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Old 2nd July 2007, 15:36   #1
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Post indian cars v/s international scene

hi im dxb roller, a new member to team-bhp, i joined because even though i stay in Dubai i travel to dehli quite frequently and am quite impressed with the car scene heating up there. even though i am a new member i have been monitoring the site closely for a very long period and i have seen many posts speaking of how the number of hot imports has realy increased and the Indian car scene is doing realy well i completely agree with it but i have also read various statements recommending that it is one of the best car scenes, even though it has realy progressed, i have stayed in dubai and have traveled around half the globe and can definatley say this statement is not yet true.

first lets take the example of dubai probably not even 1/4 the size of bombay yet with a ravishing car scene, i agree that when importing cars into dubai there is no tax but i will even mention later even with a 100% how it cant compare i would like to at this point of time remind the reader i am not insulting the car scene india if you may but merely comparing it but in doing so not insulting it. eg. In bombay people get down to counting sl's however in a plcae like dubai forget weekend s on weekdays probably every 3rd or 4th cars is an sl or above or a car with an equivelent price tag another example would be range rovers, i have conformed this, that the mumber of range rovers in dubai is more then the accords it is practicly the most common car, every second car is probably a range and i am not exaggerating.

you may now argue im taking dubai exclusively and comparing it to India therefore i put in the following statement even in countries like thailand, Mexico etc. which can beconsidered developing countires the number of cats such as the one mentioned above may not be the same as places such as dubai but they defiantly don't get down to counting their sl's and hummers and such other cars.

now lets discuss more exclusive cars for example rolls royce, people talk of how there are 4 in pune or 5 in bomaby etc, even though it is an exclusive car in most of the main cities of the world there are never only four or five they easily cross 25-30 minimum and as many of you may already know in a city like dubai which is the third largest importer of rolls royce has more then eighty easlily, even in the case of cars such as ferraris or murcelago's once again it goes way way past the counting point fr example in one night i could easily spot 7 or 8 and the 7 differnt plus some of the earlier ones the next night.

now we come to the 100% tax issie lets presume the same rule apllies to dubai and slash half the no. of cars from each brand it would still exceed immesily and anyone who has been in dubai in forget a posh but a decent locality would agree with me also allot of people in dubai when they but expensive cars end up bidding for no. plates more expensive then the cars, one extreme example would be the person who paid 25 million dhs for the no. 5 but even more though thats an extreme example a gud three digit or even i cool 5 didigt such 12345 or sumdin like 11111 would almost cost a million or can even easlily cross that or maybe even double if the bidding gets heated and all the above dosnt take place amongst locals only but also amongst a lot of rich indians and pakistani nationals. infact from wat ive heard theres one indian not sure if its true so dont wana declare the name bought 3 slr's dont ask why but apparnetly it's parket not at his residence

i would once again like to convey to my fellow bhpians that this thread is not to have an ugly debate with eachother since in not showing the indian car scene down inface i feel its growing at an alarming rate form what i was like before and strongly feel it will one day reach international standards but just feel it has i awhile to go, i would realy appreaciate and constructive cririscisms and opinions.
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Old 2nd July 2007, 18:58   #2
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Werd up dude, welcome aboard.

What you've stated is naturally and undoubtedly true. Several reasons.

Firstly:
Dubai - oil, wealth, easy money, tax free earnings (proportion of tax earned by locals) and no import duties. Division of wealth is certainly not as wide as in India. A small, relatively wealthy nation, el Dubaio. Hence the awesome cars.

Secondly:
Roads. What isn't sand, is surely better than what you get in many places in India, which explains relatively more amazing cars. Hence the awesome cars.

Thirdly:
Fuel. Cheap as chips. What they save on gasoline, they make up with a better car. Hence the awesome cars.

Fourthly:
Imported cars vs. home-grown automobiles. Pretty self-explanatory...hehe. Hence the awesome cars.

My only fear is how long Dubai can sustain itself. It's rather "fabricated", and man-made materials don't last forever. India, though picking up from all it's 'lost' wealth, still doesn't have an incredible car scene, but it is surely developing at a comparitively rapid rate...and that's not always a bad thing for us guys

