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Old 14th August 2009, 02:22   #1756
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Originally Posted by ImmortalZ View Post
Mileage should stabilize after the first two or so tankfuls to a KMPL or two below what you will eventually get. After that, improvement will be gradual, if any.
So assuming my first tank was a write off - how much improvement can I expect given my driving style condition

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Originally Posted by ImmortalZ View Post
Possible problems include bad wheel bearings which will bring down your FE because of much higher rolling resistance.
I have opted for a CPCOO (Cashless ownership) and therefore, is there is a way to prove to them that wheel bearings have indeed turned bad / old - they will replace it free of cost. The car does feel very smooth to drive so would appreciate if there are symptoms to identify bad wheel bearings.

The dealer is also promising that because of 3 years cashless promise any issue with any part will equal immediate replacement and all I need to pay is for petrol for 3 years - after your post my fear is that if it consistently returns 7-8 kmpl given my driving - I may just want to buy a diesel - pay up heavy one time and then smile at each tank-up.

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Your running seems way too low for a diesel. It'll take years upon years for you to make even on the price differential and that is without taking into account the higher maintenance costs. However, you have a petrol car that has been laying idle for one year. A difficult situation I'm afraid.
What are the other risks for a petrol car laying idle for one year. Are these risks there in a idle diesel car as well? Are there additional problems for diesel?

Also, 800 km * 12 ~ 10,000 km a year which would mean roughly 4 years to recover the differential. However, I believe from my research and what I read on this forum as well that the modern diesel engines (especially optra magnums 2.0 tcdi) does not have a significantly higher maintainance cost over a petrol one. I was also considering that the drive in Diesel may be more enjoyable given its power and it will be safer given dual airbags and ABS.

That said - I will not go off topic which is mileage. Assuming I would retain this 1.6 LT - what is the mileage I can expect for:

1) Short hauls like 4 km run to office (one way) at 3rd or 4th gear at avg speed of 40-60 kmph

2) Weekly visits to Delhi - run of around 80 km (total) at 4th and 5th gear at average speed of 60-70 kmph (though stoppages and idling at redlights)

3) Occasional highway drive on NH8 to Manesar or Jaipur or Udaipur from Delhi (Never driven much on highways but expect it to be a lot smoother)

Lastly
- can someone suggest the realistic mileage figure if I were to trade it for a 2.0 LT Optra Magnum Diesel. Will it be as remarkable as 14-15 kmpl vis-a-vis 7-8 of petrol i.e. almost double which is claimed by many on the forum?

If the gain will be only 2-3 kmpl over petrol - then recovering price difference will take years.



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Originally Posted by ImmortalZ View Post
Long posts equal detailed posts. Don't be sorry.
Appreciate your detailed reply - your answers will help as I need to decide by tomorrow and let the dealer know if I am retaining the Petrol 1.6 LT (sunroof - no ABS) or want the Diesel 2.0 LT (ABS - no sunroof)

Thanks everyone for their help and guidance.
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Old 14th August 2009, 10:27   #1757
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Originally Posted by enigma1982 View Post
I have opted for a CPCOO (Cashless ownership) and therefore, is there is a way to prove to them that wheel bearings have indeed turned bad / old - they will replace it free of cost. The car does feel very smooth to drive so would appreciate if there are symptoms to identify bad wheel bearings.
Bad wheel bearings will make a distinctive humming noise that changes with speed. You can also check by simply rotating the wheels while the car is on a lift. The powered wheels will have some resistance, but they should rotate freely.


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What are the other risks for a petrol car laying idle for one year. Are these risks there in a idle diesel car as well? Are there additional problems for diesel?
The same things apply.

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Originally Posted by enigma1982 View Post
Also, 800 km * 12 ~ 10,000 km a year which would mean roughly 4 years to recover the differential. However, I believe from my research and what I read on this forum as well that the modern diesel engines (especially optra magnums 2.0 tcdi) does not have a significantly higher maintainance cost over a petrol one. I was also considering that the drive in Diesel may be more enjoyable given its power and it will be safer given dual airbags and ABS.
The Magnum Diesel is a fantastic car. The turbo lag makes it slightly painful in city traffic (mainly because it tends to lunge forward as the turbo spools up, catching you off guard), but the engine is a gem. You can expect the same mileage as the Elantra. 15+ on the highways if driven sedately and 10-12 in the city.

