Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > The Indian Car Scene


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 3rd March 2009, 05:56   #121
Distinguished - BHPian
 
4x4addict's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Chennai
Posts: 3,975
Thanked: 2,497 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgmuser View Post
As a guy who is looking to replace my 2006 Scorpio, I do not want to buy this one! May be a 2009 Scorpio m-Hawk is a better option at that price with the rest of the money for fuel!
Both the Fortuner and Scorpio are sold in Dubai. Last time I was there, I saw tons of Fortuners but not a single Scorpio. Any idea why?
4x4addict is offline  
Old 3rd March 2009, 08:48   #122
BANNED
 
sgmuser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Mucat, Oman
Posts: 387
Thanked: 124 Times
Infractions: 0/1 (5)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4addict View Post
Both the Fortuner and Scorpio are sold in Dubai. Last time I was there, I saw tons of Fortuners but not a single Scorpio. Any idea why?
Do I need to answer this? Many know the answer! Still...

1. We are talking about Indian context by keeping other comparative models around!

2. Whatever I say, Fortuner will sell like hot cakes!

3. VFM? Surely not just because its fuel guzzler, lousy 2nd row seating, too tall to get in for elders and the fit/finish nothing to boast about. (Because, I assume Fortuner is targeted towards same asia/pac people mover segment).

4. Fyi, here I see atleast 25 fortuners in my car park and only one Scorpio, thats a non-turbo, non-crde old model! Fortuner sells for its Toyota badge, nothing else!

5. I will not dare to compare these two out of India context!!!

Last edited by sgmuser : 3rd March 2009 at 08:54.
sgmuser is offline  
Old 3rd March 2009, 12:12   #123
Senior - BHPian
 
canonball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,466
Thanked: 188 Times
Default

My neighbour has a 2008 320d BMW he wants to sell it when the Fortuner arrives ( he drove it in thailand and was diven in the back seat and loved it - he is 6ft tall). I test drove an automatic scorpio 2 weeks ago and the engine/auto tranny were tops the rest is a complete let down. Anything above 45 to 50 kmph means she starts to sway the worst which is scary to me is when you brake at any speed either slowly or emergency boy does it feel like you are headed into the ground or about to roll over/dive or jack knife scary car to drive occpents may get sick after a while.

I have owned and driven extensively a Pajero, LC, Safari and now have a Innova everything you mentioned about the fortuner sgmuser is akin with SUV's so comparing it to a monoque/sedan like RAV softroader is pointless. You may have a point at best on the underthigh support which we will only know when she comes here (this i suppose will be the latest upgraded model with some new interios/ exterior lights etc.

I doubt what you are saying about 2nd row width being limited is true I have an innova which has similar IMV platform and the 2nd row is just fine, the Fortuner being wider would have wider rear seats and the several 100 pics I have seen from several angles seem to suggest the same. We are a family of 7 with 2 adults at 6+ft 3 ladies at 5.7ft+ and 2 kids and use innova everyday for the past 50k km. By the way all SUV's are a bother for older people getting in as they are ALL TALL (fortuner has 17 inchers so the car you saw may have had bling wheels!).

Last and not the least I am not sure about your issue of global/asia etc but it is a fact that this car is the successor of the 4Runner aka Surf sold in tons all over the world. As for the Fortuner it is available in various guises all over the world (AMERICA - 2009 Toyota 4Runner EU - Pickup/Africa/Latam, US- and yes as you mentioned Asia as Fortuner)

Please look carefully at the US 4Runner it is a reskinned Fortuner.

I would spend more time on Google or doing research if I were you!

