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Old 15th May 2007, 21:11   #61
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Logan is known as a reliable no problem car in foriegn markets. But there they are dead cheap. But here i think they have gone for more quality components to ensure that no petty issues sprungs up easily. This will be carried out initially to make a good impression, and later may turn to low cost methods to cut price.

The biggest reason for this setback is the speculation of its low price by the press. People were expecting a diesel sedan for 5 lakhs and got it for 7 lakhs. If it was speculated to be priced over 7 lakhs, it could have done better.
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Old 15th May 2007, 21:14   #62
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Originally Posted by anandpadhye View Post
I agree.
Mahindra sucks...and so do their dealers.
One of my friends bought a scorpio from "Silver Jubilee" (Mahindra dealer in Pune) some time back and soon started looking older by 25 years (Silver Jubilee!!!)...
That was a brilliant one!!!
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Old 15th May 2007, 21:19   #63
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Can anybody say a logan(1.6) is better than fiat petra. fiat petra was sold for as low as rs 5.1 lakhs. And the logan is sold for a whopping 5.9 lakhs for its petrol 1.6 version. So to sell it a price cut is inevitable.
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Old 15th May 2007, 21:22   #64
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Originally Posted by typeOnegative View Post
As if the Mahindra in 'Mahindra Renault' would let them cash in on the 'riches'. Dream on ... Of course when it comes to passing the buck blame the outsider. Sweet.
What do you mean 'let'? Is Renault run by a bunch of ninnys, who bow down to Anand's every whim? Can't they stand up for themselves and chalk out a fair deal? If they can, then they wouldn't have let the Logan be in the soup it is now. And if they can't, they shouldn't be doing business at all, and deserve whatever brickbats come their way.
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Old 15th May 2007, 21:30   #65
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Originally Posted by v1p3r View Post
What do you mean 'let'? Is Renault run by a bunch of ninnys, who bow down to Anand's every whim? Can't they stand up for themselves and chalk out a fair deal? If they can, then they wouldn't have let the Logan be in the soup it is now. And if they can't, they shouldn't be doing business at all, and deserve whatever brickbats come their way.
Fair enough. But dude if they have to get into India, they will go by whatever the Indian partner says. They don't know the market. My guess is that they would have bowed down to all suggestions made by the M&M honchos.

My question still is why is no one questioning M&M's role?
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Old 15th May 2007, 21:33   #66
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Originally Posted by typeOnegative View Post
Fair enough. But dude if they have to get into India, they will go by whatever the Indian partner says. They don't know the market. My guess is that they would have bowed down to all suggestions made by the M&M honchos.

My question still is why is no one questioning M&M's role?
I would assume Renault, given its glorious history as a carmaker, is aware of market surveys, consultants of various sorts, and their ilk. I see no reason why they could not engage the services of the aforementioned to chalk out an India strategy that did not involve bowing down to anyone, more so if their partners didn't know to sell cars.

Because we didn't expect much better from Mahindra. For crying out loud, they make tractors. Their flagship 'car' is way overpriced compared to its competition, and doesn't deliver as much either.
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Old 15th May 2007, 21:47   #67
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I would .... much either.
I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I look at the Logan as primarily an M&M offering. Not one from Renault. And I don't think M&M is a glorified tractor maker. The Scorpio etc. are good vehicles in their own right.
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Old 15th May 2007, 22:54   #68
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Originally Posted by typeonegative
Fair enough. But dude if they have to get into India, they will go by whatever the Indian partner says. They don't know the market. My guess is that they would have bowed down to all suggestions made by the M&M honchos.
Do u work for renault or Mahindra?
IMO,both are to be blamed equally.
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Old 15th May 2007, 23:00   #69
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Reno's were never good, it was only Alonso
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Old 15th May 2007, 23:23   #70
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Originally Posted by v1p3r View Post
I would assume Renault, given its glorious history as a carmaker, is aware of market surveys, consultants of various sorts, and their ilk. I see no reason why they could not engage the services of the aforementioned to chalk out an India strategy that did not involve bowing down to anyone, more so if their partners didn't know to sell cars.