Modern diesels are still heavier on your pocket when it comes to regular maintenance than equivalent petrols. They will kill you if something goes wrong cuz CRDI parts are catastrophically expensive. But they are generally reliable and with your zero cost maintenance package, you should be fine.

I can't tell you exact mileage figures that you've asked. You'll have to wait for someone with a 1.6 to speak up. You can find the 2.0TCDI figures all over this forum, do a search. Mind you, a lot of people who have the Magnum or the Elantra have Pete's boxes (or more) and drive like their pants are on fire.
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Old 14th August 2009, 12:31   #1758
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Default Accord,Santro,Gypsy

Hi All

My Honda Accord 2005 2.4 MT Returns 9.5 to 10
Santro AT 2008 12.5 km/ltr and 96 Gypsy 10 to 11 kmpl

Faizal
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Old 17th August 2009, 08:39   #1759
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My Alto LXi has put 2500kms on the ODO.
I use my car only for long drives but this includes the length of Mumbai (south to north).
Overall FE without AC currently stands at: 18kmpl in City, 23kmpl on highway (including ghat sections).
This is very satisfying FE, especially because the cumulative FE is gradually improving with each drive out.
I drive sedately keeping in the 60-80kmph band, at times going upto 100kmph and cursing myself at each such time.
I have instructed my co (wife) to chide me whenever I go beyond 80kmph. I am a largely predictive driver; which means that I slow down (without brakes) before an impending "road cholestrol".
I use my brakes sparingly and prefer to brake with the engine. After applying sun-films I don't really need to put on the AC as my wife has allergy against cooled air.
I thank all those guys on T-BHP for all their opinions on car driving techniques, which have made me a better car driver from a good biker.
Cheers.
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Old 17th August 2009, 11:12   #1760
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Update:

Palio 1.2 Sport

Run: 518 KM
Fuel consumed: 32.8ltr
AC: 70%
Highway/City: 60:40

Average:15.70
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Old 17th August 2009, 11:37   #1761
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Originally Posted by gostel View Post
My Alto LXi has put 2500kms on the ODO.
I use my car only for long drives but this includes the length of Mumbai (south to north).
Overall FE without AC currently stands at: 18kmpl in City, 23kmpl on highway (including ghat sections).
This is very satisfying FE, especially because the cumulative FE is gradually improving with each drive out.
gostel,

That's a great FE you are getting for an Alto that has only 2,500 clicks on the odo. You will see a remarkable improvement in FE once you cross the 7,500 kms mark.

Cheers,
gpa
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Old 17th August 2009, 13:18   #1762
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Originally Posted by valapad View Post
Hi All

My Honda Accord 2005 2.4 MT Returns 9.5 to 10
Santro AT 2008 12.5 km/ltr and 96 Gypsy 10 to 11 kmpl

Faizal
Santro AT 12.5 kpl? wow! That's almost as good as the MT. Guess you drive in total "green" mode

Last edited by rageshgr : 17th August 2009 at 13:20.
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Old 17th August 2009, 13:34   #1763
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Default Bolero SLX - 15/16 kmpl.

After a few full tank-full tank's on my Bolero SLX DI Turbo (2009 June), I've recorded an average fuel consumption of 15-16 kmpl. With the 60 ltr tank, I usually fuel up at 48 ltrs consumed, when the gauge drops into the red zone. My driving style is pretty aggressive, and is always with the A/C turned on, with 50-30-20 ratio of highway-inner city-traffic. I only fuel up to a full tank, in the 6k running I haven't topped up before the red zone ever. This is purely coincidental, and has not been meticulously planned by me!

I should be able to get a bit more with a more conservative driving stlye and less use of the A/C (at night). Please note, that these figures are with a maximum of 2 people in the car at any given time, and little or no load being hauled around. I can't help but imagine how much more a little weight shedding and aerodynamics could affect the fuel consumption.

Overall, using the Bolero to commute is still more expensive than my Bull or the RX, because of the toll, the maintenance and other expenses. But not by much, and definitely worth the cost difference. Am working out a spreadsheet to calculate exactly how cost effective my vehicles are turning out to be. Will share when ready. (HVK's logs and google docs remain my frame of reference, they are truly indepth)

Cheers,
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Old 17th August 2009, 13:49   #1764
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Guys,

Recently on my way back from Mysore, my ANHC for sometime was indicating an average of 23KMPL...and for quite sometime it was showing 22KMPl..A/C was on.
i was travelling between 80 to 100 kmph,,,never overshot 100kmph.

can i really go by this...i could not calculate the average, since i travelled to few other places after getting back home.
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Old 17th August 2009, 14:04   #1765
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Originally Posted by srinivas9446 View Post
Guys,

Recently on my way back from Mysore, my ANHC for sometime was indicating an average of 23KMPL...and for quite sometime it was showing 22KMPl..A/C was on.
i was travelling between 80 to 100 kmph,,,never overshot 100kmph.

can i really go by this...i could not calculate the average, since i travelled to few other places after getting back home.
You should always calculate FE full tank to full tank method and not go by on- board computer. On-board computer display at best is a gross approximation and never match car's actual efficiency.
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Old 17th August 2009, 14:05   #1766
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Quote:
Originally Posted by srinivas9446 View Post
Guys,

Recently on my way back from Mysore, my ANHC for sometime was indicating an average of 23KMPL...and for quite sometime it was showing 22KMPl..A/C was on.
i was travelling between 80 to 100 kmph,,,never overshot 100kmph.

can i really go by this...i could not calculate the average, since i travelled to few other places after getting back home.
Since you were travelling at a constant and moderate speed on the highway on a warm (optimum temperature) engine, in the top gear, you would have got tht reading temporarily. It might have only meant that at this rate, you will cover 23 km in one liter of fuel. But on an average day,your car goes through cold starts, cold runs, low speed driving, low gear driving, acceleration, deceleration, idling on a signal, and so on. Then your practical average will come down to the usual 10-14 range.

Note : I am not sure how ur guage works as in, if it calculates the distance from the trip meter or it recalculates fresh every km or so.

Last edited by rageshgr : 17th August 2009 at 14:08.
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Old 17th August 2009, 15:39   #1767
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Hi gpa,
I see that you have clocked 18k kms on your Alto. So you are a real Alto-man.
Yes the Alto FE is indeed unbelievable, but "ye dil maange moar" so I am looking forward to even better performance. I took delivery of the car on "Gudi Padva" which is auspicious day in Maharashtra. I was upset with dealer for not letting me do pdc (due to rush on that day); but by God's grace I landed with a very good piece. I use the full-tank to full-tank method for computing FE. The fuel gauge cannot be trusted as it keeps dancing all over.
Cheers.
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Old 17th August 2009, 15:52   #1768
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It is definitely bad while changing gears or going from neutral to a gear. But releasing a gear, meaning going to neutral position (not another gear) should be safe I believe. In earlier case, you would be trying to lock two gears (toothed wheels) rotating at unequal speed, but in the later case you are unlocking them when they are rotating at same speed. There should not be any issue of grinding or damage in this case. It does mean no engine breaking though, hence more load on brakes (if used) and less safety.

Who is the first expert here? You, I guess! Anyway, I don't want to be a self-proclaimed expert.
Again, without claiming to be an expert, I can throw in a piece of information. The British driving test is known to be amongst the toughest in the world. This clearly shows in their traffic. In two years of living there and traveling the length and breadth of the country, I did not see even a single vehicle even scratching another one. Of course, some have seen accidents happen there as well but the traffic there is so bloody efficient that when I went on vacation to France, I thought everybody there was driving like a maniac. Anyway... the point is that if you cruise on neutral in normal traffic conditions, you will be failed on the test straight away. The idea is that cruising on neutral does not give you the adequate control needed if you need to accelerate and steer away in a split second response scenario.

I request readers here to just read this piece of data and interpret it. I am not interested in getting flamed for comparing British traffic to Indian conditions. If someone here prefers to care two hoots about driving in lanes, overtaking only from the right and prefers to break every traffic law out there then I am not interested in getting involved in an argument with them.
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Old 18th August 2009, 12:42   #1769
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The fuel gauge cannot be trusted as it keeps dancing all over.
The fuel gauge is quite accurate when it comes to the Alto. I have never faced a problem with the gauge thus far. When the needle hovers at the red mark, it usually means there is about 5 litres of petrol left in the tank.
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Old 18th August 2009, 12:53   #1770
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My CL340 Jeep gives me 11 or 12 on highway don't know how much that gives me offroad..
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