Last edited by canonball : 3rd March 2009 at 12:32.
canonball is offline  
Old 3rd March 2009, 14:28   #124
BANNED
 
sgmuser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Mucat, Oman
Posts: 387
Thanked: 124 Times
Infractions: 0/1 (5)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by canonball View Post
Anything above 45 to 50 kmph means she starts to sway the worst which is scary to me is when you brake at any speed either slowly or emergency boy does it feel like you are headed into the ground or about to roll over/dive or jack knife scary car to drive occpents may get sick after a while.
Man, I really doubt the car you have driven. I am having a 2006 Scorp and we constantly drive at 80kmph most of the time and we never had any such issues! There are some riding quality issues in every car! My Dr friend owns a a TOP end auto Innova, D4D, and my wife was complaining the back seat had a no thigh support and felt like a bench without any cushioning effect! At high speed (120+) she felt giddy and I was forced to stop the car! I travelled in an Innova to airport, in front seat, and the travel was better surely.

Quote:
Originally Posted by canonball View Post
I doubt what you are saying about 2nd row width being limited is true I have an innova which has similar IMV platform and the 2nd row is just fine, the Fortuner being wider would have wider rear seats and the several 100 pics I have seen from several angles seem to suggest the same
You say just fine! That means, its not good! For me seating is very important than for ex. boot! You are going to use it daily! Most of the time kids, ladies and elders going to use those seats. I want them to be in utmost comfort esp during long journeys!

I do not need photos, I personally test drove a Fortuner manual! I even measured the seat length, means the thigh support (front/back lenght, not the width of the whole seat) the fortuner second row seat was smaller than RAV4 and X-Trail by almost 20-25%. If you require, I will do this again with some pics! I got that uncomfortable feel as soon as I sat in the back!

Quote:
Originally Posted by canonball View Post
We are a family of 7 with 2 adults at 6+ft 3 ladies at 5.7ft+ and 2 kids and use innova everyday for the past 50k km. By the way all SUV's are a bother for older people getting in as they are ALL TALL (fortuner has 17 inchers so the car you saw may have had bling wheels!).
Pajero in 16inch is perfect for people with average height. Even, Prado is ok. Today, I compared a Prado and Fortuner side by side, Fortuner was taller than Prado esp getting in and out!

Quote:
Originally Posted by canonball View Post
Last and not the least I am not sure about your issue of global/asia etc but it is a fact that this car is the successor of the 4Runner aka Surf sold in tons all over the world. As for the Fortuner it is available in various guises all over the world (AMERICA - 2009 Toyota 4Runner EU - Pickup/Africa/Latam, US- and yes as you mentioned Asia as Fortuner)

Please look carefully at the US 4Runner it is a reskinned Fortuner.

I would spend more time on Google or doing research if I were you!
[/quote]

I couldn't find in web about 4Runner+Fortuner theory, may be true. May be a common platform! Americans will not buy this AP/LATAM spec of Fortuner surely, that is my point! But wiki says,

"The Toyota Fortuner is a pickup-truck-based passenger vehicle (PPV) produced by the Japanese automaker Toyota for some Asian, African and Latin American markets."

It means, this is not a global product, rather for developing worlds like AP, Africa and LATAM. Thats why I see some cheap looking touches in Fortuner which I do not like.

After lots of consideration, I picked up X-Trail, fyi!

Lastly, Indian version might get a 2.5 (better FE) or 3.0 D4D doing duty in Innova. Seats may be given some improvements, but the height going to stay same!

Last edited by sgmuser : 3rd March 2009 at 14:33.
sgmuser is offline  
Old 3rd March 2009, 14:40   #125
Senior - BHPian
 
canonball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,466
Thanked: 188 Times
Default

sgmuser you are not making any sense, I don't think there is any point trying to explain to you, just consider yourself the SMARTEST guy here who knows it all and is always right goodbye maybe brunie is the right place for you Salamat Malam

Last edited by canonball : 3rd March 2009 at 14:43.
canonball is offline  
Old 3rd March 2009, 17:18   #126
Distinguished - BHPian
 
4x4addict's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Chennai
Posts: 3,975
Thanked: 2,497 Times
Default

I used a Fortuner for couple of days in Dubai and I loved it.

Seats were fine including the third row seat which was actually much more usable than the endys since there foot well of the third row is lower than the rest of the boot. The third row is frankly more confy than my TLC 100 and a Prado that I have sat in.

