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Old 14th September 2007, 12:13   #16
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some how i had this feeling that fiat india will be taken over by tata,but this is something to think about.
well when a lenovo a can takeover part of IBM, then it also can happen.

being a tata car owner some how it makes me feel good that finally the company might just get rid of indian taxi cab makers.

Tata has been working really aggresivly in all the sectors.

i wont mind actually if tomorrow an amrican says he i also drive a tata back home. (there i said it now let the fire works begin )
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Old 14th September 2007, 12:23   #17
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As the article states, It is nothing but 'the biggest qualified rumour in the market'!
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Old 14th September 2007, 12:56   #18
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I dont think Ratan Tata is that bad as a businessman to make this move. When GM paid 2 billion to get off of Fiat, why would a lesser known company make such a mistake ?
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Old 14th September 2007, 12:58   #19
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Let's pray it is a rumour. Even otherwise, we still have some good respect for TATA in our hearts. Ain't it?
Maybe it can become a saviour for FiAT sPA. The way they're headed sometimes really makes us sad. It could be in the hands of TATA that it can become a stable and sensible Automobile manufacturer.

It is high time somebody takes up FiAT India. It doesn't know what it can become. Only if it could utilise It well. Now it is like a golden egg laying duck which has unfortunately forgotten how to lay eggs. I am sure TATA can nurture it into It's glory days.
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Old 14th September 2007, 13:34   #20
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Does TATA Motors doesn't have the required capital for this ?
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Old 14th September 2007, 14:09   #21
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Interesting! Here are some quick facts:
(all price figures in $)
(source: Auto Manufacturers - Major Company Index: Industry Center - Yahoo! Finance)

FIAT S.p.A:
Fiscal Year End: December
Revenue (2006):68433.80 M
Revenue Growth (1 yr):24.10%
Employees (2005):173,695
Employee Growth (1 yr):8.20%

TATA:
Fiscal Year End:March
Revenue (2006):5409.50 M
Revenue Growth (1 yr):18.90%
Employees (2006):33,536
Employee Growth (1 yr):13.70%

Suzuki:
Fiscal Year End:March
Revenue (2006):23355.80 M
Revenue Growth (1 yr):6.20%
Employees (2006):14,180
Employee Growth (1 yr):3.10%

GM:
Fiscal Year End: December
Revenue (2006):207349.00 M
Revenue Growth (1 yr):7.70%
Employees (2006):280,000
Employee Growth (1 yr):(-16.40%)

Hyundai:
Fiscal Year End: December
Revenue (2005):57636.40 M
Revenue Growth (1 yr):13.70%
Employees (2005):68,000
Employee Growth (1 yr):33.30%

Volkswagen AG (AUDI, Lamborghini, Bentley, and Bugatti, SEAT & SKODA):
Fiscal Year End: December
Revenue (2006):138361.60 M
Revenue Growth (1 yr):22.60%
Employees (2006):328,599
Employee Growth (1 yr):(-4.70%)

Toyota:
Fiscal Year End:March
Revenue (2007):202864.00 M
Revenue Growth (1 yr):13.30%
Employees (2007):299,394
Employee Growth (1 yr):4.70%

Ford:
Fiscal Year End: December
Revenue (2006):160123.00 M
Revenue Growth (1 yr):(-9.50%)
Employees (2006):283,000
Employee Growth (1 yr):(-5.70%)

DaimlerChrysler:
Fiscal Year End: December
Revenue (2006):200143.00 M
Revenue Growth (1 yr):12.80%
Employees (2006):360,385
Employee Growth (1 yr):(-5.80%)

Renault:
Fiscal Year End: December
Revenue (2006):54787.90 M
Revenue Growth (1 yr):11.90%
Employees (2005):126,584
Employee Growth (1 yr):(-3.10%)

True indicator of the company is its Market Capital though. In any case Tata doesn't seem to match in size to the rest ;-(

BTW, for those who think that FIAT is sinking, here are some key financial details for Fiat S.p.A:

2006 Net Income (mil.): $719.6
1-Year Net Income Growth: 386.0%


(source: Fiat S.p.A. information and related industry information from Hoover's)

Last edited by sushanthr77 : 14th September 2007 at 14:10.
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Old 14th September 2007, 14:50   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sushanthr77 View Post
......In any case Tata doesn't seem to match in size to the rest
Nor did Tata Steel match Corus in size. But look what happened.
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Old 14th September 2007, 15:05   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mithun View Post
Does TATA Motors doesn't have the required capital for this ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by sushanthr77 View Post
Interesting! Here are some quick facts:
(all price figures in $)
(source: Auto Manufacturers - Major Company Index: Industry Center - Yahoo! Finance)

