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Old 21st March 2017, 22:33   #31
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Default Force Gurkha 2017 (BS-IV) Launched - Prices start @ 8.38 Lakhs

Hi Folks

Force Gurkha 2017 BS-IV (OM-616 Derived 2.6L) launched . 2 Editions - Xplorer (4x4) & Xpedition (4x2)

Force is offering Gurkha in different combinations;

Xplorer Edition

1. 3 Door Hard Top 4x4 SWB
2. 3 Door Soft Top 4x4 SWB
3. 5 Door Hard Top 4x4 LWB

All the above with Front & Rear Diff Locks, A/T tires as standard. A/c too.

Xpedition Edition

4. 5 Door Hard Top 4x2 LWB

One thing I found interesting as per Force website is that the Xplorer 4x4 having 18 Months Unlimited KM Warranty & Xpedition 3 Year 3 Lakh KM warranty.

Sharing the news;

Quote:
Force Motors has launched a new Gurkha which now conforms to BS-IV emission norms. Available in three- and five-door body styles and two variants Xplorer and Xpedition the Gurkha features minor styling changes to the exterior along with a host of new mechanicals.

In terms of styling, the noticeable changes to the exterior are the new front and rear bumpers and a new grille up front. The SUV also comes fitted with all-terrain tyres as standard. The overall design, though, remains familiar to the previous model.

Inside, changes to the cabin include a new steering wheel design, new gear lever and new air-con controls on the centre console.

The Xplorer is available in both three- and five-door body styles while the Xpedition is available only as a five-door.

The three-door model can be optioned as either a hard top or with a fabric soft top with a choice of seating configurations ranging from a four plus driver to a seven plus driver seating arrangement. The five-door model, on the other hand, is available as a hard top only in ether a six- or an eight-seat configuration, excluding the driver.

As per Force, the 2017 Gurkha is based on a new ladder-frame chassis, along with a new suspension setup. At the front, the SUV gets new independent struts with gas-charged shock absorbers and an anti-roll bar, while at the rear, it comes with a new multi-link setup that also features gas-charged hydraulic shocks and an anti-roll bar.

The Gurkha carries on with the 85hp, 2.6-litre diesel engine with the unit now BS-IV compatible and paired with a new five-speed manual gearbox sending power to either the rear or all-four wheels.

Of the two variants offered, the Xplorer is the serious off-roader and comes equipped with four-wheel drive with low range and locking front and rear differentials. The Xpedition, on the other hand, is rear wheel drive.

The Gurkha Xpedition is priced at Rs 8.38 lakh while the Xplorer is priced at Rs 9.36 lakh (ex-showroom, Delhi).
Source: Autocarindia.com
Attached Thumbnails
The 2017 Force Gurkha-imgnew4.jpg  

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Old 22nd March 2017, 00:24   #32
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Default Re: Review: The Force Gurkha 4x4

Some pics of new 4x2 Gurkha.

Both Explorer (MWB) & Expedition (LWB) versions are available at the dealership here.

Gurkha Expedition
The 2017 Force Gurkha-wp_20170320_18_43_45_pro-medium.jpg

The 2017 Force Gurkha-wp_20170320_18_43_59_pro-medium.jpg

The 2017 Force Gurkha-wp_20170320_18_44_05_pro-medium.jpg

The 2017 Force Gurkha-wp_20170320_18_44_18_pro-medium.jpg

The 2017 Force Gurkha-wp_20170320_18_44_36_pro-medium.jpg

The 2017 Force Gurkha-wp_20170320_18_44_44_pro-medium.jpg

The 2017 Force Gurkha-wp_20170320_18_44_48_pro-medium.jpg

Gurkha Explorer
The 2017 Force Gurkha-wp_20170320_18_45_54_pro-medium.jpg

The 2017 Force Gurkha-wp_20170320_18_45_43_pro-medium.jpg

The 2017 Force Gurkha-wp_20170320_18_46_05_pro-medium.jpg

The 2017 Force Gurkha-wp_20170320_18_46_09_pro-medium.jpg

Dealership was closed so took only few pics.

They have promised me a TD though.

Edit : I assumed that all Gurkha's are 4x4 only so didnt asked the sales guy if these are 4x4 or 4x2, but i just realized from the pics that there are no front axle shafts visible .

& Brochure also says Expedition is 4x2 , comes with following.
  • Snorkel
  • Tow hook
The 2017 Force Gurkha-wp_20170322_00_38_17_pro-medium.jpg

The 2017 Force Gurkha-wp_20170322_00_38_27_pro-medium.jpg

Last edited by jeepster : 22nd March 2017 at 00:45.
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Old 22nd March 2017, 00:32   #33
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Default

Gurkha looks fantastic. I would love to own a car which looks this good. But then..... Not at all a practical choice.

