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Old 23rd May 2008, 13:32   #46
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This thread deserves a poll. For me it is 65 rupees.
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Old 23rd May 2008, 13:33   #47
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Originally Posted by gods-envy View Post
the bottom line is we have to change....we cannot expect the government to change.
Interesting...
I read somewhere that a country gets the government it deserves!
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Old 23rd May 2008, 13:45   #48
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You calculation would be good if the only product of Crude is petrol. Unfortunately, we have other by products(and other end products too) like Diesel, LPG, kerosene and the list goes till tar i guess. More on What are the uses of crude oil?

So, what about those? When I pay "just" 15rs extra for the all 4 items you mentioned, then they should give me the by products free. Are they?

As agbenny said, I too have read (guess it was mentioned by on politician in kerala) that the petrol price is around 20 rs in Pak & bangaladesh. Then why it is so much in India. The answer from ruling party was "It is because we have so much population".

Some more.... Howstuffworks "How Oil Refining Works"
From 1 liter of Crude, You will not get 1 liter of petrol + 1 liter of diesel + 1 liter of Kerosene etc.
Europe and Japan pays much more than India for Petrol. we want to reach their standard of living, not our poorer neighbours. any resource not priced correctly leads to wastage. the price of petrol and gas should reflect the international prices to promote more eco friendly cars and public transport.
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Old 23rd May 2008, 13:54   #49
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I cant understand why fuel is so heavily taxed in our country? A major portion of the fuel price goes in the governments kitty for nothing and I am sure not many know that.
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Old 23rd May 2008, 13:56   #50
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the cost of petrol is still a smaller fraction of running costs. i think most members in this forum will not feel the pinch till perhaps Rs 100 a liter.

i own a maruti 800 and drive roughly 6000 km per year. the depreciation loss of around 36000 per year (first 3 years, it will be lesser going forward), the insurance (around 4000), service costs (around 4000 for 2 service) takes my cost of ownership to approx 44000 a year (more than Rs 7 per km). the cost of petrol at current rates is around Rs 3 per km.

People having costlier cars will have a ratio more skewed towards non petrol expenses compared to me.
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Old 23rd May 2008, 14:46   #51
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They cannot just keep hiking the petroleum price. There will be a bigger effect on the economy and ordinary people who don't use personal transportation. The following is what I got from NY times

---"Each 42-gallon barrel of crude oil yields about 19 gallons of gasoline, according to the Energy Department, and about 10 gallons of diesel fuel and heating oil combined. (The two are chemically similar.) Refineries can crack the big hydrocarbon molecules found in the heavier part of the crude oil feedstock into diesel, gasoline or other products, and thus have some flexibility, but there are limits to how much the ratios can be adjusted"---

So even if petrol prices go up and the demand decreases, what will they do with the excess petrol they have in stock ? There will be fall in government's revenue and they cannot increase the diesel price by too much.
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Old 23rd May 2008, 17:31   #52
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Originally Posted by ddd08 View Post
People at times can be really ignorant. Crude Oil is $130 a barrel.
Now, these two sentences seem contradictory.
Why is crude $130 per barrel?
What were we paying when crude was $60 per barrel? (Yes, the crude value was not always $130, and it might soon touch $200)

Indian govt has to be applauded for controlling price rise of astronomical proportions.

US had to adjust from $0.99 per gallon to $4+ per gallon

Thats a rise from Rs 10 to Rs 42 in about 2 years. (all values approx)

I remember adjusting from about Rs 35 to the current Rs 50. That is a lesser rate than what the US had.

Last edited by srijit : 23rd May 2008 at 17:32.
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Old 23rd May 2008, 17:47   #53
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Originally Posted by srijit View Post
Now, these two sentences seem contradictory.
Why is crude $130 per barrel?
What were we paying when crude was $60 per barrel? (Yes, the crude value was not always $130, and it might soon touch $200)

Indian govt has to be applauded for controlling price rise of astronomical proportions.

US had to adjust from $0.99 per gallon to $4+ per gallon

Thats a rise from Rs 10 to Rs 42 in about 2 years. (all values approx)

I remember adjusting from about Rs 35 to the current Rs 50. That is a lesser rate than what the US had.
Dear Srijith,
one thing you will need to consider is the buying power in US and in India. for them it is just costing $4/gallon where in their least salary is around $3K and going way up for techies. Am not sure if all the people in India could think of Paying Rs60/65 per liter of petrol which comes down to 30% of a basic salaried person in a government organization.
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Old 23rd May 2008, 18:13   #54
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Same here! Only I'll have to buy a new cycle since the earlier one was sold 15 years ago. Either that or I switch completely to the BMTC Volvos.
You cannot switch to BMTC Volvos, as the fare for BMTC buses will also go up with fuel price.

Quote:
Originally Posted by asr245 View Post
Anything above Rs70 at today's cost I will seriously consider taking the same route. And also buy a 4S bike. Well.. maybe a P220 :-) ... I think it will still give twice the mileage my WagonR gives me.

