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Old 5th November 2007, 13:28   #136
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@power ranger: I totally agree with you. They shouldn't have discontinued the 3.0. TATAs had practically removed all the so called glitches & problems with this model. And then they go and stop production of this model and come out with a totally new 2.2.

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( they could have got the 3.0 earlier and in my opinion should not have discontinued the 3.0, atlast they had found the right engine (my apologies to 2.2 ).
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Old 5th November 2007, 14:11   #137
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I like TATA as a company. What I fail to understand is that why such a huge compay like TATA still has so many glitches in the recently launched 2.2 !!

In today's cut throat automotive world, companies make flawless cars - I have purchased 5 Hyundai's, 1 Honda & 1 maruti these past 7 years and never ever have I had a single problem ( And I really mean even 1 single problem - Apart from punctures, wiper blades wearing off & headlight/tail lamp bulb fuses ).

Now what I read on Harjeev's safari's review is that it fails on the first day itself. Now I know diesels are famous for their glitches BUT I know people who have Scorpios / tavera's and never had a single problem till now.

Guru Bhai has both the trucks - tell me one thing Guru bhai - which do you think is a better buy ? I mean coming form a person who has both these cars - your answer would be unbiased !!

I am not against Safari - In fact I simply love its looks, its mach image and unbeatable interior comfort BUT the Engine ( the soul of a car ) remains a big question.

This is the reason for me not buying a Safari !!
I get my cars serviced at time and take care like any normal person does.
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Old 5th November 2007, 14:19   #138
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Originally Posted by vkochar View Post
I know people who have Scorpios / tavera's and never had a single problem till now.
Add one more such Scorpio to your list. 15 months ownership. Done many trips to the mountains, including Leh, Ladakh. Current Odo 11042 kms.
BUT, BUT, I did have one problem - tailgate light switch failed. Was replaced at 1st service.
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Old 5th November 2007, 14:24   #139
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Originally Posted by vkochar View Post
I am not against Safari - In fact I simply love its looks, its mach image and unbeatable interior comfort BUT the Engine ( the soul of a car ) remains a big question.
I think you may have got it slightly mixed up - the Engine is trouble free AFAIK, its the third party components that create a problem at times.

And perhaps you haven't been following GD's posts very closely - I thought his views on the subject were very clear
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Old 5th November 2007, 14:35   #140
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Originally Posted by vkochar View Post
What I fail to understand is that why such a huge compay like TATA still has so many glitches in the recently launched 2.2 !!

Now what I read on Harjeev's safari's review is that it fails on the first day itself. Now I know diesels are famous for their glitches BUT I know people who have Scorpios / tavera's and never had a single problem till now.

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Originally Posted by harjeev View Post
Don't let this one small event shake you confidence on the Tata Safari.
If you have read my subsequent posts you must know by now that the problem wasnt because of a faulty or inferior engine quality. Is was just an oversight on part of the PDI team who forgot to remove the cardboard packing. It could have happened to any car. Even a Merc or BMW.

On the contrary it strengthened my trust and belief in the quality and superiority of the technology used by the Tatas. Had it not been for the Electronic Control Unit (ECU) there would have been far greater problem with the engine. And that would have been a cause of concern.

As far as the engine is concerned please read the Test Drive reports and LTR's.

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Thats totally incorrect as for me. I have subjected the 2.2 till now may be quite to the max in the first 2500 km, with all kinds of road and in all kinds of driving scenarios - it has passed the test, of course TILL NOW.

I will not guess what happens afterwards as that will be totally unsubstantiated and more of a loose talk. I had before once said that those you have the 3.0 they are losing nothing but if you need to have a new one, go for the 2.2 and I do not regret it for once.

So in that case your strong views about the 2.2 and making out a dooms day for 2.2 owners is totally baseless and uncalled for.

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Originally Posted by adc View Post
adc - Oct 15, 2007 - LX 2wd - Cycus Grey

rmanikoth - Oct 16, 2007 - LX 2wd - Quartz Black

turbaman - Oct 19, 2007 - Vx 4wd - Artic Silver

chatter gi - Oct 23, 2007 - LX 2wd - ???

moodswings - Oct 23, 2007 - EX ??? - ???

harjeev - Nov 1, 2007 - EX 2wd - Pearl White

djbobo - Nov 2, 2007 - EX ??? - Mountain Green


No glitches TILL NOW with around 7 owners [2.2] in approx 16 days. Criticize it when the "glitches" come up, not now.
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Old 5th November 2007, 14:52   #141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adc View Post
No glitches TILL NOW with around 7 owners [2.2] in approx 16 days. Criticize it when the "glitches" come up, not now.
Yeah - there are enough people waiting around to talk up 'glitches' on the Safari and talk up their cars as though they were god's gift to mankind.
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Old 5th November 2007, 16:44   #142
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they are trying but are failing (check the new beige initiative - how many ppl have liked it??)
IMHO Tata simply borrowed this ill advised move from M&M. It is very troublesome to keep the interiors looking clean and spotless.
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Old 5th November 2007, 16:46   #143
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I've espoused my opinion earlier and shall do so again. Have had a Safari of '98 vintage a 2.0 ltr TCIC 90 BHP engine. That was the SUV of the day and the moment. I would very proudly park it next to Pajeros, Cruisers and Prados of the world and believe you me their owners too turned their necks to have a dekko. That was then and today it is different and my safari still chugs along smoothly.