Let me put forward my suggestion:

Gurkha's Xplorer 4x4 5 door - Price ~ 10 Lakh (Ex Delhi)
Scorpio S4+*4WD = 11.2 L (Ex Delhi)
Add Proper A/T tyres + Eaton MLD + Snorkel ~ 1 lakh

But what you get is a proven car with safer body, Airbags, ABS, 120ps Power, far better interiors & equipment, better serviceability etc. which is more than satisfactory off-road capability.

Also, I think Gurkha 3 Door may appeal to hard core 4x4 enthusiasts. Also Force's claims suggest that it should be better Thar in ride quality & off road ability.

But Gurkha Xplorer 4x4 5 door and Gurkha xpedition 4x2 look pointless, unless it is used as a people mover in 8+ Driver config.

Last edited by GTO : 22nd March 2017 at 09:22. Reason: Typo
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Old 22nd March 2017, 05:18   #34
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Default Re: The 2017 Force Gurkha

What's the price of the 2 door version. I heard on some groups that it was around 8L. If so then it's cheaper than the outgoing model. Here's a quotation I got some time ago for the old model. This was after massive discounts. Looks like the new model is cheaper.
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The 2017 Force Gurkha-gurka-quote-2.jpg  

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Old 22nd March 2017, 07:43   #35
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Default Re: Review: The Force Gurkha 4x4

Any idea why they want a snorkel on a 4x2 ?
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Old 22nd March 2017, 09:18   #36
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Default Re: Review: The Force Gurkha 4x4

Quote:
Originally Posted by condor View Post
Any idea why they want a snorkel on a 4x2 ?
Believe just as a show item than the anything else. Looks do matter
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Old 22nd March 2017, 09:24   #37
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Default Re: The 2017 Force Gurkha

Quote:
Originally Posted by sechebe View Post
Let me put forward my suggestion:

Gurkha's Xplorer 4x4 5 door - Price ~ 10 Lakh (Ex Delhi)
Scorpio S4+*4WD = 11.2 L (Ex Delhi)
So true. The Gurkha looks terribly overpriced, but then so are the other offroaders. The barebones Gypsy costs more than 7 lakhs in Mumbai, while the Thar CRDe crosses 10 lakhs. The latter two though get you support from big manufacturers, which isn't the case with the Gurkha.
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Old 22nd March 2017, 10:18   #38
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Default Re: Some real world pictures

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4addict View Post
This is how the vehicle looks in real life. Alloys etc are etc. Did I hear 12 Lakhs on the road??
That looks crude! The long journey (RFC -> Marketing Gurkha -> Actual Gurkha) seems to have taken a toll on it, it has lost most of the appealing stuff! Sigh!

And, I agree, more than a million bucks for an 85 bhp engine and that interior might prove to be too optimistic a pricing by Force. But, isn't this a trend in the auto sector anyway? Products are getting increasingly dearer or if they stay near the original price band, there is a drop in quality.

Don't know what Force is cooking, but given the mandatory ABS/Airbags and crash test worthiness thingie coming up, it will be interesting to know what will the Gurkha do. Which of it's 4 of the 4x4x4 will save it?
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Old 22nd March 2017, 10:20   #39
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Default Re: Force Gurkha 2017 (BS-IV) Launched - Prices start @ 8.38 Lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by sechebe View Post
.....
All the above with Front & Rear Diff Locks, A/T tires as standard. A/c too.

Source: Autocarindia.com
I dont think even Thar, "the off roader" had approach and departure angles prominently highlighted in any of the showrooms. Or even at the numerous events that Mahindra had hosted.

But lo, Force Gurkha guys thought about it. RFC has had its impacts.

