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Old 2nd November 2007, 14:42   #31
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Kiran,

The 1000 did sell along side the Esteem at a much lower price and eventually was wiped out. About the Baleno issue, yes it was a failure when it was launched and just picked up before its demise. Its a great car if you leave the looks aside but then it was too late by the time it got a price cut. Its just enthusiasts like us who went out and bought one, while the others gave it a miss.

Infact I will shortly be looking out for a replacement for my Dad's Sierra which is now sold. At the great price the Baleno was going for, I would have actually considered one. But now at the Baleno price, all I can see is hatchbacks around.

@Techno: Very well said

Last edited by Dippy : 2nd November 2007 at 14:44.
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Old 2nd November 2007, 14:43   #32
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Umm, let's do a quick math.

I have some hearsay estimate of the cost of dies/equipment/tooling (thats the cost of the localization) but can someone here give a verifiable number? Assume something like 500 crore say.

How many did baleno sell over its lifetime? 1000 per month all through? Over eight years, it becomes 1 LAKH!

That totals upto maruti making pre tax contribution of 50000 towards the dies/equipment. Include the interest/working capital cost on those crores, and it doesn't seem like a very successful car

That being said, it was an awesome car no doubt
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Old 2nd November 2007, 14:46   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by esteem_lover View Post
The esteem & the M-1000 co-existed til 1997. It was stopped in 1998 & brought back (or cleared some stocks) in 1999-2000. A team-bhpian owns a 2000 M-1000.
That's great info there. I didn't know. Thanks for the clarification.
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Old 2nd November 2007, 15:00   #34
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Well.........wouldn't call the Baleno a failure. After the price correction it did decent numbers. I have a 16 Month old Lxi and am pretty happy with it. It gives decent FE, great ride comfort and it's an absolute scorcher to drive. Bought it after a low ot research and this forum was a great help in deciding on it. Baleno a Very VFM product and a good performer.

However, the high spares costs is a huge negative.

Overall happy with the car and actually used to recommend it to friends and family before the SX4 came out.
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Old 2nd November 2007, 15:08   #35
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baleno will be considered as a failure in its initial days ...when we had opel astra, baleno and lancer not sure(ford escort) and OHC (1999-2000).people didnt prefered the baleno at that time ...but when there was a price cut and it was avalaible for under 6 lakhs,the sales of baleno did pick up,so much so that it started hampering the sales of Esteem vxi as the price difference was not much and baleno was considered ""BIGGER CAR""

between the sx4 and baleno i would choose the baleno. for its drive and performance.

also i would like to mention that before the launch of SX4 i wanted the baleno badge should have been retained by maruti,,but it didnt happen ..

Last edited by ankit.jhamb : 2nd November 2007 at 15:13.
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Old 2nd November 2007, 15:45   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moralfibre View Post
I thought the Maruti 1000 and the Zen classic were the ones with the shortest life span.
Correct. But the M1000 and the Esteem of today are the same basic car, except for the engine and some other upgrades.

The Zen Classic was a derivative of the regular zen which ran for a decade.
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Old 2nd November 2007, 16:01   #37
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Tell me one thing - Hyundai has been intelligent enough to still sell the Accent GLE - now at 4.99 Lacs Ex. Why cannot MUL do the same - Baleno at 4.xx Lacs !! It would sell in 4 digits definetely every month.

Totally agree on that..the absurd price is what killed the car, which ws otherwise a capable model from the MUL stable.

Cheers
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Old 2nd November 2007, 16:15   #38
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To most of us, "Failure" is a serious and unpleasant word.
When someone suggests, that the Baleno is or was a "Failure", a question springs to mind.
How did they choose to define success and failure?

If it didn't sell in volumes, the way a bag of laundry detergent, sells, is it failure?

That said, the Baleno has many excited drivers, owners as well as kids in the backseat.
When you compare it to any other car sold in India, in its price range, between Rs. 5 lakh and Rs. 9 lakh.
  1. the level of comfort it affords to both driver and rear seat passenger,
  2. the climate control,
  3. the availability, speed of response and cost of most kinds of after-sales service from Maruti dealer,
  4. the level of insulation from road noise,
  5. the 165 km/h top speed that many of us have taken it to,
  6. the urgency with which it smoothly and silently accelerates between 2400 rpm and 3400
is still exhilarating...

For me as a pampered Maruti client with a warm pearl silver 2006-model Baleno VXi bought new from the showroom,
every act of buying, registering, insuring, fueling, washing, polishing, accelerating, cruising, honking the double-horns and driving it and backing it into my garages at each of my offices and homes, has been worth every paisa spent. Many of my Baleno club members in Team-BHP and on cluBaleno would, I'm sure agree.

Ram
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Old 2nd November 2007, 16:17   #39
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Reality - Ask anybody working out the maths in MUL , baleno would be termed a failure which did not recover the costs for MUL , and i did see a few people in this post who would not settle for a SX4 inlieu of a baleno , but these people are very few in fact miniscule knowledgeable people ..MUL needs numbers , sadly baleno failed to deliver the numbers.

Baleno is/was an excellent car - period
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Old 2nd November 2007, 16:54   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ram View Post
To most of us, "Failure" is a serious and unpleasant word.
When someone suggests, that the Baleno is or was a "Failure", a question springs to mind.
How did they choose to define success and failure?

If it didn't sell in volumes, the way a bag of laundry detergent, sells, is it failure?

That said, the Baleno has many excited drivers, owners as well as kids in the backseat.
When you compare it to any other car sold in India, in its price range, between Rs. 5 lakh and Rs. 9 lakh.
  1. the level of comfort it affords to both driver and rear seat passenger,
  2. the climate control,
  3. the availability, speed of response and cost of most kinds of after-sales service from Maruti dealer,
  4. the level of insulation from road noise,
  5. the 165 km/h top speed that many of us have taken it to,
  6. the urgency with which it smoothly and silently accelerates between 2400 rpm and 3400
is still exhilarating...

For me as a pampered Maruti client with a warm pearl silver 2006-model Baleno VXi bought new from the showroom,
every act of buying, registering, insuring, fueling, washing, polishing, accelerating, cruising, honking the double-horns and driving it and backing it into my garages at each of my offices and homes, has been worth every paisa spent. Many of my Baleno club members in Team-BHP and on cluBaleno would, I'm sure agree.

Ram
excellent writeup Ram. Only one point I would like to differ is the top speed. come on the Baleno in stock trim can go way beyond that (at least in speedo it shows a lot more)
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Old 2nd November 2007, 17:25   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2theMax
Ask anybody working out the maths in MUL , baleno would be termed a failure which did not recover the costs for MUL
Why would you or me care whether MUL recovers its money on a car or not ? For me, the product has to be VFM; dont car whether the manufacturer breaks even or loses or makes heavy profits.
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Old 2nd November 2007, 17:26   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlferrari View Post
However, the high spares costs is a huge negative.
This is a very interesting note. Is it really true?
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Old 2nd November 2007, 17:40   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ram View Post
How did they choose to define success and failure?
IMO, whether it was a failure or not can only be answered by Maruti insiders.

I would think manufacturers measure the success of their products based on their internal target sales figures - which need not always be equal to that of the maximum selling product in that market segment. I'm sure Kent does not aspire to sell the same numbers as EurekaForbes. Yet they might consider their water purifier a success if it meets their targets.

I'm wondering, if it was such a failure, what's the point of dragging it's production, years after it failed post launch? Somehow somewhere it must have made sense to MUL.
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Old 2nd November 2007, 17:41   #44
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Quote:
However, the high spares costs is a huge negative.
Quite right. There have been threads here whether Baleno owners were upset on spare costs, especially lamps.
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Old 2nd November 2007, 18:01   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbasak View Post
Quite right. There have been threads here whether Baleno owners were upset on spare costs, especially lamps.
Oh yes. Some of the SGP parts, should you need to change them, are pricey.

EIII front lamps approx 22K pair, new 2006 tail lamps approx 18K pair - I'm told. The good news is that you can opt for EII lamps (without levelling) for 3.7K pair, pre-2006 tail lamps for approx 3.5K I think.
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