mr Mistry tried doing that since its how business is done and it did not match Tata ethos ! The ethos shouldn't drive them out of business and make them suffer colossal losses.

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Old 28th October 2016, 20:29   #122
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

Expectedly, the whole thing has turned into a 'he said, she said' spat which will just make both sides dig in further.

Plenty of head honchos get 'fired', it doesn't have to be a mess like this. It's never a good idea to get into a public ego tussle at corporate level, least of all with someone who owns ~1/5th of your company who can't be easily forced out.

TATA group is in for a longer and messier restructuring than they already had on hand, and this time minus a big chunk of the reputation that's carried them through a lot of tough times.

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Old 28th October 2016, 21:12   #123
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

I dont understand why single out Nano & RT. Though Nano is RT's dream project, the entire PV had not been doing well till Karl Slym stepped in.

Corus was a bad gamble that failed. The CV division was doing well, but has been going down.

Having said all this, let's remember that that group is far bigger than just Nano, CV, or Corus. These three are among the most visible and under-performing divisions.

The PV division had a very good head-start back in the 90's. That was when Maruti was also finding its feet, and the likes of Hyundai were in the same place. But they did not capitalize on that. Their recent efforts are too late in the day, and the current state cannot be attributed to RT alone.

Last edited by Samurai : 29th October 2016 at 11:32. Reason: as requested
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Old 28th October 2016, 21:12   #124
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

While both Tata and Mistry debate it out over who was right and who was not, the manner in which Mistry has been removed does not speak well about the so-called culture of Tatas. He was appointed to the post by Tata himself, backed by the selection committee. The committee had looked at other options before shortlisting Cyrus. So after four years, why remove him unceremoniously from his post?

Let us look at what Cyrus inherited: The Nano which has yet to see a commercial success. The very idea of a 1 lakh car followed by the Singur debacle have cost enough money to Tata Motors, and it would appear to an outsider that the Nano projeect conttinued so long because it was Tata's personal interest.

Acquisition of JLR and Corus at the top of their valuations, investment in not just one but two airlines are some of the other investments which call for an objective analysis. Only the JLR seems to have paid off. All others are a drag on the group's finances.

Tata Motors has seen its own share of failures, made worse by the lack of a CEO to drive the company out of red. Karl Slym probably had the potential, with his previous experience at GM, but then he had the sword of the emissions scandal at GM India hanging on his head. However, it's only of late that Tata cars have started competing with the competition in terms of the design and quality.

While Tata Sons has issued a rebuttal, they still have to come clean on why the articles of association were modified after Mistry's appointment to the top post. At this point, I personally think this event is going to tarnish the image of Tata considerably. A successor will ensure he is not booted out in a similar fashion, which makes the job of finding a successor that much more difficult - and costly.
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Old 29th October 2016, 14:26   #125
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

Coming back to the automotive industry point of teambhp:

Mistry or not, dirty linen launderings and sullyings in public or not, the assorted businesses have very reputed and good quality managements. Some/many/all of whom may've felt that Mr. Mistry and his own-'team'/'coterie' of advisers was running roughshod, in their zeal to right financial burdens that, in any case, are largely of a global-and-indian-macroeocnomic/structural slowdown+stagnation nature?

As far as Tata Motors-JLR goes: they also now, in addition to the slowdown in domestic cv turnover and profitability and the eroded marketshare in PV+the reportedly 3000crores campaign of new models, dealers etc to turnaround the pv brand and business in India, have BREXIT to contend with, in the context of a very high investment programme for JLR (given German competition, new technology-disruptions and regulations etc.)

I would suspect, and indeed advise (!), Tata Sons to look to do a big, merger-type, consolidation 'deal' with another large global automotive OEM/promoter-family.