At Rs100 I will definitely buy a bicycle! (and no P220.. save the rest of it for petrol.. for times when I am exhausted from riding the bike)
I already bought one Hercules and I'm using at least three days a week to come to office. I have a few friends who do it more regularly. It is really healthy option if your office is within 7KM from home. It is faster than all other mode of transport (half an hour approx in traffic). It is clean, low in cost.
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Old 23rd May 2008, 19:08   #55
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Originally Posted by ravikn View Post
Dear Srijith,
one thing you will need to consider is the buying power in US and in India. for them it is just costing $4/gallon where in their least salary is around $3K and going way up for techies. Am not sure if all the people in India could think of Paying Rs60/65 per liter of petrol which comes down to 30% of a basic salaried person in a government organization.
I was just commenting on how much the US price had increased compared to the Indian price during the same period. Was not commenting on buying power or salary
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Old 23rd May 2008, 23:14   #56
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
When diesel crosses 50rs/liter, it will start pinching a lot!
But I guess then petrol will cost 90rs a liter.
Now only if CNG was available all over the country!
In Vadodara, when my father goes to fill CNG in 800, they take 2 rikshwas and one car. Car owners fight( which is bad I think ), and I have seen autoriskshwas queue to end up more than 6 kms, ( yes that is correct figure ) at times. Cng should me made more widely avaliable all over the country and this needs to be done faster than implemnting public transport.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
Interesting...
I read somewhere that a country gets the government it deserves!
But the good and disciplined always suffer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by srijit View Post
Now, these two sentences seem contradictory.
Why is crude $130 per barrel?
What were we paying when crude was $60 per barrel? (Yes, the crude value was not always $130, and it might soon touch $200)

Indian govt has to be applauded for controlling price rise of astronomical proportions.

US had to adjust from $0.99 per gallon to $4+ per gallon

Thats a rise from Rs 10 to Rs 42 in about 2 years. (all values approx)

I remember adjusting from about Rs 35 to the current Rs 50. That is a lesser rate than what the US had.
Well, what is the percent of government tax in on fuel ? What is the total income tax they are paying ? A usual american will get around 3K-3.5K salary and the cost lets say $4, so, he can afford.
India is a different story: most of the people cant afford more than 50-55K.Also the general cost of energy should be consisdered also.

And have you compared quality and quantity ? What much OIL companies have earned till now by these ways? Also the inderect way why we pay more is "Bad roads( leads to more fuel consumption)", indisciplined drives ( again more braking and break up of energy used to gain momentum ), poor parking. What are the state of such in developed nations.

Reducing government tax is the only option to bring prices in control.



Last but not the least: Most of the people here seem to have 65rs/ltr as limit ( I am also one of them ).

Last edited by aaggoswami : 23rd May 2008 at 23:19.
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Old 24th May 2008, 00:45   #57
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For me the limit will be Rs. 70/lt.
Though many of the members are cursing the high taxes on fuel, here's my view on the taxes. In our country i think hardly 1% of the total population pays income tax. And there has to be some way of taxing the rest 99% of the people. After all we are a democratic country, so why bamboo only 1 guy and leave 99 others freely??
But on a more serious note, I think the high taxes on petrol has a brighter side also. That is the only way you can extract some money out of our great politicians who might never be paying any single rupee as IT. This holds true for those sitting on lumps of black money also.
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Old 24th May 2008, 00:55   #58
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I would pay till about Rs 100/L. But then again I dont have too many options being a cancer patient with a weak immune system. I cant use public transport.
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Old 24th May 2008, 02:29   #59
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I think people miss the point that we were paying 45-50 bucks a litre when oil was $60-65 a a barrel. Now its $130 and some people are speculating its going to touch $200 soon. The taxes and mechanism we have also cover subsidy for cooking gas, kerosene and diesel, that why petrol prices were never reflective of market rates.

Now with prices per barrel spiraling out of control this whole tax + subsidy structure is becoming unsustainable and petrol will have to be sold at 100-110 or more to maintain some sort of parity. Second compared to western nations we have limited purchasing power so hikes will hit us worst taking a a major portion of our income not only for petrol but everything else that will rise in price with oil rates this high. There is no solution to this, the government cannot manufacture wealth and subsidise fuel, where will it get the money from? It depends on us for revenue so if oil prices keep rising we will eventually have to pay the market rates however high.

For most of the world this is a huge issue as it is in India. The search for alternative energy sources has not really taken off, and oil is running out fast, last I heard is 40-50 years optimistically and with demand surging from fast growing economies like India and China and supplies going short the prices are always going skewed in OPECs favour.

Basically we are toast untill we can find new technology and fuel sources. This is just the beginning and things are going to get worse, the only question is how fast.
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Old 24th May 2008, 09:48   #60
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Originally Posted by 9tMax View Post
For me the limit will be Rs. 70/lt.
Though many of the members are cursing the high taxes on fuel, here's my view on the taxes. In our country i think hardly 1% of the total population pays income tax. And there has to be some way of taxing the rest 99% of the people. After all we are a democratic country, so why bamboo only 1 guy and leave 99 others freely??
But on a more serious note, I think the high taxes on petrol has a brighter side also. That is the only way you can extract some money out of our great politicians who might never be paying any single rupee as IT. This holds true for those sitting on lumps of black money also.
Yes its true that most of the people dont pay income tax, but then those who are regularly paying income tax suffer the most. It is now really getting tough for us.


We cannot take anything out of politicians. They are enjoying on income tax payers money.

We are still paying around 70% cost of petrol/ltr as tax to government.
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