Would the NHC continue to remain the segment leader.

[rahul_intlad]

Honda India's tax holiday period with the UP government has come to an end,which means that honda will now have to pay 4% sales tax to the UP government.This leads to straight away hike of about Rs. 20,000 on the NHC.So with a base price of 7 lakhs would it continue its market domination.

First the competitors, the fiesta 1.4 seems to be doing very well with the masses and overall fiesta sales are catching up fast with the honda[dont have break-up of fiesta sales,but mostly its the diesel bringing in the volumes,also a 1.6 TDCI and pricecut on the present 1.4 TDCI would be adding icing to the cake].The aveo so far has not really been a real competitor for the honda but maybe a diesel could change all that[how quickly GM brings the diesel dont know].The verna, seems far from being a direct competitor but knowing hyundai its a dark horse in the race[a cheaper diesel variant would be perfect].New Maruti baleno a car not much is known about but if any manufacturer can upset honda its maruti and with a diesel JTD engine may just have the necessary firepower as well.Toyota corolla HE yes that too could eat into the sales of the NHC vtec at least.Will toyota launch the vios too then that would be a very big blow for honda but toyota's plans are secretly kept in some vault in Japan whose keys Toyota india management dont have.Fiat again their linea is the perfect warrior to take on the NHC but their implementation of plans is too unpredictable.Last heard the fabia would be launched as a hatch so not included them.

The NHC is the perfect vehicle for Indian cities.But would the NHC continue its segment domination[although last the gap has narrowed down a lot] or give way to someone else if so which manufacturer do you put your money on.What's your take on this guys.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

My bet is on Maruti Suzuki...

The new Suzuki Baleno with the 90 bhp 1.3 JTD could prove to be a winner...

[GTO]

The way that Indians perceive the Honda brand cannot be undermined....

[iraghava]

Plus seeing what happened with the last Baleno a LOT would depend on how MUL markets & prices the car.

As for the Verna the CRDi is already bare-basic for its segment & I don't see how they can introduce a cheaper version unless they decide to even remove the basic equipment that they have provided.

Fiat as you said has a habit of chopping it's own legs off so we really can't say anything until we know what they are upto.

All in all it's an open game for the competitors, if they can bring out a worthy product & convince the customers to look beyong the Honda brand name, they might just spring a surprise on Honda.

[indian21r]

It will be till Indians look beyond the brand. Even if it is going to cost you 20,000 more, you can be rest assured you can get that amount back in resale. I do't think the sales would be affected too much. maybe a slight decrease intially but they would pick up.

[unknown_entity]

Won't comment on the SX4 (or whatever it is that they plan to call it eventually) till the specs and price is out ... but I guess Ford Fiesta (petrol and diesel) combined will give it a run for its money ... Funnily enough, I have a feeling the Honda tag will prevail still.

[amit]

I agree with GTO.

IMO, NHC will continue to dominate the segment and it's sales will continue to rise.

About the Linea, I don't think the Linea JTD will be priced at City levels. It's going to be more into Civic territory. The base petrol Linea will probably be priced near abouts the NHC. I'd like to know the sales figures of the Corolla exective. I don't think Toyota has managed to make any dent in NHC sales with their cheaper Corolla.

[askicode]

We have seen heavy discounts given by other manufacturers but none or very less from the Honda stable. The last discount I heard was a 10K reduction. Thats about it. I guess they do enjoy a premium. How else can you justify a 1Lkh plus price tag compared to its peers in that category like the Fiesta, Aveo etc.

I guess it will continue to maintain its position primarily because it has always updated or revamped its product portfolio from time to time before it got stale unlike the Ford Ikons and the Balenos and the Esteems.

I guess we already had 3 revisions of the City till date. One can expect a new updated Honda City in 2008. In short they have always tried to be ahead of the game by their timely revisions. Not to forget the value of a Honda Badge in terms of fit, finish and quality

[indian21r]

Reliability was something that Honda has become renowed for in India.

[JUELZ 41]

its time for toyota to bring in the vios. thats the only product that can stop the citys success. toyota can hit back on honda with this product just the way honda did with the civic on the corolla. the baleno will have to be carefully priced and skoda needs to bring in the sedan version of the new gen fabia as the hatch will not sell in big numbers b/c of its high price.