The only mistake I did was to pick a vehicle from the Tata stable as soon as it was launched. I learnt after that it is best to buy a TATA vehicle atleast after a year of its launch.

Having said that, the only major problem I encountered was in 2002 when the Safaris Power Steering failed. The vehicle used to go to a ASC here in Delhi & I would not take its name here in a public forum. It was there mistake that they agreed after a lot of haggling and threats etc. In one of the services I had mentioned to them of some oil spots on the ground where the vehicle was parked. The power steering pipe had a leak and slowly the oil drained out thus the steering pump ran dry and seized up. They never checked the steering oil reservoir or topped it.

That was the day I decided having enough of ASCs and found myself a decent mechanic.

This above description is about the problems that the Safari is supposed to have. The vehicle is regularly serviced and had its shockers changed a few years back. Apart from that no trouble whatsoever.

Coming back to comparision with a Scorpio, I think it is a bit unfair. Coz, I would be doing a review of a 2.0 behemoth with a 2.6 engine.

Safari - massive road prescence, amazing road grip at high speeds, driving comfort, no fatigue encountered on long distances. Have done 700 kms at a stretch and have not felt tired.

Scorpio - very peppy and eager to scoot, better turning radius, body roll and brakes a bit suspect at high speeds. fun to drive.

Now I leave the field open to others to respond. Though I want to own the 3.0 L DICOR, I love my current Safari and am in no mood to dispose. maybe I might have a heart transplant for it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vkochar View Post
I like TATA as a company. What I fail to understand is that why such a huge compay like TATA still has so many glitches in the recently launched 2.2 !!

In today's cut throat automotive world, companies make flawless cars - I have purchased 5 Hyundai's, 1 Honda & 1 maruti these past 7 years and never ever have I had a single problem ( And I really mean even 1 single problem - Apart from punctures, wiper blades wearing off & headlight/tail lamp bulb fuses ).

Now what I read on Harjeev's safari's review is that it fails on the first day itself. Now I know diesels are famous for their glitches BUT I know people who have Scorpios / tavera's and never had a single problem till now.

Guru Bhai has both the trucks - tell me one thing Guru bhai - which do you think is a better buy ? I mean coming form a person who has both these cars - your answer would be unbiased !!

I am not against Safari - In fact I simply love its looks, its mach image and unbeatable interior comfort BUT the Engine ( the soul of a car ) remains a big question.

This is the reason for me not buying a Safari !!
I get my cars serviced at time and take care like any normal person does.
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Old 5th November 2007, 18:05   #144
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Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
The only +ve of the Scorpio was its engine.

But lets leave that to the Scorpio v/s Safari thread - leave the scorpio out of this thread please.
steer i know you would like to defend the safari since u r owning one and thats quite normal.

After my recent trip where I was passenger in a 2.2 safari i found the ride, comfort, noise levels low - tyre engine, overall excellent.

I am inclined to buy the safari EX 2.2 4x4.
Just at what I am looking for:---
I have a Nissan Laurel 1990 in bahrain and it has a fantastic engine which is as good as maintenance free with just the normal period of oil change, air filter. It starts on the first click of the ignition, cruising daily 90 - 110kmph, 2500 kms per month (owned 7 yrs now).
Its low on FE giving about 8kmpl overall (does not matter in gulf)
But gives peace of mind as i do not have to visit the garage / agency for repairs / towing.

Now considering I am keeping approx 9.5L on a Safari 2.2 EX 4x4 in addition to the comforts and looks my primary concern is the Engine.

Since u own a 3.0 it wont make sense to ask how the 2.2 which is new would evaluate. But can you let me know what is the kind of probs you have faced with the 3.0 only with regard to the Engine. As I am planning to use the vehicle 40/60 offroad/road and I need the Engine to be working, obviously without abusing it too much.
Based on your findings it will help me if to skip the 2.2 and go for a 3.0 (recent used market)
did read ur review but its too extesive for me to go thru all the pages so if u could brief down engine repairs uve had.
much appreciated.
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Old 5th November 2007, 18:17   #145
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Ok Understood Guru Bhai !! Thanks !! Sorry for the bother again.

Sumanji - I have been following GD Bhai's posts

CONCLUSION - I think it is best to wait for a few months before one goes for a New product launched by TATA as GD Bhai said.
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Old 5th November 2007, 22:59   #146
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Another reason why I like safari.

30k kms. pedal to metal right from day one. Is offroaded properly, I mean PROPERLY with moon crater size potholes and bumps through villages twice a day while going to farms. This offroading is often pedal to metal where I suspect that other cars will simply fall apart even after one session.

