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Old 14th August 2017, 15:00   #61
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Default Re: July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

I see that this is fast becoming a Maruti lovers vs Maruti critics discussion.

Just to put things in perspective, be it my post or other members who are speaking against Maruti's dominance, all of us agree that Maruti is definitely to be appreciated for its fantastic competence and it's well deserved position on the top of the pyramid.

I think we are more upset about the buyer's mentality that is skewing the market very unfavourably for the other manufacturers

I reiterate, Maruti is awesome in itself
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Old 14th August 2017, 15:02   #62
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Default Re: July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

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Originally Posted by highonwheelz View Post
They have also been trendsetters in the industry.
Makes me grin Ear 2 Ear, here are the reasons -

1) More than 50% of their sales are constituted from engines sourced by them, can we think of this anywhere else in the globe?

2) In the place called Mecca of Cars, they declared bankruptcy in 2012.

3) After years and years of R&D came up with lousy to say the least 2 cylinder diesel, only to shelf it themselves.

4) Please have a look at their build quality, I recently purchased and sold (within 3 months of ownership) the Ertiga, which is still better built than the Dzires, other than the Engine and Space going for it, there was hardly a bone in the car.

5) True Value - Please try and sell them a car and after a couple of months, try and buy it back from them, I'm sure, it shall create a dent in your pocket.

6) There are 100's of owners here itself who are more than happy with non MSIL products, they just don't scream out loud.

7) Driving Schools - How many people by name do we know who are making it to those schools?

Where MSIL has been good is, quality checks coming out of factory and the plethora of options they provide from 3-12L.

An average head does not make it to TBHP, that's what makes the difference when we discuss here.

Last edited by Torquedo : 14th August 2017 at 15:03.
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Old 14th August 2017, 15:25   #63
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Default Re: July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

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Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
1) More than 50% of their sales are constituted from engines sourced by them, can we think of this anywhere else in the globe?
It may be Maruti's inability to build good Diesel engines, but they are the kings when it comes to Petrol engines.

Think it as a strategy as well. When the Diesel engines become obsolete, they can just stop buying those, and go for some good batteries for the EVs.

The same is applicable when Maruti decided to allow Suzuki to build their own plant in India. If the demand goes down, stop buying cars from the Suzuki plant.

Quote:
6) There are 100's of owners here itself who are more than happy with non MSIL products...
Quite natural. Only 50% of the cars are sold by Maruti. Other 50% is sold by "Non-Maruti" manufacturers.

Quote:
7) Driving Schools - How many people by name do we know who are making it to those schools?
Even with that, Maruti is able to run the driving school business.

Last edited by GTO : 15th August 2017 at 10:53. Reason: Do NOT submit rude posts
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Old 14th August 2017, 15:56   #64
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Default Re: July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

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Originally Posted by discoverwild View Post
Do read the link to understand more about how Maruti managed to get such a large market share.
Probably they got their by hook or crook for sure they are not surviving their only by those methods. From your comments it appears that you have something personal and hence these comments.

Been out of the Maruti Family myself from 2012 onwards and even though I drive the very epitome of German Affordable Engineered cars for the masses, it fails to give me the confidence that my puny, tinny swift gave me over 157000 Kms.

The peace of mind was very much high when I was driving the swift. Even if it got stranded I knew where to head to instead of reaching out to google to help me with Tow Trucks.
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Old 14th August 2017, 15:57   #65
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Default Re: July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

I don't quite understand how a customer gives equal importance to reliability and after sales services. To me if a car is reliable, the a.s.s is not necessarily to be top class. Because for a very reliable car, apart from the regular services with 10K/15K intervals I will not need to visit service centers ideally. So, a not so bad a.s.s should not be a problem with a very reliable car.
I have owned Tata, Maruti and Hyundai cars so far. Both Maruti and Hyundai cars were and have been extremely reliable. So if I plan to buy a Maruti or a Hyundai car again, I will not be bothered even if their reputation regarding a.s.s goes down a little bit. Same holds true for number of service centers a brand has. I won't mind if a service center is 35 km away from my home, if the car is reliable.
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Old 14th August 2017, 16:06   #66
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Default Re: July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

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Originally Posted by ku69rd View Post
Probably they got their by hook or crook for sure they are not surviving their only by those methods. From your comments it appears that you have something personal and hence these comments.

Been out of the Maruti Family myself from 2012 onwards and even though I drive the very epitome of German Affordable Engineered cars for the masses, it fails to give me the confidence that my puny, tinny swift gave me over 157000 Kms.

The peace of mind was very much high when I was driving the swift. Even if it got stranded I knew where to head to instead of reaching out to google to help me with Tow Trucks.
That's entirely laughable. I just said monopoly is not a good thing. If you read my signature, you will understand that I have bought across most brands during my time, including a half a dozen from Maruti.