[askicode]

I think the Skoda should get the Fabia hatch price rite. One of the reasons compelling me to make that statement is the very fact that they are getting in a 3 cylinder engine and not a 4 cylinder which would be quite fuel efficient and should cost less.

At the end of it a hatch segment in India has always been a numbers game. Of course dont include the BMW mini in this category.

How else would you explain Hyundai revamping its Getz to Getz Prima bcos of fall in sales. Some of the figures I read on a website were

Source: Hyundai Motor to come out with all-new Getz

Monthly sales of Getz are believed to have fallen to just a few hundred units from over 1,000 units a month while the Swift sells between 4,000-5,000 units every month

Hence I seriously feel Skoda or for that matter any other player such as Honda, Nissan, Toyota would try to get the prize right when it comes to the B+ segment

[shuvc]

Autocar India April issue.

The NHC has sold 2100 odd numbers in February.
The Fiesta (petrol + diesel) has sold in excess of 3000 !!!

Ford is winning this battle. IMO, this indicates that a lot of NHC buyers chose it just for fuel efficiency and not so much for the image and reliability. Now that they have a diesel option at a similar price with not so-bad-image and not so-bad-reliability, the balance has shifted.
Things might get worse for the NHC if and when Aveo Diesel is launched.

Wonder how Honda will counter this. Time to go the diesel or hybrid way ? Strangely they advertise the Civic more than the City. The Civic is anyway outselling the Corolla comfortably.

Mods, maybe the thread should be renamed. The NHC is no more the segment leader (considering both diesel and petrol).

[typeOnegative]

Originally Posted by shuvc

Ford is winning this battle. IMO, this indicates that a lot of NHC buyers chose it just for fuel efficiency and not so much for the image and reliability. Now that they have a diesel option at a similar price with not so-bad-image and not so-bad-reliability, the balance has shifted.
Things might get worse for the NHC if and when Aveo Diesel is launched.
Mods, maybe the thread should be renamed. The NHC is no more the segment leader (considering both diesel and petrol).

Quite agree with your analysis. However I want to raise a few points:

1. Has Honda lost sales on the NHC i.e. have the numbers dipped? If not then it is status quo still, imho - as the market segmentation you have arrived at (and which I agree with) will fall flat on its face.
2. People can shift goal-posts (especially the rabidly pro-Honda guys ) by saying you should consider only the Petrol C+ segment for judging Honda on the NHC performance (sales and otherwise).
3. Where does the Verna fit in? I know this may be off topic, but I was expecting the Verna especially in its CRDI trim to hit the NHC pretty bad.

[shuvc]

Originally Posted by typeOnegative

1. Has Honda lost sales on the NHC?

I read it this way.
Prior to the Fiesta , the City used to sell 3 - 3.5 K cars a month. Now the overall segment has obviously been growing since Fiesta petrols, Aveo's and Verna petrols do sell some numbers.
Inspite of the overall segment growth, the NHC numbers remained constant for a while and have then dipped. If the segment grows and you don't grow, then you've obviously lost market share.

[supremeBaleno]

Originally Posted by shuvc

The NHC has sold 2100 odd numbers in February. The Fiesta (petrol + diesel) has sold in excess of 3000 !!!

Hmmm. So finally Honda is facing the heat. Hmmm I can't wait for the NMB to enter the scene for some added excitement. And while they are at it, with a diesel and some petrol options at a competitive price too.

Is there any way to know the individual figures for Fiesta (1.4P, 1.6P and diesel) ? I would assume the numbers are like diesel > 1.4P > 1.6P

Originally Posted by shuvc

IMO, this indicates that a lot of NHC buyers chose it just for fuel efficiency and not so much for the image and reliability.

Couldn't agree more - I was also contemplating the NHC (only for the so-called high FE) inspite of hating the looks, but finally decided the extra 1.5lakhs was not worth the 1-2 kmpl max extra that I would get. Image depends from person to person, but reliability-wise, Suzuki is up there with Honda anyway.