Mad drifts late night. Burnouts umpteen times.

And today was the first time had to change something because of the excessive wear and tear.

Rear end bushings. 450/- per wheel. What more can be asked for?
(Take a look at prices for even Maruti800 rear wheel main bushings)
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Old 6th November 2007, 11:28   #147
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The new Safari Dicor 2.2 VTT is wayyyyyy better than the 3lt. The new engine is operated by a 32-bit electronic control unit and incorporates state-of-the-art technology. The best part of the new 2.2 engine is that it boasts an incredible peak power of 140 PS whereas the 3l is just 115 PS. It beats the 3l is almost all aspects. The 2.2 has a maximum torque of 320Nm where 3l has a maximum of 300Nm. The 3l Dicor has 8 valve Side push rod but the 2.2l has an incredible16 valve DOHC. The coolest part is that you reach 100-kph mark in just 15.8secs whereas in a 2.2 you take 18.3 secs in a 3l Dicor. Overall the 2.2l engine offers a improved driving experience with a smooth ride and amazingly improved power.

Last edited by Samurai : 6th November 2007 at 11:56. Reason: font tags
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Old 6th November 2007, 12:16   #148
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Originally Posted by vivan.carma View Post
The new Safari Dicor 2.2 VTT is wayyyyyy better than the 3lt. The new engine is operated by a 32-bit electronic control unit and incorporates state-of-the-art technology. The best part of the new 2.2 engine is that it boasts an incredible peak power of 140 PS whereas the 3l is just 115 PS. It beats the 3l is almost all aspects. The 2.2 has a maximum torque of 320Nm where 3l has a maximum of 300Nm. The 3l Dicor has 8 valve Side push rod but the 2.2l has an incredible16 valve DOHC. The coolest part is that you reach 100-kph mark in just 15.8secs whereas in a 2.2 you take 18.3 secs in a 3l Dicor. Overall the 2.2l engine offers a improved driving experience with a smooth ride and amazingly improved power.
yes i agree 2.2 is better but wayyyyyyyyyyyy better, nope,
me along with my friends during test drive which was almost 50 km long , did as much abuse which we can,like redlining and holding there for some time in first 3 gears and trying to drift and burnout and swing its tail.
2.2l is somewhat shy on these thing and 3L did all this with ease and moreover even at redline it was not as stressed as 2.2 and moreover it overrevs to 3500.


but 2.2 is better.
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Old 6th November 2007, 13:36   #149
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Default why are TBhpians confusing potential 2.2 safari buyers

I went thru this entire thread, and many TD's done by different bhpians on 2.2 on other threads and have arrived to NO proper conclusion on which one 2.2 or 3.0

Posts from different bhpians TDing and comparing the 2.2 with the 3.0 start like the 2.2 is good in performance, interior, comfort blah blah and then with 3.0 as being better in 3rd 4th 5th above 100kmph, straightline, bodyroll etc etc and
overall stating the 2.2 is better

Now can we Tbhpians have some straight facts if its a comparison between 3.0 & 2.2 on
1) Engine Performance (breakdowns or engineering point of view) how stressful does the engine feel at 90 100 110 and above. Best Cruising speed range.
2) NVH
3) FE
4) 0-100
5) 100-0
6) Handling
7) any more info

Last edited by 2fast4u : 6th November 2007 at 13:39.
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Old 14th November 2007, 22:25   #150
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Originally Posted by 2fast4u View Post
I went thru this entire thread, and many TD's done by different bhpians on 2.2 on other threads and have arrived to NO proper conclusion on which one 2.2 or 3.0

Posts from different bhpians TDing and comparing the 2.2 with the 3.0 start like the 2.2 is good in performance, interior, comfort blah blah and then with 3.0 as being better in 3rd 4th 5th above 100kmph, straightline, bodyroll etc etc and
overall stating the 2.2 is better

Now can we Tbhpians have some straight facts if its a comparison between 3.0 & 2.2 on
1) Engine Performance (breakdowns or engineering point of view) how stressful does the engine feel at 90 100 110 and above. Best Cruising speed range.
2) NVH
3) FE
4) 0-100
5) 100-0
6) Handling
7) any more info

Well..i have one of my posts here which clearly reflects how 2.2 outdoes 3.0
Moreover, heres a little bit more about the two.
Engine Performance – well, the new engine provides for comfortable highway cruising at high speeds. Even at 90,100 or 110, the vehicle displays amazing stability and its not just the engine but also the suspension, brakes and reduced noise/vibrations that has been brilliantly worked upon.
0 – 100: Dicor 2.2 reaches the 100kph mark at 15.8 secs whereas 3.0 reaches there only in 18.3 secs.
80 – 0: 36m for 2.2
Handling: With the braking improved, acceleration improved and car weight reduced the vehicle is more responsive and hence handles better….way better than 3.0
Verdict: TATA Safari Dicor 2.2 is anytime superior to 3.0!

Last edited by Aditya : 15th November 2007 at 09:32.
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