Because we didn't expect much better from Mahindra. For crying out loud, they make tractors. Their flagship 'car' is way overpriced compared to its competition, and doesn't deliver as much either.
Are you some kind of a Mahindra hater ? M&M does make tractors agreed, but they also have been making some other vehicles like the Jeeps, Bolero and Scorpio (I drive one) that rule the roost in their particular segments. You seem to be crying out loud about 'Farm equipment, tractor makers' etc...they definitely dont look nor drive like tractors ! I for one am a die hard jeep fan and am still to get my hands on a CJ classic !! Hell, I aint seen a Mahindra tractor in over a decade ! So if you do not like a particular manufacturer, you dont need to be so derogatory about them. Why all the frustration and hate bruh !?!

Back to Logan - I was one of the first few to drive the Logan at the new Sireesh showroom in Hebbal and I was ok with the vehicle, until I got the price sheet in my hands. That was when I really started looking at the car thru a microscope...and decided it wasn't worth the money ! yea if it was 6 lakhs on road for the top end diesel, I would have probably considered it, as I do a lot of miles on the highway. I'm not a big fan of the indica/indigo too, but VFM is why it sells, period. The Logan's ok, but the pricing/positioning is all wrong !!
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Old 16th May 2007, 03:49   #71
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Originally Posted by NIP View Post
Are you some kind of a Mahindra hater ? M&M does make tractors agreed, but they also have been making some other vehicles like the Jeeps, Bolero and Scorpio (I drive one) that rule the roost in their particular segments. You seem to be crying out loud about 'Farm equipment, tractor makers' etc...they definitely dont look nor drive like tractors ! I for one am a die hard jeep fan and am still to get my hands on a CJ classic !! Hell, I aint seen a Mahindra tractor in over a decade ! So if you do not like a particular manufacturer, you dont need to be so derogatory about them. Why all the frustration and hate bruh !?!
Ok, at the risk of going OT, anyway I haven't had a post deleted in 24 hours , so here goes:
Well, I'm no Mahindra fan. The Scorpio has a nice engine, but that's about it. Handles worse than many of their tractors, and interior space packaging is horrible. And yes, I've driven Mahindra tractors too, before you ask. The Bolero was another disaster on the inside, and I've driven Mahindra Classics and CJs too, all owned by my family. They aren't even Mahindra designs, ok? That's like saying Tata makes world-class cars because they assembled a few Mercs here and there.

When you begin to compare any Mahindra vehicle (note, they're not cars) to their competition, it becomes painfully obvious that they fall short either on finish, VFM, handling, or some such criterion. I appreciate that you own and love Mahindras. I own and love Suzukis and Hondas, but that does not prevent me from acknowledging Suzies are built to a price, and Indian Hondas are overpriced. And my current favourite SUV, the Tata Safari Dicor, is also built by a truck maker that is only now beginning to grasp some nuances of the levels of fit and finish that the passenger car industry requires.

Back to the topic, yes, typeo, I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I blame Renault more than Mahindra, but that's not to say I think M&M is lily-white.
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Old 16th May 2007, 06:42   #72
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NIP, while on that part abt M&M, you would know that the engine [except the Scorp's] they use is pretty much the same as what did duty in harvesters since a few decades now. The game is not just about stretching the chassis, adding a couple of more exit/entry points - and Voila, you have a new vehicle !!
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Old 16th May 2007, 08:40   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nitrous View Post
Do u work for renault or Mahindra?
IMO,both are to be blamed equally.
I think who I work for is my business. You can have your views, I can have mine. It is a pity you never pointed out this to the others who are being pretty one sided in apportioning blame.

Yes, I feel both are to blame. But Mahindra more so, because they would have a better handle on what works for the Indian customer. Thanks.
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Old 16th May 2007, 09:15   #74
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I think we can conclude the discussion by saying that the Logan is not a bad car but it has not been priced right.
The buying power of Indians has increased tremendously (courtesy banks :-)) . If they are spending +6 lac then they would definitely buy cars like Aveo, Fiesta etc which look much more classy than the bland Logan.
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Old 16th May 2007, 09:27   #75
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I think .... the bland Logan.
Very well and succinctly put. But the Logan is not just bland looking, but also the fittings may need a serious overhaul.
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