The only way this product will fail in India is if Toyota screws up on the pricing. Endy and Pajero 2.8 is a huge compromise for 20 lakhs. They still sell. The Fortuner addresses the draw backs of both, i.e the ride and seats of the Endy and the underpowered engine of the Pajero 2.8.
4x4addict is offline  
Old 3rd March 2009, 17:28   #127
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Sahil's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 5,204
Thanked: 2,097 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4addict View Post
I used a Fortuner for couple of days in Dubai and I loved it.

Seats were fine including the third row seat which was actually much more usable than the endys since there foot well of the third row is lower than the rest of the boot. The third row is frankly more confy than my TLC 100 and a Prado that I have sat in.

The only way this product will fail in India is if Toyota screws up on the pricing. Endy and Pajero 2.8 is a huge compromise for 20 lakhs. They still sell. The Fortuner addresses the draw backs of both, i.e the ride and seats of the Endy and the underpowered engine of the Pajero 2.8.
I briefly sat in the Fortuner in Dubai too. If i remember correctly the 2nd row lacked adequate thigh support, does it? Not that the Endeavour is any better either.

Like most I'm eagerly awaiting the Fortuner too, as a replacement for our Endy. But this wait is killing me and the new superb is tempting me Both are different segments but I might make the compromise(if you can call it that) only if the family agrees to not have an SUV

Last edited by Sahil : 3rd March 2009 at 17:30.
Sahil is offline  
Old 3rd March 2009, 17:35   #128
Distinguished - BHPian
 
4x4addict's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Chennai
Posts: 3,975
Thanked: 2,497 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sahil View Post
Like most I'm eagerly awaiting the Fortuner too, as a replacement for our Endy. But this wait is killing me and the new superb is tempting me Both are different segments but I might make the compromise(if you can call it that) only if the family agrees to not have an SUV
I agree that unless you have an unlimited budget, with the limited choices we have in India, every product is a compromise to some extend. I still feel that if they price it competitively versus the Pajero 2.8 and Endy, the Fortuner will capture that market.

Smg user is comparing it with his X-Trail. There is no point in compary body on frame SUVs with car based soft roaders since the car based soft roaders will always be more comfortable on the road. The whole reason that there is such a huge demand for Soft roaders is that people want to drive a car that looks like an SUV, because they don't plan to use it off-road and they prefer the macho looks
4x4addict is offline  
Old 3rd March 2009, 18:01   #129
BANNED
 
sgmuser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Mucat, Oman
Posts: 387
Thanked: 124 Times
Infractions: 0/1 (5)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by canonball View Post
sgmuser you are not making any sense, I don't think there is any point trying to explain to you, just consider yourself the SMARTEST guy here who knows it all and is always right goodbye maybe brunie is the right place for you Salamat Malam
lets not take this personal! Iam not trying to convince you! this is my finding after i done some extensive research during my car purchase! i am not like you posting something by googling! i didn't say iam smartest!

also, if you have facts/nos post here, rather than running!!! we need healthy discussions here, not these kind of timewasters.
sgmuser is offline  
Old 3rd March 2009, 19:10   #130
Senior - BHPian
 
canonball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,466
Thanked: 188 Times
Default

Hey 4X4 & sahil 4 runners (94 model) that I drove in the US were a death traps infact at one time it was in the same rating as Suzuki Samurai for toppling in conusmer ratings were short of being banned. Since you guys have driven/ridden the fortuner wanted to know if you ever drove/rode in the old surfs/4runners? If so is this one more stable?

The road tests done by our Indian jurnos claim it to be very stable at high speeds wanted to know if you shared the same experience.

