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Old 14th May 2009, 16:35   #736
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@sidgo7

I heard that it was a dealer meet which happened yesterday and the tentative prices are now known to the dealers for trim wise. is it true? or any restrictions to disclose it at this point?
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Old 14th May 2009, 17:24   #737
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Default Disappointment!!! :(

Well, no more hopes or anticipation. This is a mail I have received from Rajeev Kapoor, CEO of Fiat. In desperation I had sent him a mail yesterday night to confirm if they have indeed put in 75 BHP engine, he answers in affirmative! Here is my mail exchange with him -

Quote:
Dear Manish,

Why dot you wait another 3 weeks and test drive G Punto Diesel. Do not go by 75 HP engine. We have tuned the engine to have great mix of drivability and economy.

Regards
Rajeev Kapoor
President and CEO






From: Manish <mail removed>
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 12:29 AM
To: KAPOOR Rajeev
Cc: <mail removed>
Subject: Inquiy about GP
- Hide quoted text -

Dear Rajeev,
I have been eagerly awaiting for GP since last 3-4 months and it looks like it will be here in a month or so. However, I am shocked to hear that Fiat is putting FGT 75 BHP engine in GP Diesel instead of Linea's VGT 86 BHP engine and it is really making e very, very disappointed. If it's indeed going to be 75 BHP engine, I would just go ahead and but Ritz, or maybe even Vista top model. Could you please let me know if GP would indeed come with Linea's VGT in it or FGT. When can we tentatively expect GP to launch. We are expecting our baby in July second week and I want to bring my baby home in my new car. Please let me know when are you planning to Launch GP; I have been waiting for it so long....
BTW, I am unable to send you mail from the site's ceo corner! Iget thispage-
http://www.fiat-india.com/Error.aspx

Thanks & regards,
- Manish
GUess even after GP launch, I will be back to my original dilema and conclusion. No premium hatchback is good enough! Here is my rationale -
  • Swift - Great car, with proven Maruti reliability and great ***. BUt long waiting period and I hated interiors comletely. NO ZDI either :(
  • Palio - Nah, interiors are even worse. NO exciting features at all.
  • Vista Multijet - Looks like Indica(b). Hate central console!
  • i20 - Nope! Looks are not at all attractive. Overpriced, petrol and underpowered.
  • Fabia - Skoda? No way! Nuff said!
  • Ritz (based on reports, pics) - Didn't like its looks. Waiting to see it in flesh though. A lot depends on actual size & price.
  • Jazz (based on reports) - Overpriced, under-featured. Petrol only. Would like to check it out nevertheless. Again, a lot depends on actual size & price.
  • GP (based on reports) - I was really waiting for it for last several months. From whatever I had heard, I knew it would be a great car with VGT 86 BHP engine, but they have really disappoited. Would take test drive nevertheless, but stil can't hide my utter disappointment!
Few months ago when I took a quick survey and found al hatches below expectation, I had something (GP & Splash/Ritz) to look forward to. Especially after Linea, I was very much looking forward to GP, but with same Swift engine at 75 BHP -- I am not really excited. II am not sure if 6.5 L Ex-Showroom price is justified for its Top version. That is roughly 1.5 more than Swift VDI ABS, right? am sure Swift will come up with ZDI or match Ritz top version with it featurewise. With 86 BHP VGT, Fiat could have been class leader in terms of features & performance, the engine is already giving 18-19 KMPL is Fiat, what more do you want? IT would have definitely done better in smaller, lighter GP. Why can't they choose to lead the segment iinstead of being 'just one of the 'n' options'?

Now, even after release of specs for all anticiapted models, I am still not able to find a car that I can jump at happily. All of them still seem like a compromise in one way or the other! And now I don't have anything to look forward to either....

Ahhhhhhhh!!! Why Fiat, Why?????
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Old 14th May 2009, 17:54   #738
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I think 75HP will be good. We cant judge the car by just seeing the specs.
I would suggest that we have a test drive of the car and decide.

If the car is good to drive i am surely booking it. No other thoughts.
I dont want the CRAMPED SWIFT. GETZ is too BLAND.

Thanks Sid for the info.
Will have to get a test drive before i decide.
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Old 14th May 2009, 17:59   #739
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Manish, I suggest you wait for the TD as the CEO himself says - maybe they've tuned the engine well?

I'm actually looking forward to the 1.4 petrol (and hope that its prices under 5.8-6 lacs ex-gurgaon for emotion pk)!
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Old 14th May 2009, 18:18   #740
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadyrulez View Post
I think 75HP will be good. We cant judge the car by just seeing the specs.
I would suggest that we have a test drive of the car and decide.

If the car is good to drive i am surely booking it. No other thoughts.
I dont want the CRAMPED SWIFT. GETZ is too BLAND.

Thanks Sid for the info.
Will have to get a test drive before i decide.
I Don't know how many people here had driven a Swift Vdi, i had.
Yes it has the national 75bhp engine.

If you have not driven it then drive it and tell me isn't it enough?
Where do you get the roads to drive at higher speeds than 100kmph?

Now GP with same engine(might be more refined and tuned as suggested in mail below) can't be worse than swift, it can only be better to drive(IMO).
In NCR where i live you are lucky to do a 80kmph for more than 2 mins. Too much traffic, potholes etc do not let you drive more than that.
So why so much disappointment if its not a 86bhp engine?
People forget we are not in Europe where such engines and AT are a boon with wide roads and very less traffic.

This does not means am not disappointed(i am a prospective buyer myself as can be seen by my signature since long). But then i don't feel it will be a bad car to drive at all.
Many people complained LInea is underpowered(they still do). I feel they are somewhat right,it is a bit Underpowered but GP am sure wont be considering its a hatch.

FIAT is trying to establish themselves and this time they are hitting the right pulse - features with economy(As seen by linea and now GP). So we need to understand their side as well. Maybe in future the upgrades for Linea and GP will come as well.

Lets wait for TD's and then decide.
Peace!

Last edited by harry10 : 14th May 2009 at 18:23.
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Old 14th May 2009, 18:30   #741
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hey manish..

swift is the most fun to drive car in its segment right now.
as far as the interiors are concerned its good enough for 4 well built people on long drives and 5 people od shorter drives.you can also deck up the interiors according to your taste.

as far as waiting period is concerned let me tell you that i got my swift Ldi in 10 days flat dude.even Vdi other than white colour is available readily ( in 10-15 days).

waiting period now is enjoyed by the dzire sedan.
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Old 14th May 2009, 18:35   #742
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manish7 View Post
Well, no more hopes or anticipation. This is a mail I have received from Rajeev Kapoor, CEO of Fiat. In desperation I had sent him a mail yesterday night to confirm if they have indeed put in 75 BHP engine, he answers in affirmative! Here is my mail exchange with him -



GUess even after GP launch, I will be back to my original dilema and conclusion. No premium hatchback is good enough! Here is my rationale -
  • Swift - Great car, with proven Maruti reliability and great ***. BUt long waiting period and I hated interiors comletely. NO ZDI either :(
  • Palio - Nah, interiors are even worse. NO exciting features at all.
  • Vista Multijet - Looks like Indica(b). Hate central console!
  • i20 - Nope! Looks are not at all attractive. Overpriced, petrol and underpowered.
  • Fabia - Skoda? No way! Nuff said!
  • Ritz (based on reports, pics) - Didn't like its looks. Waiting to see it in flesh though. A lot depends on actual size & price.
  • Jazz (based on reports) - Overpriced, under-featured. Petrol only. Would like to check it out nevertheless. Again, a lot depends on actual size & price.
  • GP (based on reports) - I was really waiting for it for last several months. From whatever I had heard, I knew it would be a great car with VGT 86 BHP engine, but they have really disappoited. Would take test drive nevertheless, but stil can't hide my utter disappointment!
Few months ago when I took a quick survey and found al hatches below expectation, I had something (GP & Splash/Ritz) to look forward to. Especially after Linea, I was very much looking forward to GP, but with same Swift engine at 75 BHP -- I am not really excited. II am not sure if 6.5 L Ex-Showroom price is justified for its Top version. That is roughly 1.5 more than Swift VDI ABS, right? am sure Swift will come up with ZDI or match Ritz top version with it featurewise. With 86 BHP VGT, Fiat could have been class leader in terms of features & performance, the engine is already giving 18-19 KMPL is Fiat, what more do you want? IT would have definitely done better in smaller, lighter GP. Why can't they choose to lead the segment iinstead of being 'just one of the 'n' options'?

Now, even after release of specs for all anticiapted models, I am still not able to find a car that I can jump at happily. All of them still seem like a compromise in one way or the other! And now I don't have anything to look forward to either....

Ahhhhhhhh!!! Why Fiat, Why?????
You were expecting 86 BHP and GP is coming in 75 BHP, difference of 11 bhp. How much difference 11 bhp is it going to make? We hardly touch 80-90 in city and that too for few minutes. I don 't understand this cribbing.