I have nothing to do with Maruti nor do I take money from Tata to badmouth Maruti. The discussion was about why competition isn't enough for others to make a headway in the market and I reasoned it out to Maruti Suzuki being the early bird with a lot of cajoling and cuddling. Can you say it is not true?

BTW, my father's 26 year old M800 has done about 4L kms and I still do have it in the family. I have had the Gypsy King for 9 years doing over 1L kms. I have had 4 Tatas each covering over 1.5L kms each. I still drive with the same peace of mind that you do although we drive different cars.
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Old 14th August 2017, 16:14   #67
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Default Re: July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by discoverwild View Post

BTW, my father's 26 year old M800 has done about 4L kms and I still do have it in the family. I have had the Gypsy King for 9 years doing over 1L kms. I have had 4 Tatas each covering over 1.5L kms each. I still drive with the same peace of mind that you do although we drive different cars.
Matters to me least on what you drive or how much you have driven, for me i buy a car for its reliability and ease of maintaining it. If Maruti can give it people will stick to it.
Good for you that drive a plethora of cars and enjoying it as well.
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Old 14th August 2017, 16:24   #68
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Default Re: July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

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Originally Posted by ku69rd View Post
i buy a car for its reliability and ease of maintaining it. If Maruti can give it people will stick to it.
Good for you that drive a plethora of cars and enjoying it as well.
Likewise, my friend. Why would I drive a Tata or a Toyota if I didn't find it reliable or had a tough time maintaining it?

I mentioned it because you said I had something personal against Maruti. Why would I? Just because I don't drive one anymore?? Give me a break, please.
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Old 14th August 2017, 16:29   #69
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Default Re: July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

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Originally Posted by highonwheelz View Post
Hence, my point is that Indians don't prefer MSIL because "Sharmaji said so" but because they get fuss free ownership, un rivalled after sales service, rock solid resale value, and a bit of fuel efficiency (which IMHO is not that much better than the competition). Us armchair critics look at only build quality and diss a product when we aren't actually going to buy it. But for the ones who are going to drop some hard earned dough on it, sadly have a lot more aspects to consider than the average petrol head.
Not completely true. Most people on this forum are not armchair critics with money to spare and splash around but genuine lovers of cars. A lot, like me, may not even qualify as hardcore petrol-heads and think a million times before pumping our 'hard-earned dough' into anything. So a little consideration would be nice.

A lot of us here have bought Maruti cars over a period of time, at some point or the other. I own one, did earlier too. There is no denying that for most average middle-class buyers, Maruti remains the first pit-stop. All the pluses you listed hold true, to some extent. Not all dealers or ASS are great, just like with any brand. And it isn't exactly fuss-free either, at least now.

That said, that doesn't mean people who do go for it don't care about build quality. It's a compromise many make, specially when a lot of driving within city is involved. A toss-up between two identical cars with the only difference being in build quality would most likley push the buyer towards the second option.

BUT -- and this is where "Sharmaji" comes in -- when you have 100 people advising and whispering in your ears to "buy maruti, reliable" or "buy maruti, safe option" or "buy maruti, tested brand" then there is a toss-up subconsciously to pick Maruti even if it is weaker. Even when many of those giving such advice may either not have owned a car or not a maruti themselves. That is what most people on this forum who are nitpicking with MSIL are trying to say. None of them is anti-maruti. But as the teacher used to always write in school report cards, "there is scope for improvement".
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Old 14th August 2017, 16:33   #70
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Smile Re: July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
1) More than 50% of their sales are constituted from engines sourced by them, can we think of this anywhere else in the globe?
On a lighter note, this made business sense for Fiat to continue in India and the enthusiasts got their Puntos, Lineas, T Jets and the Abarth . So its MSIL's lack of R&D, that another company is surviving.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
2) In the place called Mecca of Cars, they declared bankruptcy in 2012.
The title says 'Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis', so discuss their position in India.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
3) After years and years of R&D came up with lousy to say the least 2 cylinder diesel, only to shelf it themselves.
Not all attempts will be successful, I mean on the overall initiatives and not w.r.t engines alone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
4) Please have a look at their build quality,
Build quality is on par with Hyundai and Honda

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
I recently purchased and sold (within 3 months of ownership) the Ertiga, which is still better built than the Dzires, other than the Engine and Space going for it, there was hardly a bone in the car.
You should have done better R&D before purchase

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
5) True Value - Please try and sell them a car and after a couple of months, try and buy it back from them, I'm sure, it shall create a dent in your pocket.
Don't understand what you are trying to convey here. Why would you sell a car and buy it back after a couple of months?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
6) There are 100's of owners here itself who are more than happy with non MSIL products, they just don't scream out loud.
What's the point here? probably since 50% of all cars sold are Maruti, the noise is louder I guess

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
7) Driving Schools - How many people by name do we know who are making it to those schools?
Again a vague question? What/how do you want us to infer?