FIAT S.p.A:
Fiscal Year End: December
Revenue (2006):68433.80 M
Revenue Growth (1 yr):24.10%
Employees (2005):173,695
Employee Growth (1 yr):8.20%

TATA:
Fiscal Year End:March
Revenue (2006):5409.50 M
Revenue Growth (1 yr):18.90%
Employees (2006):33,536
Employee Growth (1 yr):13.70%

True indicator of the company is its Market Capital though. In any case Tata doesn't seem to match in size to the rest ;-(

BTW, for those who think that FIAT is sinking, here are some key financial details for Fiat S.p.A:

2006 Net Income (mil.): $719.6
1-Year Net Income Growth: 386.0%


(source: Fiat S.p.A. information and related industry information from Hoover's)
Tata Motors is a small part of the Tata Group, therefore this is about a large enterprise buying a smaller one, not a small automaker buying a larger one.

Yes they can do it, because they paid more for a Corus buy earlier this year. IMHO if they can be considered serious suitors to buy Chrysler in future then Fiat, which is one of the smaller automakers in the world, shouldnt post much of a challenge.



Quote:
Originally Posted by directinjection View Post
Nor did Tata Steel match Corus in size. But look what happened.
Agreed, but the question is - (1) is Fiat up for sale and (2) even if they were, is it a logical buy for Tata? Neither of it is true, Im afraid.
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Old 14th September 2007, 15:38   #24
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The italians are very possessive about FIAT and if it comes to a stage where somebody makes a takeover bid for FIAT the italian government would intervene.

Tata may just buy a minority stake in Fiat but I don't think they would be able to achieve a majority/controlling stake.
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Old 14th September 2007, 15:39   #25
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I read in a newspaper that TATA group was not able to sustain/clear their bid for Corus when the State Bank of India (I guess) came to their rescue offering them 6 Billion $ loan.. How come suddenly TATA is queuing up for FIAT, Jaguar and LR ? And then again after facelifting so much, is FIAT up for sale??? FIAT is in profits once again I guess.. It seems to be a plain BS...
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Old 14th September 2007, 16:12   #26
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Tata have the financial clout to buy Fiat Auto no doubt. The way these deals are financed is highly complex. There are the banks and other financial devices at play, institutional and private investors and of course Tata and its coffers. It would be wrong to think that Tata are fronting the deal with an all cash buyout. And remember, they need just 51% for a controlling stake.

As much as we Indians would love to see Tata take over Fiat, I personally do not think its the way to go, for the moment at least. Even if they do go ahead, a gradual buyout over the long term is a better bet. For now, Tata need the engineering and technical support for their product development. They already have a distribution tie-up for India and abroad.

Finally, I would take this article(base?) with more than a pinch of salt. It looks no better than school boy journalism(rumours?) and is not meant to be taken with lots of coffee and cigarettes. (with due respect to school goers and the author of the article).
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Old 14th September 2007, 16:13   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahul_intlad View Post
The italians are very possessive about FIAT and if it comes to a stage where somebody makes a takeover bid for FIAT the italian government would intervene.

Tata may just buy a minority stake in Fiat but I don't think they would be able to achieve a majority/controlling stake.
Very true, i saw a documentary on fiat some time back, it was amazing what this company was and what has it come to. italians are really possesive about fiat.
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Old 14th September 2007, 16:23   #28
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And we are few of the possessive people about FIAT here on board
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Old 14th September 2007, 16:29   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaserQ View Post
Tata have the financial clout to buy Fiat Auto no doubt. The way these deals are financed is highly complex.
Doubtful on the first, sure on the second. The Tata group is already servicing a large debt (ref: Corus). I wonder why they would want to saddle themselves with more, financial wheeling dealing notwithstanding. Also, do they really require to buy Fiat? I don't think so.
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Old 14th September 2007, 16:33   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by typeOnegative View Post
Doubtful on the first, sure on the second. The Tata group is already servicing a large debt (ref: Corus). I wonder why they would want to saddle themselves with more, financial wheeling dealing notwithstanding. Also, do they really require to buy Fiat? I don't think so.
Exactly.... Not at all need to buy FIAT...

1. They have got dealer network of FIAT in europe,
2. They will be getting engines from FIAT
3. They will be getting technology assistance from FIAT
4. R TATA is already on board of FIAT so he is ware of FIAT's internal policies and can convince FIAT to help TATA motors..
5. Will ge distributing FIAT owned other brands (Ferrari, Masrati etc - at least I have heard of)

Why one should waste money in buying so much supportive hand?? It is ok if they buy Jaguar and LR but then it needs some money . And again its not only automobile that TATA group is looking after... They have other industries as well to invest money in...
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