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View Poll Results: NHC with ABS/Airbags are similar prices which would you choose
SX4 146 49.66%
NHC 148 50.34%
Voters: 294. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 23rd May 2007, 08:21   #46
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This thread is completely out of hand and turning meaningless with all the fuss. Ritesh, there is no such thing as "my foundness for maruti". Infact, sumits next car was a Dicor, akshay's family is also interested in buying the Dicor 2.2L, my next car for the family is a Elantra Crdi. So, seeing that you are on the lookout for a NHC should I say you are biased towards honda? While you are at it pointing fingers.

Navdeep, yes I am in a jovial mood. I request you to stop being sarcastic. Lets get back to NNHC now. We do have talents to go way OT.
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Old 23rd May 2007, 08:27   #47
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Why should we put down the SX4 or the NHC. both are good cars. Why can't both of them coexist in the same market. Why should one car fail for the other to succeed?

The indian market is big enough to cater to both these cars which are for different types of people. I dont see why the SX4 and the NHC can both sell good numbers without being affected too much.
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Old 23rd May 2007, 09:35   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Wolf View Post
Someone who has the $ to buy a NHC in my opinion will never buy the sx4 for whatever it is unless he has some unsaid affinity towrds maruti.
I beg to differ wolf. i had the money for a honda city, but its outright useless to buy a car 1.5 lacs more for lets say engine quality? maybe by booking sx4, i might be getting goodies, but i get so much of safety which surpasses all else today. if honda had so much affinity towards their customers then as i ve been asking time and again, why the heck did they not introduce safety measures earlier on? so also toyota? are they not all making a fast buck? in my opinion truly so. and by buying an sx4, maybe my trim levels arent honda-ish, but my engine is still powerful, my wheels are bigger and safer, abs and airbags give me peace of mind and best of all - going by what you say if maruti cars do stall here and there and give problems, i have maruti to come and attend to my beck and call! can i find a honda half way between bangalore and mysore if ever i need them? think again.

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I have heard reports like bad build quality to bad rear seating to swift like interiors to bad mileage to non appealing external looks etc etc ...now, though this car can be a great alternative to NHC, considering the flip side I doubt if it can genuinely offer what the NHC is offering to consumers today for the extra bucks they have coughed out.

MUL knows that it doesnt matter how many drawbacks the car has, as long as its economical to maintain, Indians will buy and will buy in tons. So, IF by chance the FE is really under 10kmph its in real dangerzone or all else it is safe.
yes maybe its more economical to maintain and has drawbacks, so what? even human beings have drawbacks, i mean who doesnt have drawbacks!? fyi, my maruti 800 after 17000 kilometers still runs like its out of the showroom today. accept honda might run for 3 lac kms without problems, but just think about if something happened with chassis or lets say some fuel supply went kaput or something in the middle of the highway, then will honda turn up in atleast 3 hours? i doubt so!!

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People with money and eye for that soulfull Honda touch will go for NHC while all the others will settle to SX4. MUL has entered this segment for the first time hence even if they sell very few cars they are more or less eating into other cars in this segment... guys like Ford, hyundai and Chevy will get most affected while honda might lose a few in their low prospective buyer band if it would at all...
who didnt eat whom? everyone tried it, verna is there, fiesta is there, so why single out sx4. you mean to say no one should challenge honda? i beg to differ. VFM is important in india. in which quality only forms one part. Fe maybe there in that too. and we know sx4 gives atleast 12 with ac. so whats the big furore about.

now coming to affinity, while i am tending to appreicate honda and sx4, am i seeing your affinity towards honda here?
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Old 23rd May 2007, 09:51   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vid6639 View Post
Why should we put down the SX4 or the NHC. both are good cars. Why can't both of them coexist in the same market. Why should one car fail for the other to succeed?

The indian market is big enough to cater to both these cars which are for different types of people. I dont see why the SX4 and the NHC can both sell good numbers without being affected too much.
Exactly. I don't know why any thread even remotely discussing NHC (or NNHC if you will !!) and the SX4 turns into 2 teams shooting off pros and cons. Both are fine cars, to each his own.

Yeah ... this one had a poll and you probably should give rationalization for why you are in either of the two camps ... but let’s keep it at that.

Now, coming back to the topic. Having been a Maruti fan for over the last 6 years, for me, NHC with some more safety features thrown in, it would be quality finish but an indolent/lazy/lethargic engine (GXi) scoring over buttons on the steering wheels, monster wheels but reading lamps falling off when I try to switch 'em on. Even if it means paying 70K extra.

Oh .. and by the way, this is assuming they are keeping the 77 bhp on the GXi. If its the VTEC, no discussions.
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Old 23rd May 2007, 09:56   #50
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42 each - whoa - its a sure neck to neck fight.