Last edited by aniguchisan : 2nd July 2007 at 19:02.
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Old 2nd July 2007, 22:54   #3
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hey aniguchisan

realy appreciate ur opininon but if u dont mind me corrcting you your probably half right
first of all the the oil part its a common misconception that dubai contributes to the uae's oil wealth its actualy mainly the capital abu dhabi while dubai contributes a very small proportion

as far as sustainiblily goes for like the past 20 years they have been saying the econonmy is a bubble but so fair noting has happened and if u read the papers often you would relise the growth rate of dubai was one of the top5 in the world second of all their diversifying big time therefore the whole property boom (youve probably heard of the palm, burj dubai, the 75 million dhs appartmensts etc) also they are diversifying into things such as hospitality and aviation fr example theve pumped the highest amount ever into one hospitality project with 200 billion dhs in one hospitality project and there also greaatly strenthing their trading centr image which was its original ticket to glory. theres lots more but dont wana discuss it here

i relise i may have gone off topic but its just to give people a further insight inot dubai before its cars in the next few posts il put up a few pics

cheers
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Old 2nd July 2007, 23:21   #4
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(thats the special ac version)



(kahn edition)



(gallardo hamman edition)



the clk gtr only 25 were made

these are just some pics i had time to upload if u wana see some more go to

exoticspotter.com or go to youtube and type dubai cars
will upload more and better ones letter (the best for the end keep u guyz starving ;-) )
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Old 4th July 2007, 21:54   #5
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before i upload my new set of pictures i would like to request everyone from outside india to also post pics, after all its not the dubai scene but the international scene and then only can we do a proper analysis
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Old 5th July 2007, 01:09   #6
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Cool

awesome cars there roller... sexy pics. but whats the point ur tryin to make?? I quite din't catch the point in this thread execpt for the sexy pics
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Old 5th July 2007, 03:44   #7
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Who is comparing Indian Car scene with international one i don't think any one ,but if you found out please treat it as a incorrect statement

As far as i understand international car scene means the cars you see internationally and expect them to come in you country or may be just enjoy seeing them ,but not to show what others are doing , and compare your Indian cars picture by picture to that country

The point made here is that Indian car scene is coming up like from a Maruti 800 some of us have reached to corolla and civics and skodas
But no one is saying that we re so hot as a car scene that we beat California as suggested by your posts

We have huge taxes , import duty is illegally expensive infrastructure is lacking people have just started to make a decent internationally acceptable income ( though definitely on the lower side ) and you re comparing Dubai car scene to india

We definitely are not California Dubai or Monaco ,but we have for surely improved a lot and we are not as dumb as people think us to be when i went for a job interview Hr girl in Vancouver asked me do u people Travel on horses and elephants in India and later i found out that she was driving That same lancer i was about to replace in India ,

And also in these so called American Cities i have seen people and not one but thousands driving old cars as good as scrap some even 15 -20 years old what would you call them

Last edited by rubin2006 : 5th July 2007 at 03:47.
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Old 5th July 2007, 06:27   #8
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Hi dxb roller, welcome to the forum.

I think right now its unfair to compare the Indian scene vs the international scene. Indian economic boom started only about 15 years ago. There are not enough people who would blow money on cars, which for a majority of Indians is still a luxury item. And as for the existing rich Indians, a lot of people are self made millionaires. Look at Narayanamoorthy or Azim Premji. I read that Mr Premji drives just a corolla(now this was a few years ago, not sure now). And guess what, he owns one of the largest IT companies in Asia, if not the world Wipro, and was the world's third richest man for a while. The same can be said about other rich people. The money here is hard earned and people have spent all their lives making it, they are not going to blow it on Ferraris or Lambos, which btw would have a tough time negotiating our roads as somebody had mentioned before.

On the other hand look at Dubai. Sure right now they are expanding into different areas, but what exactly fueled this boom in the first place? No prizes for guessing this, its oil. So they got the money for free without breaking a sweat. God's gift basically. What would have happened if there was NO oil in Dubai and people over there had to start from scratch as well? You think they would have blown their money on CLK gtrs and zondas and what not? Basically they have pretty much got the money for free. Now nothing wrong in that. Heck if I hit a lottery and made millions I wouldn't mind having veyrons and paganis in my garage. But otoh if I worked my @$$ off for 8 hrs a day then I would buy a car which I could afford, probably a simple one like a Maruti. See the difference between the two places?

Ofcourse this could change in the future, as more people with their dad's and self earned money might buy flashy cars.

