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Old 18th January 2008, 12:35   #16
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Originally Posted by shineshine View Post
DDiS is just a name given by Maruti Suzuki. Its not of Fiat.Fiat refers the same as 'Multijet' eg: 1.3 Multijet, 1.9 Multijet etc
There has many discussions on this. We all know who the Technology was developed and owned by.

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Certainly Fiat's little gem is better then Tata's Dicor. The Quadra will revv more freely and higher then the Tata.
Also you cannot judge a engine by the NVH levels. Case in point is going to be the Swift & Palio 1.3 Both having the same engine, the Palio will have better NVH levels. Similarly maybe Logan is better packaged and hence seems to be more quieter.
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You are testing various engines on different frames, their power-to-weight ratios are totally different and is not a true comparison.
You are right, but think, its not possible to have the different engines in the same frame except in the Indica where both engines will be sold side by side. I can only compare what is available.

A manufacturer's success is plonking the right engine in the right frame. DDiS is a successful engine, that doesnt mean it would work on the Grand Vitara where a diesel option will create a lot of interest.

I feel Busa is right on NVH levels. Thats not the only criteria. I feel how the car is adapted to NVH of the engine is the success of the product. Logan has done well on this criteria.
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Old 18th January 2008, 13:12   #17
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Originally Posted by DCEite View Post
Test drive the Indigo DICOR and then Swift DDiS.
You will find the answer yourself.
Any comparison of the two engines must recognise the fact that the DiCOR as available in Indigo/Indica today is a detuned version of the engine since the engine bay of these cars cannot accommodate the bigger gearbox that the fully developed version requires.

DDiS/JTD is of course of a well-proven engine and because of its ancestry and awards, will naturally command a price premium over DiCOR. It will be interesting to see how Tata prices the DiCOR/JTD models of Indica. If you want to play absolutely safe, it would be advisable to go in for DDiS.
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Old 18th January 2008, 19:07   #18
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Default "Dicor" is my Term - TATA

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Originally Posted by shineshine View Post
DDiS is just a name given by Maruti Suzuki. Its not of Fiat.
Fiat refers the same as 'Multijet' eg: 1.3 Multijet, 1.9 Multijet etc
So, Tata Can give its Name Dicor to this quardajet, no matter any engine developed by Fiat or AVL. It should be called Dicor 1.3
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Old 19th January 2008, 11:00   #19
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So, Tata Can give its Name Dicor to this quardajet, no matter any engine developed by Fiat or AVL. It should be called Dicor 1.3
They wont called it Dicor, but Quadra Jet. Dicor are their own CRDi engines.
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Old 19th January 2008, 12:54   #20
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Indica with 1.2 VVT petrol could also be a surprise.( its same technology as in honda city vtec)
petrol engine with lighter weight and good fuel efficiany and at lesser price is what many people wants and this could be the right one
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Old 19th January 2008, 15:23   #21
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The multijet would be better because in a there are multiple injections during one power stroke so the control over the fuel entering the is much better as compared to conventional CRDi which uses at the most two injections per stroke.Quoting the Fiat website

"The original common-rail diesel technology, developed first by Fiat and known as UniJet, used two injections of fuel into the cylinder. This radically improved the noise and vibration created by the traditional diesel engine, but we still weren’t happy - we wanted to improve things even further. The next development that came created more control over the injectors, both by the computer and the physical behaviour of the injectors themselves. Named for its ability to have up to seven injections into the cylinder each time, the MultiJet was born.

It enables the engine management computer to optimise the combustion for every combination of driver demand (the accelerator pedal) and engine speed, and create the best possible injection sequence. It means a quieter, more comfortable drive for both the driver and passengers, with lower vibration levels, better fuel consumption and improved responsiveness. All Fiat diesel engines use our MultiJet technology."
Source Fiat.co.uk | Multijet
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Old 19th January 2008, 16:22   #22
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Thats right but this is not an engine developed for the Swift but matched to a frame and perhaps an overpowered one for a small car, just my opinion.

I remember maruti matching such diesel engines in esteem and the Zen and failing miserably.