Quote:
My pleasure.
read as SX4 and NHC
1. SX4 -- 8.4 odd lacs -- NHC -- around the same price
2. 1.6 Twincam -- 1.5 vtec
3. 102 bhp -- 90 Bhp
4. climate control -- N/A
5. 16" Enkei wheels -- N/A
6. controls on steering --N/A
7. Airbags -- N/A
8. Max ground clearence -- Touches every other road bump
9. ABS with EBD -- New variant may have it
10. iCATS protection -- N/A(or maybe free central lock)
Lets not get overwhelmed by mere facts on paper and goodies.

The NHC Vtec beats the SX4 hands down in performance. And let me tell you, its much more fun to redline the Vtec than the SX4 or the baleno. At least you dont get all that whining and vibrations from the engine.

Try out the rear seats or even the front seats of the NHC, and see how comfortable they are. Check out the rear comfort. Check out the fit and finish of the interiors.

Where does SX4 beat the Vtec -
Performance - heck no.
Interiors/space/comfort/luxury - heck no.
Safety - Yes, for the time-being till the NHC get its own stuff
FE - not a chance.
VFM - Yes, thats about the only advantage that SX4 has and might have for quite some time. Note that the current prices are only introductory offers, and there will be a 20-30k increase for sure in another couple of months.

PS - the Vtec is 100 BHP.

Quote:
Someone who has the $ to buy a NHC in my opinion will never buy the sx4 for whatever it is unless he has some unsaid affinity towrds maruti.
Or perhaps he appreciates VFM/goodies over Best-in-Class.

PPS - I went with my cousins for a TD of the SX4, and I kept on cribbing about a few things like interiors, NVH, performance etc. My cousin disagreed, so I simply handed over the keys to my Vtec. After half an hour on deserted Delhi roads, he agreed that the Vtec is definitely a level above the SX4, but maybe 8.5L is a big price to pay for it.

PPPS - he has booked the SX4.

Last edited by goldie_malhotra : 23rd May 2007 at 09:59.
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Old 23rd May 2007, 10:50   #51
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When market gets more competitive, manufacturers come up with newer models. We are free to buy anything to our taste and affordability. Of course manufacturers cannot satisfy everyone’s taste. So they make products targeting different group of people. While NHC may be appealing for some people the SX4 maybe for some others. But why should we fight like movie star fans about that?
While OHC had boring interiors and hot engine, NHC is the other way round. But then for OHC owners who want to upgrade has CIVIC as a choice (if they want something from Honda).

One thing I liked with Honda (India), is their marketing. I haven’t seen any TV ad campaigns of Honda like MUL and the rest is doing which finds more ad space than chocolates or biscuits or detergents. OHC when launched had ad in selected dailies and magazines with a caption "Gem of an Engine Jewel of a car". Apart from that the ads where restricted to local dailies by dealers announcing interest rates etc.

Note from the Support Staff: Please avoid using text format tags. They are not supported.

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Old 23rd May 2007, 11:58   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldie_malhotra View Post
4
The NHC Vtec beats the SX4 hands down in performance. And let me tell you, its much more fun to redline the Vtec than the SX4 or the baleno. At least you dont get all that whining and vibrations from the engine.
It's not always about performance. How many Indian buyers do care about the performance rather that VFM. Just 5 - 10 % I suppose.

If performance was the factor then we wont see any INDIGO's around.

Interiors/space/comfort/luxury - Well interiors is personal choice i kinda don't like beige. Space SX4 has the best legroom and boot in it's class. Comfort and luxury will be same or i should say SX4 wins coz of steering controls / climatic control and stuff.

P.S. I don't own any of the cars mentioned here and neither have any plan to buy SX4 or NHC for coming 1 year.
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Old 23rd May 2007, 12:02   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldie_malhotra View Post
Lets not get overwhelmed by mere facts on paper and goodies.
Which is what most people here seem to be doing.

Quote:
The NHC Vtec beats the SX4 hands down in performance. And let me tell you, its much more fun to redline the Vtec than the SX4 or the baleno. At least you dont get all that whining and vibrations from the engine.
Certainly not in city, SX4 feels more torquer at low revvs. And I dont think anyone is qualified yet to comment on Highway driving yet but for 3 people I know. So I would wait for that. Really ? Well it didn't seem so to psycho, v1p3r, godfather, memo45, mag and myself (wrt to the part in bold). Though it does miss the VVT unlike the prestigious Vtec the NHC's have. Can you imagine what the VVT can do then?

Goldie, the SX4 with 205 tyres, 1200kgs wheelspins when you powershift into 2nd for quite sometime. It does from 2nd to 3rd too. I am sure the Vtec can't do that. I have tried. Maybe you need to give it another go.