Depending on how such a deal is structured, Tata Sons can not just de-risk TataMotors-JLR, they can really boost long-term success of the brands and secure the financial-footing to complete the 'go up successfully against the German dominance' in luxury vehicles that they've been so remarkably engaged in, EVEN as they also look to complete the visionary Ratan Tata domestic pv task: re-establish Tata in India as a trusted and liked up-to-date brand AND, finally, also grow Tata-branded car exports, alongside their bus+truck exports, as well as (Indian government 'permitting' or rather 'indulging'!) become a large defence industrial force (in infantry vehicles, missile-carriers, etc) including exports.

There are financial burdens and large risks if these tasks have to performed successfully, given the new Global and Indian economic permanent-slowdown (relative to the ra-ra, boom years, the last decade of Ratan Tata's chairmanship.) Even JLR is going to be in a much riskier and lower-profit place, going forward.

Hence, Mr. Tata+Ralph Speth etc would be well-advised to do a BIG merger/strategic-tie-up type deal (on a global and not-just Indian basis) with another large automotive group?

This post-Mistry time is not the time to shy away from the task of de-risking and de-leveraging the firm and the group as-a-whole. Mr. Mistry may've been doing so in the wrong way and/or to the wrond degree, but the task remains: Tata Group historic large, resilient strength etc would be best if banked on: ONLY in-part, since the new political-economy landscape in India, the UK and globally is destined to be troubling/difficult/turbulent for a VERY long time, for Tata Motors-JLR too and not just say Tata Steel or Indian Hotels et al.

Mr. Tata and Ralph Speth could not be more highly respected in the global automotive industry and associated financial circles: they can easily do such a very large deal on good terms, something that will be far harder to achieve in most of their other large firms/sectors?

I hope Mr. Tata and his trusted investment bankers are thinking along some such lines, especially since Mr. Mistry's particular approach has been seen to've been badly wrong overall by him.
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Old 29th October 2016, 20:49   #126
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

We don't know if Mistry's approach was wrong. It would be foolish to expect the chairman of so many companies to be spending too much time on just one entity. Also Mistry's seems to have done all he could. Hiring of Karl Slym could have helped Tata Motors turn it's fortunes around if he had lived long.

Post Nano, Tata Motors has been producing a much better car lineup in terms of fit and finish. Look at the Zest, Bolt, Tiago or Hexa as proof. So there are significant and tangible improvements in the quality the company is delivering.

All this while it has been no secret that the Nano hasn't been selling as well as it should. And the company has been bleeding money. Almost every year there has been a new variant. Each variant must have caused a lot of money to rework the design, build prototypes, test them and finally integrate with the assembly line. And it hasn't paid off. How much say Mistry's got in this matter is anybody's guess.

JLR again has been doing well in China I suppose. It has yet to carve out a niche for itself where it can be assured of sustainable numbers.

So on the automotive front, while there are improvements, launching new models one after the other is bound to have taken its toll on the finances.

Last edited by Rehaan : 3rd November 2016 at 14:17. Reason: Correcting autocorrect typo as per Reported Post.
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Old 30th October 2016, 10:18   #127
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

The Nano was done in by Mamata. There is a time and Tata missed the slot. Also, reports of cars catching fire did not help them.

By the eay it seems that Mistry ouster was planned over time, addition of new board members, etc. seems to indicate that. Also, he went after too many Tata Ratna's. Some are articles of faith, not logic, live Aviation, British Steel, Hotels, etc. When dealing with Institutions like the Tata empire then plain accountants logic will never work. And they do have a history of delivering, prime case JLR!
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Old 30th October 2016, 15:00   #128
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

A group chairman of a large enterprise has to juggle a lot of issues. There is the company ethos, long term goals and of course profitability. Further at that level the main task is not only review of the current situation of group companies, but setting up systems which will ensure that past mistakes are rarely repeated and future growth smooth. He also has to be an excellent judge of people with leadership quality so that each enterprise in the group is lead and managed to achieve the group goals.

A group chairman has also to be sensitive to the requirements (or egos or goals) of the major shareholders, as they are after all the owners of the enterprise.