The 2017 Force Gurkha-imgnew4.jpg
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Old 22nd March 2017, 11:53   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepster View Post
I assumed that all Gurkha's are 4x4 only so didnt asked the sales guy if these are 4x4 or 4x2, but i just realized from the pics that there are no front axle shafts visible
Gurkha Explorer is essentially the 4WD version which comes in both 3-door and 5-door trims. Gurkha Expedition is the 2WD version which comes only in 5-door trim. Check this out - http://www.forcegurkha.co.in/specification-2/

So net-net, you can still buy the 5-door avatar of the Gurkha in 4WD, if that is what you were lamenting about

Edit: There is a live thread on the new Gurkha here (The 2017 Force Gurkha)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4addict View Post
This is how the vehicle looks in real life. Alloys etc are etc. Did I hear 12 Lakhs on the road??
Quite sad I must say - very similar to a PYT on and off the silver screen But at least it gets A/T tyres which is not the case with Thar (propped to be a serious off-roader)

Quote:
Originally Posted by sechebe View Post
All the above with Front & Rear Diff Locks, A/T tires as standard. A/c too.
I thought the ST version did not get A/C. Are you sure about this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spinnerr View Post
But lo, Force Gurkha guys thought about it. RFC has had its impacts
There are no two thoughts about the off-road abilities of the Gurkha. If, and only if, they'd plonked in a decent CRDE engine in there!! One can still live with the spartan interiors but not with as weak a powerplant as this

Last edited by khan_sultan : 24th March 2017 at 14:30. Reason: Back to back posts -- merging
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Old 22nd March 2017, 12:20   #41
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Default Re: The 2017 Force Gurkha

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dry Ice View Post
Don't know what Force is cooking, but given the mandatory ABS/Airbags and crash test worthiness thingie coming up, it will be interesting to know what will the Gurkha do. Which of it's 4 of the 4x4x4 will save it?
You know when I test drove previous *pushup bra* version, the engine/ride/handling/gearbox/steering was horrendous to say the least. So, when I asked the sales rep why the vehicle is terrible to drive, he said that it is only meant to be used off-road. Great, a vehicle that costs 12 lakhs on the road, only to be meant to be used off-road, not on the road.

So when you ask them about safety features, they will say that regular crash test norms are to test the vehicle but Gurkha is used to test how strong the crash test barrier is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cool_dube View Post
There are no two thoughts about the off-road abilities of the Gurkha. If, and only if, they'd plonked in a decent CRDE engine in there!! One can still live with the spartan interiors but not with as weak a powerplant as this
Exactly, even I would have grudgingly accepted the interiors. I mean we are jeepers and have been accustomed to worse stuff, but no way am I compromising on engine performance. This is key to off-roading.

Last edited by 4x4addict : 22nd March 2017 at 12:23.
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Old 22nd March 2017, 14:10   #42
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Default Re: The 2017 Force Gurkha

The pics look good & one is tempted, especially the Explorer with roof rack & approach+departure angles highlighted. However, the interiors are 2 generations old & so is the engine. It may be a different animal off road, but it needs to tread the tarred road to access those off roads.

Plus putting on a driver's airbag (in steering) & ABS isn't that difficult IMO.

Add to this this they have the 2.2 litre 120 BHP engine in Force-One, which could have been used here I feel.

At last I'm left expecting more Force Motors.

@jeepster I am eagerly waiting for your Test Drive Review.

Last edited by CARDEEP : 22nd March 2017 at 14:18.
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Old 22nd March 2017, 16:35   #43
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Default Re: The 2017 Force Gurkha

I think Force motors needs to start paying their staff more. This seems more like a "how to destroy a good product" example. I mean look at the engine, the roof and interiors are not helping the case either.

Forget about buying a new one, I would only be interested if I can get a used open top three door 4x4 at half the cost.
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Old 22nd March 2017, 20:33   #44
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Default Re: The 2017 Force Gurkha

Massive bashing has been unleashed on the Gurkha and specifically Force Motors It is a well accepted fact that Force motors is one of the least competitive players in the automotive space and mainly caters to UV people move segment in tier 2 tier 3 towns.

Comparing apples to apples, which would be pitting the new Gurkha against the 2016 Thar in this case. I think the Gurkha offers more than a Thar does. I'd cite the following to support my case. I shall start in descending order of attributes that most appeal to an off road enthusiast:
- Differential Locks: Thar 2016 has an auto locking rear diff Vs Gurkha's manual locking front and rear. Advantage Gurkha
- Engine: Thar has the more modern CRDE unit Vs Gurkha's old Merc derived unit. Thar's engine belts out 20 bhp and 17 NM more. Advantage Thar
- Weight: Most keen off road enthusiasts try and reduce the weight as much as possible and Gurkha loses here tipping the scales at 2.5 Ton Vs Thar's 1.75 Ton. Advantage Thar
- Wheel Base, Track Width: Gurkha has a wheelbase which is shorter by 30 mm. Gurkha also has a wider track both front and back by 45 mm and 134 mm respectively. All which will add up to better ability offroad. Advantage Gurkha
- Other standard off road friendly features:
- Front Bumper- Thar has an extended fibre bumper Vs Gurkha's short and stub metal bumper with built in fogs. Advantage Gurkha
- Gurkha comes with a standard Snorkel. Advantage Gurkha
- Gurkha also has a hard top. For overland journeys, long drives and in extreme/adverse weather conditions, the factory built hardtop has a definite advantage over the Thar. Hard top again is advantageous in terms of safety and security (occupants and their belongings). Even in case of a roll over, the Gurkha will fare better than a soft top or a custom fit fibre top Thar. Not to mention that the aftermarket Hard tops for a Thar cost quite a bit in 50k-1L range. Advantage Gurkha
- Gurkha has coil springs both front and back. Better ride quality for sure than the rear leaf spring'd Thar. Advantage Gurkha
- Approach angles: Thar is 44" Vs Gurkha's 39". Departure angles are similar at 37". Ramp break over angles need to be checked. But with Gurkha having a shorter wheel base and higher GC, it should be advantage Gurkha
- OEM Tyres: 245 wide on Gurkha vs 235 wide on Thar. Advantage Gurkha
Interiors: Thar 2016 hands down.