75bhp is a decent figure and look at the car as a whole, you will certainly enjoy the driving experience..chill.
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Old 14th May 2009, 18:52   #743
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reppy View Post
Manish, I suggest you wait for the TD as the CEO himself says - maybe they've tuned the engine well?
Certainly! I already said that I will be taking test drive of the car. If I like maybe multiple test drives, because I was really, really looking forward to GP.

It's not only about 75 BHP, the VGT engine is in different league altogether. The FGT (if it's the same one that's running in Palio) is rather dated, and not as exciting as VGT, that's why I am grumbling. It's not about being 'sufficient'; it's about exceeding expectatios and leading the class. Like Linea has created a niche for itself -- it's much above other C class sedans. With 75 BHP, GP could be just one of teh many cars sporting the same engine. Let's wait for 3 weeks and see how it turns out in Flesh. With lenia, Fiat certainly has raised expectations.
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Old 14th May 2009, 18:57   #744
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What is the weight difference between Swift and GP? BHP and torque figures and weight should give us a theortical idea of how good the GP will be to drive.

If I go in for pete's tuning box, I assume I will get the FGT to 90bhp? That should take care of our power requirement isnt it? BUT, if Fiat had given us the VGT with 86bhp then we could pete the car to about 100bhp!

GP and Linea chassis are crying out for better engines. Fiat launched a 100bhp hatch in 2002 when even sedan's twice it's price didn't offer 100bhp. It's sad to see a company like this go into a shell and on the defensive. At least, offer the VGT as an option for God's sake!

Last edited by amit : 14th May 2009 at 18:59.
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Old 14th May 2009, 19:34   #745
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The weight European version of GP with MJD 75 is 1105 and for Swift it is 1075 for VDI. For Indian GP it may come down a few since it lacks some features from Euro GP.
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Old 14th May 2009, 19:36   #746
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6.5 L for a 75 BHP engine is too much irrespective of the other goodies. I believe India is not yet ready for premium hatchbacks. I hope FIAT know what they are doing. They may upgrade to VGT when Linea is upgraded 1.6 MJD.
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Old 14th May 2009, 20:29   #747
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Our country doesn't care about engine, lets get that straight.
"arre aawaz nahi ari engine se, achha hai"- as long as the engine doesn't make a lot of noise, people here think its good

We as a people care least about power, and more about engine noise.

So these companies offering our national engine know what they are doing.

Manish, take your time with test drives, since the other option left for you is the ritz with its famous maruti fit and finish(i own a 2008 swift, i know)

I think the power is enough when you look at all the other hatches and look at swift, its a fun car to drive so yea...just wait for test drives
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Old 14th May 2009, 20:47   #748
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Are we looking too much into specs? I'm also disappointed with Fiat not offering VGT but may be they will price it competitive.

Anyways, have a look at these specs. Palio vs Vista vs Swift clearly shows whole drive train should be considered along with tuning and not just specs on paper.

If you guys feel 165 kmph max speed of stock 75 bhp GP is not enough for you, there is always that pete's box.

Name:  wiki.bmp
Views: 876
Size:  391.1 KB

PS: those GP specs are from FIAT turkey.

Last edited by Comrade : 14th May 2009 at 20:52.
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Old 14th May 2009, 20:48   #749
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If one looks at the wider picture of our country then it is obvious that only a small % of hatchback buyers are car enthusiasts (in the sense of minding too much about 0-100 timings etc). Roomy interior, good boot space, comfortable ride and painless after sales service are the most important requirements along with price and fuel efficiency. I have never heard any average Joe on a hatchback with 70-75 bhp of power complaining about the engine being underpowered. So, the extra 10-15 bhp of the VGT should not be the deal breaker for the average prospective buyer of GP.

My brother-in-law has clocked many thousand miles more on the steering wheel than myself. He is going for a new hatch shortly and he is happy with the performance of my Palio MJD. He is not one to spend time researching for his next car and he will rely on his friends' recommendation and a test drive or two. As of now he is almost a sureshot buyer of the GP due to my recommendation and his short experience on my car.

Keeping this scenario in mind I believe that Fiat playing it safe with the lower specced engine is not going to hurt them. They will have all the time in the world to introduce the other engines once the car is a success and the A** setup is in order.

Last edited by tortoiseNhare : 14th May 2009 at 20:55. Reason: Typo correction
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Old 14th May 2009, 20:56   #750
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I have a Swift VDI-ABS and it absolutely rocks! So even if the GP is at par in terms of performance, you've got yourself a much stronger, spacious, classier package than the Swift!
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