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Old 25th June 2007, 12:12   #46
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[quote=Hellcat;448708]
Guess the reason we don't prefer automatics because of maintenance, performance, resale value, fuel consumption etc.quote]


How is the maintenance higher for Automatics? If it is more expensive to maintain then in which ways over a manual car?
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Old 25th June 2007, 13:10   #47
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Originally Posted by DieselFan View Post
AT cars in indian conditions are indeed less fuel efficient then their MT counterparts. frequent starts and stops, signals, jams, indiciplined traffic are the causes for this lower mileage of AT cars which is about 2-3 KMPL below its ML counterparts.
That would be the stepped AT cars. Read 3 speed, 4 speed, 5 speed AT cars. Has anyone tried the CVT cars? Only Honda City GXi has the CVT version as far as I remember. That is the new gen AT and that should prove just how efficient driving an AT in Indian bumper to bumper traffic is. (BTBT - how is that new acronym. Hyundai VTVT for Indian BTBT )
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Old 25th June 2007, 21:34   #48
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1) what car you have it installed on
--M800

2) what situations (city, highway) you have used it on
--Both city and highway

3) what is your usage pattern (i.e., do you always leave it to the AutoClutch, or do you override it with the normal clutch)
--Always in autoclutch

4) have you ever encountered an emergency situation, and if so, how did the AutoClutch fare? I.e., did you feel it got in the way of safe driving?
-- Yes. Just press the brakes. No need for all the clutch, brake circus.

5) does the clutch engage immediately upon touching the brake? Or does it engage only when it needs to prevent stalling of the vehicle?
-- did you mean disengage? while driving I felt that the clutch disengages after a hard press. disengage doesnt happen jst by pressing the brake lightly.
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Old 25th June 2007, 23:14   #49
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Maintenance could well be cheaper! No clutch to replace. And city driving can be hard on clutches.

Decades ago in my mother country, people used to be very afraid of the cost of replacing that ludicrously complex gearbox ---- I think that's long since out of date now, like being afraid of pressure cookers.
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Old 26th June 2007, 10:29   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
Maintenance could well be cheaper! No clutch to replace. And city driving can be hard on clutches.
Amen to that.

In theory, with a great driver MT would be better and cheaper (initially and for maintenance) than automatic transmission. However, has anyone remembering the Bell curve? 10% of people in whatever field are incompetent, 80% are just OK, and 10% are experts.

So, should cars be designed for the 10% experts or the 90% "normal" people?

Even if you are an expert, you have to figure that at some point your car will be driven by someone who isn't.
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Old 9th July 2007, 20:04   #51
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FYI - I had in the past left an inquiry at the MUL sales line for an Automatic Transmission Swift Zxi. Some one had called me after that apologising that the company made no such model - so that was that.

However last saturday 7th July, I got a call from a lady in MUL cust. service. She advised that I had some time back shown interest in a Swift and that she wanted to know how much would I be willing to pay over and above the Swift Zxi manual for the auto variant - i.e., if such a variant was to be available in the future?

I asked her if such a variant was in the pipeline? she advised that she was not at liberty to disclose. I said that I would be happy paying 50-60k over and above the variant which is pretty standard - but no more.

She advised that she was wanting this feedback only. I recommended her to view our team-bhp.com website and that she would get lot of gainful feedback from other members too.

Guys! Could this be that MUL is suddenly sitting up and taking note of customer demand for an auto variant in the Swift ZXi, and maybe thinking of bringing one out in the near future?? Ah-ha!!
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Old 9th July 2007, 20:32   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vivekiny2k View Post
given the margin of human error, i guess it will be the other way round.

I don't remember many A/Ts with fried clutch plates in their teens.
My worries with A/T:

1. If my battery goes down and I have A/T, I can not push the car and start it.

2. If I am wading through water logged areas, I need to take precaution so that water does not enter my engine (either through air-intake or exhaust...I am not sure if it can enter through exhaust, but guys active on the "Fiesta Trouble" thread think that's possible). Generally, I would have shift down, rev the engine high and control the speed using clutch to ensure engine does not rev down any time till I am out of water.
Can I do this with A/T?
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Old 9th July 2007, 21:09   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sri View Post
Today in the less than 10 lakhs segment i think only Santro and NHC are available.

1. Can the experts add on if more cars are available right now apart from the above?
2. Are there any more auto transmission cars being launched in the next 6 months?

it would be good to see swift,swift-diesel,spark,fusion to be coming out with auto transmission.

Also if there is a review of the above pls post the link.
I made a similiar post some time back.
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...s-horizon.html (New cars on the Horizon?)
But didn't get any responses.
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Old 9th July 2007, 21:27   #54
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I've been driving A/T for about 8 years now and just love it. However, last year I discovered a good reason why A/Ts are a bit problematic to have atleast in Mumbai. How the heck does one drive in a congested water-logged area. Just happened to me one and I'd never thought about it before. As soon as I entered the flooded street (hardly 6 - 8 inches of water), my left leg reached out for the non-existent clutch!! Panic buttons. Discovered that you can't effectively brake and accelerate at the same time; nor can you accelerate as you will hit the car in front. Managed to come out more or less safely but the muffler got flooded and had to removed / cleaned / dried. Since then I'm paranoid about taking my A/T out during the monsoons here. If anyone knows a trick, am eager to learn. Am sure Anand is also eagerly awaiting the same.
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Old 10th July 2007, 00:31   #55
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It is true that you should not push start an automatic. Even towing is problematic, as it must be towed with its driveing wheels off the ground.

Thankfully, flat batteries is something that doesn't happen too often....