I write these lines to bring in some support for the Gurkha. From all the offroading videos and reviews that I have seen and read, the first and second gen Gurkhas fare better than the first and second gen Thars.

To give you all some context, I am not a hardcore offroader myself but I have done my fair bit of offroading. I have extensively driven the pre 2016 Thar (non diff lock, old dash and terrible seats) and the post 2016 Thar (good dash and relativety comfy seats) both on and off road (boulders, pebbles, dirt tracks, beaches and lake/river beds). I really like the 2016 Thar with auto rear diff lock, a feature which is enough to get you out of most offroad situations. I have no first hand experience driving any iteration of the Gurkha.

The mediocre engine, weight and after sales service are definitely major disadvantages for the Gurkha. But I shall reserve my verdict till I drive the 2017 Gurkha Xplorer 4x4 3 door hard top, which is scheduled for next week . From the price perspective, the Gurkha looks like a better value proposition than the Thar because of more standard offroad and overlanding friendly features. Onroad price of Gurkha in Delhi/NCR is 10.7 L vs 9.7 L for the Thar. The one lakh premium can be easily attributed to the hard top, rear and front diff locks, metal offroad friendly bumper, snorkel and wider tyres.

I also think the Xpedition version in 5 door format will a great overland vehicle when it is launched in 4x4 format.

Comparing the Gurkha to a conventional ladder on frame SUV (read 4x4 Scorpio/ 4x4 Safari Storme) or the Isuzu V-max is not appropriate as they are very different vehicles for very different purposes. The price difference will also be in the range of 2 lakh (Scorpio) and even higher in case of the V-max. Also, the V-max, Scorpio 4x4, Safari Strome 4x4 are pretty bad for anything over mild offroading in OEM guise. I have taken OEM spec Dicor Safari 4x4, Strome 4x4 and Scorpio 4x4 to beaches and lake beds and they all bogged down. A Thar 4x4 was way better than them and could easily pull itself out after getting bogged out in 4x4 high. All were riding on H/T tyres, Thar had Geolander A/Ts on the rear.

A used and modded Gypsy with diff locks and 1.6 engine swap might still be a better value proposition but in the OEM guise, I think the Gurkha makes a good point for itself, unless one has the time, patience, know how and access to a skilled mechanic to build his/her own offroader.

Waiting for the many true blue offroad gurus to add to this discussion.

The response from Force motors sales team has been satisfactory and they sent me the following pictures in less than a hour of speaking to them. Cheers!
Attached Thumbnails
The 2017 Force Gurkha-img_20170216_114301-1.jpg  

The 2017 Force Gurkha-img_20170216_114246.jpg  

The 2017 Force Gurkha-img_20170216_114340-1.jpg  

The 2017 Force Gurkha-img_20170216_114308.jpg  

The 2017 Force Gurkha-img_20170216_114349.jpg  

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Old 22nd March 2017, 20:51   #45
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Default Re: The 2017 Force Gurkha

Quote:
Originally Posted by BeantownThinker View Post
The Xpedition (5-door) is cheaper than the Xplorer (3-door). The price difference is 1 lakh on ex-showroom in Karnataka. But the Xplorer has higher ground clearance than the Xpedition (by about 1.5cm) and is lesser than 4m in length (at about 3992mm) thus getting the excise benefit. Did not see any other difference apart from these.

So then why is the 3-door Xplorer more expensive than the 5-door Xpedition?
The ~2500 cc engine ensures that it doesn't get any tax benefits which is limed to <1500 cc diesels.
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