It seems that in pursuit of the holy grail of profitability and reducing losses, Cyrus stepped on toes of too many people, running roughshod on both the Tata Ethos (of being a benevolent employer, where employees are to be looked after not hired and fired based on the need of the day) as well as not having a "Plan" for the resurrection of bleeding companies. Apparently his magic wand was to dispose off loss making enterprises, no matter what it did to the human component.

In hindsight he was not the right candidate to lead such a diverse conglomerate, as he was not able to successfully juggle so many conflicting needs of the Tata Empire achieve the desired results and pacify those who matter.

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Old 31st October 2016, 12:26   #129
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

This article seems to suggest that Tata Trusts needed cash via dividends route but Tata Sons was in no position to do so as 3 major Tata firms were bleeding. Interesting read with twists sounding more like a Indian soap drama then a professional outlook.

http://www.firstpost.com/business/ra...r-3081336.html
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Old 31st October 2016, 22:18   #130
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

Interesting, is it not, how all media outlets are suddenly in on the soap-opera-fication of this Tata-Mistry tall-tale. Not a whisper from any of them of any of this while it really was underway over the past year and more.

The media , including especially the economic news media is so un-independent and so 'dar-pok' as well as PR-machined, it isn't even black-humour-funny!

Of course, now it is open season: no journalism needed, any old gossip-'story'-template will do. The press, including even and/or especially the economic affairs/business press, is entirely in-bed with (certain/all) corporates AND neta/party. I wonder what consenting 'extortions'/'len-den' are underway in this PR 'crisis'/'war' for Tata and Mistry etc, especially since there are several other er 'interested parties' named neither Tata nor Mistry?!
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Old 1st November 2016, 07:22   #131
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

Is Arnab Goswamy not also exploiting the situation to do his obnoxious ranting? I have no idea, I can't stand the man, so I never tune in.
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Old 1st November 2016, 11:06   #132
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

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Originally Posted by rrsteer View Post
I feel the biggest responsibility of the chairman of Tata group would be regarding capital allocation decisions of group companies. It is here that one feels decisions were often based on emotions or egos, and which was perhaps being undone in the last few years.
An excellent piece on poor capital allocation decisions taken:

http://www.business-standard.com/art...3000449_1.html
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Old 1st November 2016, 17:37   #133
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

Tata veteran S Ramadorai resigns from NSDA, NSDC - sparking speculation that he might be headed back to India's largest conglomerate.

Quote:
Rohit Nandan, vice-chairman of the governing body and secretary, ministry of skill development and entrepreneurship, has been appointed interim head of the National Skill Development Agency till a full-time chairman is appointed.
Quote:
The National Skill Development Corporation (NSDC) Board is likely to meet on Wednesday to discuss the future road map, post the resignation.
The former Tata Consultancy Services (TCS) chief was appointed chairman of the skill development agencies in May 2013 with a Cabinet rank. He is also the chairman of Tata Institute of Social Sciences and AirAsia India.
Link

Last edited by volkman10 : 1st November 2016 at 17:40.
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Old 1st November 2016, 18:38   #134
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

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Originally Posted by volkman10 View Post
Tata veteran S Ramadorai resigns from NSDA, NSDC - sparking speculation that he might be headed back to India's largest conglomerate.

Link
Mr. Ramadorai has given up these positions in order to take better care of his health and not for any other purpose. Maybe somewhere down the line but not in the near future.
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Old 2nd November 2016, 01:57   #135
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Default Re: Ratan Tata makes a comeback as Chairman of Tata; Cyrus Mistry out

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Originally Posted by Sawyer View Post
Is Arnab Goswamy not also exploiting the situation to do his obnoxious ranting? I have no idea, I can't stand the man, so I never tune in.
I thought making derogatory remarks on a person unrelated to the current discussion is against the Team-bhp rules. Or is it perfectly okay to degrade someone ? Please enlighten me Mods. Thanks.
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