As to driving through water... yes, I think the manual has to have the edge here, as one can obviously not slip the clutch on an auto box. Best you can do is lock the car in its lowest gear.
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Old 10th July 2007, 10:41   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
As to driving through water... yes, I think the manual has to have the edge here, as one can obviously not slip the clutch on an auto box. Best you can do is lock the car in its lowest gear.
This might be just where the CVT AT would show its prowess. According to the tech specs, the CVT transmissions has a theoretical 'infinite' number of gears. So what it does it, put the engine at the rev for the highest power generated and keep the engine at that rev while it plays around with the gear ratios to give you the drive and acceleration that you need.

If it really does this, then it could provide sufficient pressure to keep the water from entering the exhaust. Has anyone at all driven a NHC with CVT?
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Old 10th July 2007, 11:58   #57
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Friends, I own a NHC CVT for past 3 years....i've been using Auto tranny vehicles for past 10-15 years or so....herez my experience.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by herculesksp View Post
This might be just where the CVT AT would show its prowess. According to the tech specs, the CVT transmissions has a theoretical 'infinite' number of gears. So what it does it, put the engine at the rev for the highest power generated and keep the engine at that rev while it plays around with the gear ratios to give you the drive and acceleration that you need.

If it really does this, then it could provide sufficient pressure to keep the water from entering the exhaust. Has anyone at all driven a NHC with CVT?
yes very correct...the CVT has infinite gears...in simple terms its a pulley-belt system with extremely advanced technology going into the gearbox mechnism.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rpanicker View Post
I've been driving A/T for about 8 years now and just love it. However, last year I discovered a good reason why A/Ts are a bit problematic to have atleast in Mumbai. How the heck does one drive in a congested water-logged area. Just happened to me one and I'd never thought about it before. As soon as I entered the flooded street (hardly 6 - 8 inches of water), my left leg reached out for the non-existent clutch!! Panic buttons. Discovered that you can't effectively brake and accelerate at the same time; nor can you accelerate as you will hit the car in front. Managed to come out more or less safely but the muffler got flooded and had to removed / cleaned / dried. Since then I'm paranoid about taking my A/T out during the monsoons here. If anyone knows a trick, am eager to learn. Am sure Anand is also eagerly awaiting the same.
rpanicker,

option (1): the most easiest trick is USE of handbrakes...the only problem in this case would be that your brakelamps wont glow and the vehciles following up would 'bang the boot'...

option (2): use of left foot for brake pedal...this you need to practise, however suggested to use only in emergency situations like this as the vechicle speed is too low,

option (3): heel-and-toe driving Heel-and-toe - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
It is true that you should not push start an automatic. Even towing is problematic, as it must be towed with its driveing wheels off the ground.

Thankfully, flat batteries is something that doesn't happen too often....

As to driving through water... yes, I think the manual has to have the edge here, as one can obviously not slip the clutch on an auto box. Best you can do is lock the car in its lowest gear.
yes i agree that push start is probelm in auto, but tell me frankly how often do you push start your car ? moreover, irrespective of manual or auto tranny, new generation fuel injected cars are not meant to be push started. If you have a fuel injected automobile, you must have enough voltage in the battery to run the electronics. Otherwise, you might as well push the car home.

towing is not at all a probelm...put the vehicle in 'N' mode and there is goes..

in NHC CVT, there is a gear release switch...if for some reason if you are unable to release the 'Park' gear, just put the car key in the gear release siwtch and the system releases the gear.


Tip: while wading thro' water (if at all unavoidable) if you are driving an auto tranny vehicle, shift the gear stick into 'S', '1' or '2' modes...these gears rev the engine more that that would happen in 'D' mode...
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Old 10th July 2007, 12:38   #58
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I would anyday prefer to drive around a Manual transmission car in India, for 3 simple reason...
1) Would give me more FE. FE is important to me
2) Would Fetch me better Re-Salve value if i plan to dispose it
3) Would give me more fun to rev my car hard, Spin the wheels with the release of the clutch....in short the fun factor :-)
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Old 10th July 2007, 14:02   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rpanicker View Post
As soon as I entered the flooded street (hardly 6 - 8 inches of water), my left leg reached out for the non-existent clutch!! Panic buttons. Discovered that you can't effectively brake and accelerate at the same time; nor can you accelerate as you will hit the car in front. Managed to come out more or less safely but the muffler got flooded and had to removed / cleaned / dried.
I am not very technical, but wouldn't any positive pressure be enough to keep the water out? And with the Automatic in "Drive" & the Brakes
pressed, the engine would still be running, right? And that should provide
positive pressure to keep the water out.

Have driven an automatic for many many years abroad, but never on
badly waterlogged roads, so I haven't actually experienced this.
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Old 10th July 2007, 14:34   #60
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I have a Zen AT(quite old), it has depreciated quite a lot because of apparent lack of value of AT vehicles. I think its quite useful inside the city. for those who're worried about mileage, they might want to try fitting LPG/CNG onto their cars, it more than compensates for AT.

Needless to say, it is a pleasure to drive inside the city. In Bangalore, we regularly have corridors of bumper-to-bumper traffic, and during such phases, I really felt the value of AT.

I've driven my car out of city quite a lot and even there I was able to get enough zip out of my car. Initially I had the same problem of not getting enough power to overtake(mentioned before in the thread), but very soon, I got adjusted to changing gears by depressing the accelerator differently. I could now overtake w/o problems.

I've not had a battery breakdown and I've not had to plough through muddy waters, so I cannot comment on that.

The only problem I see is with resale value. Even maintenance is not as much as its made out to be. The other problem is that unlike MTs, if you take your feet out, the car moves and has resulted in a few panic situations.

But overall as a person who's used it for 6 years, if I had the option of buying a good CVT for my primarily city usage; I'd go for it anyday.

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