Quote:
Try out the rear seats or even the front seats of the NHC, and see how comfortable they are. Check out the rear comfort. Check out the fit and finish of the interiors.
Yes, agreed its more a 4 seater than a 5 seater. Also I did drive a fellow bhpian's Vtec from bangalore to Ooty through the Masingudi ghats. The car refused to climb the ghat section, and almost everyone are pretty much aware of this at the meet (infact i refused to drive the car back to bangalore and jay took the honours along with a few abuses directed towards me ). Infact, I did complain about the not so comfortable seats of the Vtec owing to which I had sever back problems throughout the trip. Yes, I am just 22. And I have a totally screwed up back which is very sensitive to seating. Though I did find the seating in the SX4 much better. I would prefer having the baleno seats or a set of recaro's fitted even while i sit in front of my monitor. Fit and finish of the interiors is something that the NHC wins hands down. And also those cubby holes. And I am saying this after having sat in both the cars for extended period of time (say 7hrs+) unlike the 15mins TD most of them here are quoting.

Quote:
Where does SX4 beat the Vtec
Everywhere except the interior quality and the ability to seat 5 IMO. Another thing it cant beat is the hype around honda cars. Or the lacklustre of the M&S department at honda who think they can take us for a ride.

Quote:
After half an hour on deserted Delhi roads, he agreed that the Vtec is definitely a level above the SX4, but maybe 8.5L is a big price to pay for it.
Maybe he was being a gentleman and did not want to hurt your sentiments. just kidding.

Quote:
PPPS - he has booked the SX4.
Another one bites the dust.

Look no one is trying to put the NHC down here. You should be glad that Honda are being pushed into making these changes with the launch of the SX4. However I dont see too many logical comments backing up the bashing of the SX4. Sigh.

Last edited by mclaren1885 : 23rd May 2007 at 12:05.
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Old 23rd May 2007, 12:04   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldie_malhotra View Post
VFM - Yes, thats about the only advantage that SX4 has and might have for quite some time. Note that the current prices are only introductory offers, and there will be a 20-30k increase for sure in another couple of months.
Well, lets see if Honda can do something that will make it impossible for maruti to raise prices...a win-win situation for customers...
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Old 23rd May 2007, 12:20   #55
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VFM - Yes, thats about the only advantage that SX4 has and might have for quite some time. Note that the current prices are only introductory offers, and there will be a 20-30k increase for sure in another couple of months.
I think, considering the engine being imported right now, car costs more which in my opinion may come down once engine will be made locally.
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Old 23rd May 2007, 12:20   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mclaren1885 View Post
Goldie, the SX4 with 205 tyres, 1200kgs wheelspins when you powershift into 2nd for quite sometime. It does from 2nd to 3rd too. I am sure the Vtec can't do that. I have tried. Maybe you need to give it another go.
Maybe I do - my cousin's going to have to replace his tyres verrry soon

PS - Vtec/VVTs arent designed for mind-blowing low-end torque - am sure you can understand that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mclaren1885 View Post
Look no one is trying to put the NHC down here. You should be glad that Honda are being pushed into making these changes with the launch of the SX4. However I dont see too many logical comments backing up the bashing of the SX4. Sigh.
I for one am very very glad they are finally pushed down into getting the ABS and airbags.
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Old 23rd May 2007, 12:23   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldie_malhotra View Post
PS - Vtec/VVTs arent designed for mind-blowing low-end torque - am sure you can understand that.
Yes I am aware of that. However I was pointing out the fact what VVT could do the the engines performance capabilities. The quicker revvs, not the torque. Sorry if I wasn't clear enough. I was talking wrt performance.
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Old 23rd May 2007, 12:29   #58
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Does nobody see the irony that MUL which for years sold us old, outdated cars with NO safety equipment & with a reluctance to embrace new technology (Remember the hue & cry they raised when FI was made mandatory for all Petrol cars) is now offering a car with the most equipment since it can't break into that segment anyway else?

Remember the days when a change of lights & bumpers made a new car? And you had the thinnest possible tyres on the cars as OE so that the FE remained paramount, to hell with the other consequences. These things still exist within the MUL stable but the SX4 seems to be news that maybe they have learned a lesson and are moving to a better strategy for our market rather than being just cheap & having good FE.

A sign of the times I say when even the biggest car maker has to bend over backwards to sell cars to consumers.
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Old 23rd May 2007, 12:30   #59
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Originally Posted by mclaren1885 View Post
Yes I am aware of that. However I was pointing out the fact what VVT could do the the engines performance capabilities. The quicker revvs, not the torque. Sorry if I wasn't clear enough. I was talking wrt performance.
Am sure the VVT might bring equal the performance stakes.
Though I am more interested in plonking it on the Swift sport first
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Old 23rd May 2007, 12:40   #60
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Yes, ishaan you are right. Why would they want to when they were selling like hotcakes. Look at the 800, esteem, zen, baleno, alto. But somehow the perspective seems to have changed since the inception of the swift. Maybe suzuki might have a bigger role in this. The change is however beautiful and welcome.


Though honda being trendsetters and technological savvy folks(Vtec, paddle shifts) they are couldn't come up with such an initiative. Maybe thats what is disturbing.
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