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Originally Posted by mail4ajo View Post
A manufacturer's success is plonking the right engine in the right frame. DDiS is a successful engine, that doesnt mean it would work on the Grand Vitara where a diesel option will create a lot of interest.
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Old 19th January 2008, 23:51   #23
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Originally Posted by dadu View Post
Thats right but this is not an engine developed for the Swift but matched to a frame and perhaps an overpowered one for a small car, just my opinion.
I remember maruti matching such diesel engines in esteem and the Zen and failing miserably.
Thats an classic example. The TUD5 just didnt work wonders on the Zen. But DDiS was the right fit for Swift and it worked redefining small car diesels. Unluckily for Fiat, they didnt get it to India first.
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Old 19th January 2008, 23:54   #24
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Unluckily for Fiat, they didnt get it to India first.
And they would never have, had it not for MSIL. They used to have a page on their website, why they didnot get CRDi engines in India, talking about fuel quality and all, the day the Swift Diesel was launched, that section vanished
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Old 20th January 2008, 11:03   #25
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You bet, the feedback on DDiS is quite good and I hope that TATA's would start using FIAT engines and learn from their technology and tieup to build good ones themselves.

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Originally Posted by mail4ajo View Post
Thats an classic example. The TUD5 just didnt work wonders on the Zen. But DDiS was the right fit for Swift and it worked redefining small car diesels. Unluckily for Fiat, they didnt get it to India first.
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Old 21st January 2008, 19:01   #26
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You bet, the feedback on DDiS is quite good and I hope that TATA's would start using FIAT engines and learn from their technology and tieup to build good ones themselves.
Thats exactly the intention of the TATA-FIAT marriage. We will see the MJD in the X1 shortly. Hope TATA beats Maruti in getting the bigger JTD to India perhaps in an Indigo or a bigger car.

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Originally Posted by BUSA View Post
And they would never have, had it not for MSIL. They used to have a page on their website, why they didnot get CRDi engines in India, talking about fuel quality and all, the day the Swift Diesel was launched, that section vanished
Another company that needs to be kicked hard for not getting Diesels is Honda and for giving out childish reasons like low quality fuel.

We have the best CDI, BMW-D, TDi, D-4D, TDCi, DCi, Dicor, PDi, CRDi, DDiS etc running successfully in the country. Only Honda's i-CTDi will not work in India on bad fuel, some awesome justifications

Last edited by mail4ajo : 21st January 2008 at 19:02.
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Old 1st February 2008, 16:32   #27
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Quadrafire or Multijet ... Tata, Fiat, Suzuki, Nissan (likely GM) will all use the Quadra fire ...
1.4 DICOR is a stop gap solution for Tata till the 1.3 Quadra Fire engine will be made in Ranjangaon plant by FIAT by end of June ... once this engine will be available, the current Tata Indica will be Indica V3 with Quadra Fire ...
Just like 2.2 VVT replaced the 3.0L DICOR in Safari similar will be Indica... wait and buy a better one ..simple ...
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Old 1st February 2008, 19:30   #28
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Originally Posted by groom View Post
1.4 DICOR is a stop gap solution for Tata till the 1.3 Quadra Fire engine will be made in Ranjangaon plant by FIAT by end of June ... once this engine will be available, the current Tata Indica will be Indica V3 with Quadra Fire ...
Just like 2.2 VVT replaced the 3.0L DICOR in Safari similar will be Indica... wait and buy a better one ..simple ...
Indica V3 is a completely new vehicle, not the current one with the Fiat engine.
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Old 1st February 2008, 20:05   #29
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Default Its Qudra Jet

Clearly it is the FIAT engine. They have more engineering and Development plus EXPERIENCE. Presently the Fiat engine is the best in the entire world in small capacity diesels.
DICOR is in initial stages of its life. Here the cars have to be Euro 3 in just 11 major citites. But in Europe its around Euro 4 so definately technology wise Fiat will be welll advanced.

I expect that Just like Nano, Tata will in around 2 years have a world beating DICOR to chew up the FIAT engines, but right now its Qudra Jet.
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Old 2nd June 2008, 21:01   #30
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Anyone knows whether DDiS has piezoelectric controlled injectors? or just 2nd generation injectors?
UK version Swift has VGT in DDiS, no idea, why they (Suzuki) are holding it here when Getz CRDi and Indica Dicor has VGT?

suzuki4.co.uk site has SX4 hatchback (only Hatch is available there) has 1.6 petrol, 1.6 DDiS and 1.9 DDiS. with 90 bhp 215nm torque and 120 bhp 280 torque.
When can we expecting them in Indian SX4?

Last edited by TeddyBear : 2nd June 2008 at 21:09.
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