Last edited by Karthik Chandra : 14th August 2017 at 16:51.
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Old 14th August 2017, 16:43   #71
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Default Re: July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karthik Chandra View Post
The title says 'Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis'
The intent here was, Maruti as a company could not make much hay in the US, they are milking us here in India.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karthik Chandra View Post
Not all attempts will be successful.
How many engine development attempts have they made.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Karthik Chandra View Post
Build quality is on par with Hyundai and Honda
i20 is far better built than the Baleno so is the i10 over the Ignis.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Karthik Chandra View Post
You should have done better R&D before purchase
Did, that is why sold it at higher price than I bought it, the difference in OTR from March till July 2017 is more than 2L.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Karthik Chandra View Post
Don't understand what you are trying to convey here. Why would you sell a car and buy it back after a couple of months?
Just to emphasize the fact that how they are minting bucks. Low Buying price and High Selling price.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karthik Chandra View Post
Again a vague question? What/how do you want us to infer?
To the OP, that these driving schools and stuff are marketing gimmicks.
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Old 14th August 2017, 17:05   #72
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Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
The intent here was, Maruti as a company could not make much hay in the US, they are milking us here in India.
Isn't it the same case with other manufacturers too??

Honda charges a premium for cars with shared body panels and similar looking dash.

Toyota with the Innova and Fortuner

Volkswagen selling an 8 year old design - The Polo and the Vento

Hyundai mints $$$ on the Creta and i20

Note: I've quoted the above to re-iterate the point that other companies do the same - Milk the customer

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post

How many engine development attempts have they made.
I meant on the overall initiatives. Have corrected my post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
i20 is far better built than the Baleno so is the i10 over the Ignis.
Only a crash test will reveal the truth, until then the debate on structural rigidity is pointless.

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Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
Did, that is why sold it at higher price than I bought it, the difference in OTR from March till July 2017 is more than 2L.
Good for you. Since it was a Maruti you were able to profit from the deal

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
Just to emphasize the fact that how they are minting bucks. Low Buying price and High Selling price.
That's a business model. I don't see anything wrong here. Companies exist to make profits.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
To the OP, that these driving schools and stuff are marketing gimmicks.
Gimmicks??? why would running a driving school be a gimmick. Customer pays and learns driving. Again this is a business model for revenue generation.

Last edited by Karthik Chandra : 14th August 2017 at 17:26.
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Old 14th August 2017, 17:23   #73
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Default Re: July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

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Originally Posted by S.MJet View Post
Thanks Aditya for the analysis.

Maruti has shown once again no one can compete with them. 11 of the top 25 cars are from Maruti and top 6 places taken by them in a row. Three models Baleno, Breeza and Celerio have clocked their best numbers ever.

Tigor is a disappointment with that small 3 cylinder diesel heart. As you move up the price segment expectations also moves up but they did a blunder by launching with that small diesel engine, they manage to sell more Zests than the newly launched stylish Tigor. Even if they think of putting 1.5L Nexon diesel mill in Tigor it will be an real uphill task to revive. Once a dud always a dud especially for OEM like Tata.
The Tigor should be launched with the 1.3 MJD as the Zest is moving the Taxi way, that engine would perfectly suit the car and also make it stronger with the competition. Am sure in future Tata Motors will have have a 1.3L diesel variant stripped doen from their own 1.5L diesel engine beng launched on Nexon.
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Old 14th August 2017, 17:49   #74
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Default Re: July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

Haven't gone through every post here but here is my experience.

When I bought Figo for dad, almost everyone in family laughed because I didn't buy Ritz or WagonR. After six years, last month during a get together, again one of them taunted that Fords are expensive to maintain. I asked them to compare service bills for last three years. Needless to say almost everyone was shocked to know that Figo needs yearly service compared to their Marutis 6 Months. Not sure if that's changed now. Also multiple examples of adding unnecessary charges which though happens in Ford as well, isn't as bad. One particularly unlucky guy had a engine flush a down his throat at 25k running. One of the lucky converts has bought top end HEXA now. Got delivered yesterday!

Just my 2p. No offence to anyone.

Last edited by akshay380 : 14th August 2017 at 17:54.
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Old 14th August 2017, 19:06   #75
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Default Re: July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

Maruti Suzuki and Honda increase PV market share in April-July 2017 .

Quote:
The country’s largest carmaker, which had a market share of 46.83% in April-July 2016, has now grown its PV market share by a sizeable 3.89 percent to 50.72 percent over a 12-month period. With sales of 520,684 units in April-July 2017, out of a cumulative industry total of 1,026,655 units, every second PV sold in India is a Maruti.
July 2017 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis-passengervehiclesapriljuly.jpg

link
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