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Old 21st June 2018, 19:24   #1
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Default Feedback scale of automakers - An unfair practice

Mods: Please merge it with any other thread if it is already discussed.

I have been observing the feedback scales of automakers, the ones I experience directly are of Ford and Hyundai.

This is their scale for rating

1-8 Poor
9 outstanding
10 Excellent

Whenever I get a call on feedback, I am pressured to provide a 9 or 10, while I may think that the service center only met the expectation. Recently I rated a service as 8 for lack of something in between. The very next day I get a call from an agitated service advisor almost pleading with me to rate it higher. When I said it is not because anything went wrong and it is only that I cannot rate it outstanding as the service met my expectation, I get a sweet deal of 1000 Rs off of labour/parts cost in my next service if I rate it 10 on 10.

How do other TBHPians deal with it?

-tortoise
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Old 21st June 2018, 19:33   #2
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Default re: Feedback scale of automakers - An unfair practice

Experienced this several times, never offered discount though. What I do is to use this to set the expectation with SA before leaving the car for service. I make sure all expectations are recorded in their work order form including no sticker policy. Expectations of cleanliness are set. Once SA meets it which most of the times they do , I am very happy to give them 10. For me ,if it is 8 or 9 I always give 10. If it hellps the SA why not.
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Old 21st June 2018, 19:47   #3
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Default re: Feedback scale of automakers - An unfair practice

One practice i have found across multiple MASS is that they just take your signature on the bill as well as the spot-feedback card by folding the sheets so only the 'sign here' section is visible to you. If you do not notice what it is, your signature is there on the feedback card and they can fill in a 10 at their will.

Yes, you do get a follow-up call and a feedback request couple of days after the service, but not sure which rating would they take...the one on card or the oral rating over the phone.
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Old 21st June 2018, 20:23   #4
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Default re: Feedback scale of automakers - An unfair practice

While I document Do's and Don'ts for each service and stay on-site with the car, I outright refuse to rate on absurd scales.

I offer to provide detailed written feedback instead. A few diligent SAs who actually care are happy to get proper feedback, others just ignore me and I return the favor.
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Old 21st June 2018, 20:52   #5
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Default re: Feedback scale of automakers - An unfair practice

A normal, scheduled service can be good, if there are no problems to resolve. Throw in the behaviour of service advisors, facilities in the customer lounge, water wash are included and clubbed together.

In most cases, water wash just about passes. A neighborhood water wash facility usually has more equipment and they do a more thorough job compared to most service centres.

That is why, unless a car has a problem which is resolved promptly there is no point in rating it as 'outstanding' for routine service.

Sometimes a less than outstanding rating brings the SA calling to request for higher rating. Sometimes the cause for such a rating is looked into and the service centre does rectify the problem.

Last edited by simplyself : 21st June 2018 at 20:55.
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Old 21st June 2018, 21:37   #6
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Maruti authorised service centres are the worst in this regard. They are relentless until they get the highest rating! I remember such instances when I had 2 marutis at home, a Dzire and an alto. Sold them 6 years ago and post that I found Skoda to be less insistent on these ratings. Actually found folks at Skoda pretty easy to deal with. No unnecessary pressure on any feedback.

Also experienced something similar to Maruti with Honda, for my wifeys Brio, but I always state that I will give my feedback only post one month of service and that second call never comes! So one good way to get this out.

Not experienced Hyundai as yet, since I have just completed only a 1000km service, hopefully they do not trouble me like the folks from Maruti!
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Old 21st June 2018, 22:00   #7
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Default re: Feedback scale of automakers - An unfair practice

It is a "useless" practise rather than an "unfair" practise. Useless, because it beats the whole purpose of getting feedback from customers. They will not be able to gauge improvement or deterioration in service levels.

I think they are taking inspiration from school/colleges that grade students. Anything below 80% is bad, 90% is good and 100% is excellent.

Last edited by Gannu_1 : 22nd June 2018 at 07:50. Reason: Typo.
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Old 21st June 2018, 22:12   #8
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Default re: Feedback scale of automakers - An unfair practice

This behaviour is driven because these companies are following the "Net Promoter Score" method. Here the ratings try to determine if happy customer less the sum of merely satisfied & pissed off is a positive number. The 8, 9 & 10 raters are the promoters. The 7 & 6 are the fence sitters and the 5 and below are the detractors. So the promoters less the detractors is the 'net promoter' score. Super service companies like Singapore Airlines manage a net promoter score like a 45. Even a score of 35 is considered very good.

Hence this mad rush of 'teacher, please teacher, give me 3 stars'.

Last edited by V.Narayan : 21st June 2018 at 22:13.
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Old 21st June 2018, 22:14   #9
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Default re: Feedback scale of automakers - An unfair practice

I'd written about this in another thread. It comes down to the fact that Indians are poor at taking criticism.. as in very poor. So much so that when the Indian bureaucratic style of functioning takes over an international company here.. that company too gets corrupted. It is so stereotypically bureaucratic :

1) Arm-lock the customer into giving great feedback

2) If great feedback isn't given then offer freebies/massage the ego of the customer into giving the required feedback.

3) If that doesn't work, then ignore the feedback or if it works, accept it and re-start at step 1 for the next time.

The very ethos of business is in refining the procedures, productivity and products and making such a situation that the customer automatically is happy with the product at the end of the day. Criticism is actually a form of 'encouragment'. Reminds me of a few years back when I was doing consulting for a supply-chain model and I implemented my own form of TQM where I was looking for defects or low-performance areas within the supply-chain by using feedback from end to end.. the feedback asked only 3 questions related to areas of concern and how to improve. The bureaucracy once again had to interfere because no one wants their faults pointed out to them whether it is in packaging, supply, lead time etc.

Lets not forget that Japan had a culture steeped in mediocrity, zero quality control and absolutely horrendous products, however William Edwards Deming in the 1950's introduced the concept of continuous monitoring, refinement and improvement of processes in order to gain higher sales. I consider his epistemology a more practical, easier to understand yet much older form of the 6 Sigma which came 3 decades later.

Criticism is the highest form of flattery.. it means people/customers/rivals care enough. Do not brush it under the carpet because the future of sales depend on it.

Last edited by dark.knight : 21st June 2018 at 22:15.
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Old 21st June 2018, 22:23   #10
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I was offered free interior and exterior car wash by a dealer beause he came to know that my name was selected for JD Power Survey. This is not a VW dealer, I also own another brand vehicle. I went to the service center and the Service Manager there gave me a tour of the service center and explained what all services they offered. I got my car washed for free as promised. Will I give 10 out of 10 to them when I get a call from JD Power? Maybe not. I will give a true opinion that have based on the service experience for my car. They may try to influence us by the offers and freebies. But I feel we should be giving an honest feedback in surveys.
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Old 22nd June 2018, 07:49   #11
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Smile re: Feedback scale of automakers - An unfair practice

Most of the time the rating method is non sense. The rating seekers do not hear what customers tell. They only ask for ratings on a scale of 1 -10. That the customer feedback is more than just the ratings is beyond their given brief.

One does get irritated at times when they simply push for ratings.

This is not exclusive to automobiles. I got a taste of this rating mania when I bought a laptop recently. The SA asked me to click on the link sent to my mobile and rate them. And she did took a peek from time to time as to what I m giving them
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Old 22nd June 2018, 08:54   #12
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Default re: Feedback scale of automakers - An unfair practice

Quote:
Originally Posted by tortoise View Post

How do other TBHPians deal with it?

-tortoise
I wouldn't mind giving a good rating if the work done was exceptional. But asking for 10/10 for a pathetic experience is something else. I used to give 10/10 rating all these years but have stopped. Now experiencing good service after giving them all 0/10 .

My experience can be read here:
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...s-3-years.html (Popular Hyundai, Vyttila - Pathetic service continues for 3 years!)


Quote:
Originally Posted by motorworks View Post
Not experienced Hyundai as yet, since I have just completed only a 1000km service, hopefully they do not trouble me like the folks from Maruti!
I guess you didn't see the thread that I had recently started (link above) .

Last edited by naveen.raju : 22nd June 2018 at 09:18.
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Old 22nd June 2018, 08:56   #13
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Default re: Feedback scale of automakers - An unfair practice

The same goes with TATA. They say nothing below 8 is acceptable with the company. I got several calls when I rated them 7. When I gave them 7 rating after my purchase, they called me to hand over a gift and requested to give more than 8 in future. They promised to resolve all the issues on my next service but in vain. Only 2 jobs out of 8 jobs mentioned in the job card were completed. I wrote the same on their feedback card and also gave post service feedback according to my experience on their app but no follow ups till date. Also raised a ticket on their SOUL community but no response from there also.
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Old 22nd June 2018, 09:15   #14
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Default re: Feedback scale of automakers - An unfair practice

Without taking any sides here, let me comment that the Feedback Scale IS NOT AN UNFAIR PRACTICE, it is in fact an industry standard not just for automobile companies, but across most sectors dealing with retail customers. This Standard is known as the NET PROPOTER SCORE.

Further reading - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_Promoter

There is criticism of this model, as with many other models in any given field; after all it is not perfect.

But, across many industries and product segments, it has been observed that focussing on the Promoters (9,10), and acting on their feedback, is a cost-effective way of growing business by the word-of-mouth/on forum publicity that they generate.

If a business has extra time and funds available, they can choose to act on the Passives (7,8), and try to convert some of them into Promoters, by acting on their feedback.

However, there is little to be gained by spending any time or money on Detractors (<7).


Humans aren't entirely rational at all times, which means that our perceptions and actions are dependant quite a lot on our pre-conditioning, biases, moods, constraints and what-not. The NPS model takes this irrationality into account, and helps companies understand who is currently and likely to be favourable to them, so they can spend their efforts on making that set happier.
Model Risk is one of the fields that I work in, so I have a little bit of insight into how this works.

Last edited by roy_libran : 22nd June 2018 at 09:25.
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Old 22nd June 2018, 09:18   #15
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Default re: Feedback scale of automakers - An unfair practice

Quote:
Originally Posted by roy_libran View Post
Without taking any sides here, let me comment that the Feedback Scale IS NOT AN UNFAIR PRACTICE, it is in fact an industry standard not just for automobile companies, but across most sectors dealing with retail customers. This Standard is known as the NET PROPOTER SCORE.
Further reading - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_Promoter

There is criticism of this model, as with many other models in any given field; after all it is not perfect.
But, across many industries and product segments, it has been observed that focussing on the Promoters, and acting on their feedback, is a cost-effective way of growing business by the word-of-mouth/on forum publicity that they generate.
If a business has the time and funds available, they can choose to act on the Passives, and try to convert some of them into Promoters.
However, there is little to be gained by spending any time or money on Detractors.
So does this system mean one is better of giving scores of 7 and 8 (passives) to get faster redressal from the parent company?
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