Last edited by canonball : 3rd March 2009 at 19:12.
canonball is offline  
Old 3rd March 2009, 20:53   #131
Distinguished - BHPian
 
4x4addict's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Chennai
Posts: 3,975
Thanked: 2,497 Times
Default

My usage was very limited just hoping from one tourist attraction to another in dubai. This was also the 2.7 VVTI petrol engined version with Automatic tranny. Hence the driving impression maynot be relevant. The seats however where much more comfortable than the Endy and the Pajero 2.8 which will be the Fortuners nearest competition.
4x4addict is offline  
Old 3rd March 2009, 21:57   #132
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Sahil's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 5,204
Thanked: 2,097 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by canonball View Post
Hey 4X4 & sahil 4 runners (94 model) that I drove in the US were a death traps infact at one time it was in the same rating as Suzuki Samurai for toppling in conusmer ratings were short of being banned. Since you guys have driven/ridden the fortuner wanted to know if you ever drove/rode in the old surfs/4runners? If so is this one more stable?

The road tests done by our Indian jurnos claim it to be very stable at high speeds wanted to know if you shared the same experience.
Sorry i cant really comment on that as i didn't drive it. Was picked up from the airport and driven to my hotel in it.
Sahil is offline  
Old 4th March 2009, 10:11   #133
Senior - BHPian
 
tanwaramit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Dilwalon ki Dilli
Posts: 1,886
Thanked: 334 Times
Default

No matter what do some people think, Fortuner is going to rule the indian market primarily because of the following reasons.

1. Its a toyota
2. Heavy looks (appearance) , good to scrare off people (bikers, autowallahs)
3. Style statement
4. When compared with Endy, Pajero, CRV or Captiva, its the biggest and looks the meanest.
5. Can be used very well for offroading, almost majority of the roads in India.
6. There are lots of people who wouldnt even bother sitting in this car before buying it.

This vehicle is going to make an impression on Indian roads for sure.

Now the challenging part is pricing, given that it is available for around 10L THB in Thailand, will it be available for 12-13 L in India ? Going by the reports it doesnt seem so.
tanwaramit is offline  
Old 4th March 2009, 10:47   #134
Senior - BHPian
 
canonball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,466
Thanked: 188 Times
Default

As I reported earlier they are lanching it as a CKD so will be assembled here not to metion common parts with much localised Innova as per IMV platform roots so price would be same or more than top end Endy so say 16 lacs to 20lacs unless toyota plays safe given they have had their 1st loss in 59 or something years by not being as in your face as Qualis & Innova launch prices in current economic conditions.
canonball is offline  
Old 12th March 2009, 17:31   #135
BANNED
 
sgmuser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Mucat, Oman
Posts: 387
Thanked: 124 Times
Infractions: 0/1 (5)
Default

I just had a ride with one of my friend who drives a civic. He casually told Fortuner has some problem to do with fuel quality. Then I did a google and found out that there are some other complains as well about Fortuner's ride quality and OEM tyres. Ride quality is mostly attributed to its original pinnings from hilux which rides on a leaf spring setup. Eventhough Fort. rides on a coil spring setup, still many complaints about its bouncy ride.
The bouncy ride can be rectified only after changing the suspension/spring. So Toyota is not invincible? I really doubted ride with its tall stance!

Another issue with Fort is that the handling. Toyota SA seems to have accepted the problem in the OEM tyres which is Continental and the new models are getting their tyres changed.

Google "fortuner+problem"
sgmuser is offline  
Closed Thread


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Toyota Fortuner vs Upcoming Face-Lifted Toyota Fortuner dkaile SUVs, MUVs & 4x4s 45 12th August 2011 22:20
Honda plans to roll out small car by 2012 to take on Toyota, Suzuki. aaggoswami The Indian Car Scene 20 22nd December 2009 22:21
Fiat may roll out ‘Idea’ from Ranjagaon (Near Pune) greatDrive The Indian Car Scene 22 25th July 2005 23:51
MUL to roll out new-look Esteem 2fast2furious The Indian Car Scene 41 21st August 2004 00:27
Suzuki will roll out Concept S in india! S350L-E240 The Indian Car Scene 0 11th May 2004 14:59


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 02:13.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks