Safari VTT or Scorpio Hawk- battle of the 2.2s

[smsrini]

My vote for the Safari.

Great Presence, Very upmarket feel, acres of space.

The scorpio may be easier to drive in the city, but its the safari that the head turner!

Keep on motoring!!

[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by Steeroid

Poetic license?

Real story. I forced my uncle to take extended warranty. 3 days before his warranty expired. He was looking to save 9000rs. but sense prevailed.

Not sure how Bullet owners will take this, but calling either of the two vehicles here a piece of junk is quite an overkill, besides the fact that it is a provocative statement in a thread that is already finely balanced between (heated) opposing views.

Piece of junk was said in an affectionate manner. Have one Bull in the family. sometimes it does not start, sometimes something else conks out, once it shattered my shoulder in three places, but you still love it.

As for provocative, its the same deal with both Safari and Scorpio. Something is being left out in the QC departments of both Tata and Mahindra. Something which does not have to do with using cheap vendors.

Retrofit of Starter motor and power steering hose in a new vehicle? Not done.
Engage 5th at 60kmph the thing vibrates like crazy. Vibrations means premature demise of engine mounts and other things too.

I saw this problem in 20 minutes test drive, Tata can't fix that after testing it supposedly over hundreds of thousands of kms?

In older models the gear shift interfered with the stereo.
Such silly things are galore in both the offerings.

To put things in perspective look at the innova. It costs less than the qualis to produce for Toyota. Yet they command such obscene profit margins.

To sum it up, both these vehicles are flawed, but then love isn't logical isn't it!

[surajs]

Safari 2.2 it is. Its rides better, looks better and better VFM .

[bigman]

Originally Posted by smsrini

The scorpio may be easier to drive in the city, but its the safari that the head turner!

Keep on motoring!!

Whos head does it turn ? In my neck of the woods no one gives the Safari a second glance. Yes when it was launched people were saying balle balle Safari, it even made it into a few Punjabi song lyrics . Now it is so common that no one gives two hoots about them. It no longer has that kudos.

The only place they would turn heads now would be a small backward village but then again these villages the Maruti 800 still turns heads.

[speedmiester]

Though I have voted for the Safari, because I know its potential against the scorpio.
What really matters in the end is the sales figures. Looking at the current trend I do not think that the safari can dent a hole in the sales of scorpio.

Majority of the Indian buyers look at features offered even though they will never use the features ever while using the vehicle.
Scorpio costs less to maintain compared to the safari and also has proved more reliable in the long run. (My experience along with couple of my relatives)

BTW the QC at TATA sucks big time. I was at the manipal motors the other day with my friend who wanted to buy an indica. I was just looking at the new Tata safari 2.2 on display.
The chrome insert in the front grille was just pasted in the wrong direction and i could find couple more such mistakes in just assembling the tiny parts.
A keen buyer will be put off easily if he sees this vehicle.

If this is the way the display vehicle is, I wonder how good the actual vehicle will be.

[JUDA]

Originally Posted by speedmiester

Though I have voted for the Safari, because I know its potential against the scorpio.
What really matters in the end is the sales figures. Looking at the current trend I do not think that the safari can dent a hole in the sales of scorpio.

Majority of the Indian buyers look at features offered even though they will never use the features ever while using the vehicle.
Scorpio costs less to maintain compared to the safari and also has proved more reliable in the long run. (My experience along with couple of my relatives)

BTW the QC at TATA sucks big time. I was at the manipal motors the other day with my friend who wanted to buy an indica. I was just looking at the new Tata safari 2.2 on display.
The chrome insert in the front grille was just pasted in the wrong direction and i could find couple more such mistakes in just assembling the tiny parts.
A keen buyer will be put off easily if he sees this vehicle.

If this is the way the display vehicle is, I wonder how good the actual vehicle will be.

You need to vote for the Scorpio, your vote doesn't match your reasoning. Why vote for a Safari when you can see so many faults ?

[RishiSuri]

The new safari does have all the styling and power to beat the Scorpio.

[dadu]

I agree with you completely if other new car makers can source and give quality cars why cant TATA's/ M&M's.

Originally Posted by tsk1979

As for provocative, its the same deal with both Safari and Scorpio. Something is being left out in the QC departments of both Tata and Mahindra. Something which does not have to do with using cheap vendors.

5th gear is an overdrive for safari, i.e. output speeds greater than input speeds/high speed cruising, with savings in fuel but at the cost of that torque.

One should always follow manufacturers recommendation for upshift or downshift, in case of safari 2.2 upshift(4-5) is at 90km/h whereas downshift (5-4) at 60km/h. A Scorpio owner can comments for the gearshifts, i dont have those figures.

Every car engine vibrates or knocks including petrol ones to a certain extent if you try to do an improper upshift to overdrive gears.

Originally Posted by tsk1979

Engage 5th at 60kmph the thing vibrates like crazy. Vibrations means premature demise of engine mounts and other things too.

[babureddy]

Originally Posted by dicorex4x4

Originally Posted by himanshugoswami (Safari VTT or Scorpio Hawk- battle of the 2.2s)
I am a little apprehensive taking it from Hyd to bang with my family, because I have read some horror stories about people getting stranded on teh hihgways with their Dicors- could be a case of poor maintenannce for all you know, but still.....

I don't think you should worry about that. The key is to get anything suspicious fixed immediately. I've done 1000 km one-way trips without a worry.

I know the feeling of 'what if' but you have to really drive the Safari from Hyderabad to Bangalore and back to really fall in love with the beast.

23300 km, need to schedule my 25K km service soon.

Just wanted to say the same, last weekend, did a up & down to chennai from bangalore, not even a small problem...and cause of GQ highway, speed was always around 140 kmph, ofcourse there will be places where it will be less than 40 kmph...
safari has its problems in some small problems here and there, but nothing about the engine or something big...this is my second safari (earlier had a TCIC) and around close to 5+ years of pleasure owning a safari...never anything serious...

[speedmiester]

The only issue that will put down the scorpio is the additional cost of 1 lakh which is not quite justifiable.
Since I dont own and maintain a safari but use it once in a while, i am quite impressed by the ride quality and the driving comfort compared to scorpio. Hence my vote goes to safari.

[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by dadu

5th gear is an overdrive for safari, i.e. output speeds greater than input speeds/high speed cruising, with savings in fuel but at the cost of that torque.

One should always follow manufacturers recommendation for upshift or downshift, in case of safari 2.2 upshift(4-5) is at 90km/h whereas downshift (5-4) at 60km/h. A Scorpio owner can comments for the gearshifts, i dont have those figures.

Every car engine vibrates or knocks including petrol ones to a certain extent if you try to do an improper upshift to overdrive gears.

A question here dadu.
The indica has a sticker on top right indicating 2 gearshift speeds
1. Maximum speed for each gear during runin
2. Recommended speed for shifting for good FE.
Does the 2.2 have that?
Could you check the manual for recommended upshift speeds(not max speeds in runin, but good FE speeds).
IIRC for 3.0 the upshift from 4th to 5th was around 60kmph

[suman]

Originally Posted by tsk1979

A close friend on this forum had the clutch assembly changed. His oil leak problem took months to solve. Even now his safari rpm accelerates but the speed remains same. Severe clutch slip. He

Tch, tch tch.....clutch assembly changed yet severe clutch slip continues? Warranty period over is it?

Originally Posted by tsk1979

Engage 5th at 60kmph the thing vibrates like crazy. Vibrations means premature demise of engine mounts and other things too.

Just curious why on earth you would engage 5th gear at 60 kmph on a behemoth like that - was it just to find some fault? Its more a sign of the driver not knowing which gear to engage at what speed I would say - no offense. And I haven't seen the bit about 60kmph being the threshold for 4th to 5th but I'll recheck the manual

Would you also be trying to do wheelspins with the truck at every traffic light & then complain that the bl***y clutch packed up?

[suman]

OK, 20 minutes over so couldn't edit -

Just rechecked my Manual & it says 100 km/h for Upshift from 4th to 5th & 60 km/h (same as the 2.2) for Downshifts; this is pretty much in line with what I've been doing.

[ramzsys]

Originally Posted by dadu

Once I had faced a major issue with this engine, it was on my way to Trivandrum from Cochin, after hitting 120 km/h the engine suddenly lacks power and absolutely no response, feels like missing or no fuel supply. I was on the national highway at that time, I pushed the accelerator harder, but of no use. Then I applied the clutch completely and hit the accelerator pedal completely, after some time engine slowly starts responding. This happens 2-3 times that day. I called up Mahindra Service Centre, (TVS Cochin) one guy told me that they have found similar kind of issue with some other customers also (CRDe)

That was a diesel quality problem on the crde engine.

bad-mouthing sans any ownership or testdrive only leads to the conclusion of this site becoming a marketing tool of a few cars.

[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by suman

OK, 20 minutes over so couldn't edit -

Just rechecked my Manual & it says 100 km/h for Upshift from 4th to 5th & 60 km/h (same as the 2.2) for Downshifts; this is pretty much in line with what I've been doing.

So they say that if your speed falls below 60kmph only then change to 4th.
So lets say I am cruising at 90, I slow down to 65, then again accelerate. All the while I am in 5th gear.
I will get vibrations. The vibrations in 5th go only above 70, I guess it may have been one off with a TD vehicle

Regarding 100kmph, it means that on highways where speed varies between 80-90 you will always drive in 4th gear and never 5th.
I think 100kmph is the max speed during runin.
The DICOR 3.0 will be at 2500rpm in 4th at 100, close to redline