PS: I think this thread should be in some other subforum as this one is for imports etc.
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Old 5th July 2007, 21:14   #9
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well i reckon the most major deterant factor why the indian car scene does not compare to the international car scene is because of import duty taxes.
looking at the way our economy is booming we are producing more millionaire's than ever before most of whom car comfortably afford atleast a top end 7 series.Roads,traffic etc are all supplementary factors.
How globalisation in '91 bought most multinational giants running to India,abolishment of import duty would definitely bring more Ferrari's,lambo's and porches zooming in our neighborhood!
but hey we are getting there,slowly and steadily,patience.
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Old 5th July 2007, 21:38   #10
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Hi!! buddy!! In DXB, how much does a liter of mineral water cost? compare this with the cost of fuel there. I believe that one liter of fuel (the normal measure in dxb is Gallons) is less than 90% of cost of one liter of mineral water. Now, come to India. One liter of fuel is 4 times the cost of mineral water. Now, consider an arbitrary quantity of an arbitrary commodity. Just for example, let us take again, 10,000 liters of Mineral water. Compare the absolute currency required in DXB with the currency required in India to pay for that. Just compare the number of days you will work in dxb to make that money, and think of the number of years you have to slog to make the amount required the commodity in India in INR. Add to this huge difference, the fact that in India, to spend Rs. 100, you need to make Rs. 125 because 25% goes either to the tax man or your tax advisor. The situation is simply incomparable.
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Old 5th July 2007, 22:50   #11
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Once the oil runs out, with it will the cars. Why do you think tourism is being promoted so extensively? Why the sudden rise in property-development. The locals are realising that they need to be self-sustainable in the upcoming decades, or they may lose their Rangies
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Old 5th July 2007, 23:43   #12
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Cars in Dubai are supposed to be way cheaper than whats available here right..

Lets say The most common family cars like the Accord and the Camry cost a hell lot here, but there it should be less than half the price.
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Old 6th July 2007, 09:37   #13
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compare apples with apples.Oranges with oranges.
Compare Dubai with Monaco/LA .Not with Pune/Delhi.You are right,No Oil in Dubai,Not much anyway to call it an industry.And that is the problem,No manufacturing,No agriculture,Not much natural resources.It is still a bubble.But it is commendable the way they made it grow even without any of the points mentioned above.

And does Phantom cost 3.6 crore in Dubai?.I think its less than that.If India didnt have any import restrictions,we wouldnt be that bad with exotics when compared to dubai.I am sure an M5 in India is expensive than in Dubai and look at the number in India.

Where is steeroid?.He knows the price comparison better than anyone.

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Old 7th July 2007, 00:23   #14
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im sorry i havent been able to answer your questions for so long was out of town i am still a little busy and will try to answer as much as i can

first regarding the fuel part i would like a you to read the first post of mine in which it clearly mentions how the fuel is releted to abu dhabi and when the seven emirates were joined they didnt just start sharing there resources with eachother most and when i say msot i mean MOST of the fuel belongs to abu dhabi hope that part is cleared up yes the fuel price is more or less standerdised through the country but the income isnt realy

as far as the improvement part goes in my first post i have spoken of the improvement in india and even projected how it is realy steeping up but all i said was that it has a while to go before it can be compared to the international scene

the other thing is regarding the duty once again i spoke of it in my first post of how even if we presume the 1oo% duty in dubai and slash the exotics by half the exotics would still be uncounable and anyone whos been to dubai would agree(please refer to first post)

and since this forum is not only for dubai cars but international cars i have requested people from other places since i have seen members from places such as london, chicago etc to contribute and im only representing the dubai side

to conclude once again jsut like i mentioned in my first post i am not showing the indian scene down but just doing a comparison to see how far it has reached on its way to have a great car scene and finaly MOST of your questioans answers will be availabe in the my long first post

most importantly i would like to thank everyone for contributing, please feel free to clear any more doubts, regarding the new pics if none is offended with this thread continuing i would be delighted to post more

cheers
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Old 7th July 2007, 04:39   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dxb roller View Post
the other thing is regarding the duty once again i spoke of it in my first post of how even if we presume the 1oo% duty in dubai and slash the exotics by half the exotics would still be uncounable and anyone whos been to dubai would agree(please refer to first post)
Ok, that is really bad math. You dont slash the number of cars by half to make up for the 100% import duty. If you can sell 10 units at a price tag of 1 crore, it doesnt mean you can sell only 20 units at 50 lakhs. No sire, at 50 lakhs, you can sell may be 50 units because the number of people in that income bracket are much more than people in higher income bracket.
An easy example is the sales of B segment cars. If Swift sells 1000 units a month at 5 Lakhs, it can sell 10,000 units a month at 2.5 lakhs.e

Second, when you compare two cities be it cars or consumer goods, you have to take into consideration the per-capita, infrastructure, taxes and many other things. IIRC Dubais per-capita is over $15,000 where as Indian per-capita is $700. If you only consider Mumbai or Delhi, it is still not more than $5000. Obviously dubai is a rich country and couple it with low taxes, it is even more easy to afford cars. Also, they have better infra where they can really drive their cars which is lacking in India.

Third, well, its a question for you. Why are there so many exotics in Dubai when they don't seem to have any solid industrial base?
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