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Old 1st August 2008, 13:44   #91
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Originally Posted by reignofchaos View Post
I've driven a Swift D hundreds of times and its not something new to me. It is noisy and not well isolated compared to the entry D segmenters. Since you haven't I'd suggest you go TD a civic or cedia to see what you are missing. Infact you don't even need to TD... just sit in the passenger's seat and you'd know.
The point that DieselFan was trying to make is that you cannot hear any sound of the diesel car standing on a road side or yourself ride a bike and go close to a diesel car, because the noise from autos, trucks, buses, tempos are much louder. And I agree with DieselFan. Even when you are driving alone on the road, the noise of the tyre is more than the noise of the modern diesel engines. Unless you are looking for the noise in mid-night alone in your parking lot, it is not much there. Saying that swift diesel is noisy is over-statement, even when compared to entry D segmenters.
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Old 1st August 2008, 13:51   #92
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Question to both opendro and dieselfan - Have you been in a C+/D segment petrol before trying to fight with me? Here's an open challenge. Lets meet over the weekend and see if there's a perceptible difference between the swift diesel and my cedia... at idle/when cruising and lets see if the sounds of trucks and autos filter through. It'll end this pointless debate once and for all. I myself am very interested in this as well cos I know for sure that 1.3MJD is one of the least noisy diesel engines around.

Interested? Maybe I'm wrong but I strongly believe I'm not and this is the only way to find it.

Last edited by reignofchaos : 1st August 2008 at 13:53.
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Old 1st August 2008, 13:58   #93
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Reighnofchaos:

Compare cars in the same segment. Let us meet and see if how your one year old cedia and my 4 year old Hyundai stack up on the following:

In cabin noise - do you have a db meter?
0-100 acceleration - tadu, can we borrow your iphone?
point to point on a curvy road of your choice - this will test suspension and handling too right?

Vijay
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Old 1st August 2008, 14:04   #94
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Originally Posted by reignofchaos View Post
Question to both opendro and dieselfan - Have you been in a C+/D segment petrol before trying to fight with me? Here's an open challenge. Lets meet over the weekend and see if there's a perceptible difference between the swift diesel and my cedia... at idle/when cruising and lets see if the sounds of trucks and autos filter through. It'll end this pointless debate once and for all. I myself am very interested in this as well cos I know for sure that 1.3MJD is one of the least noisy diesel engines around.
Interested? Maybe I'm wrong but I strongly believe I'm not and this is the only way to find it.
Hi Wait a min where/when did Cedia come in picture. It is not about noise of Diesel car vis-a-vis Petrols(and it should not be construed as a fight just a point of view). Obviously petrol engines are less noisier compared to an equivalent diesels (At Idle). My only point was that with all the external noise around, noise from New Age diesel engines at Idle are not an irritant at all.
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Old 1st August 2008, 14:28   #95
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And my point exactly is that there are very many cars out there which don't leak as much external noise as a swift diesel and have a more silent petrol engine which basically means you can't hear the trucks and autos you are talking about. Compared to what i drive, I found the swift diesel engine noise intrusive when I drove it.

Opendro now where did the santro come into the picture? I was talking about the swift diesel which to dieselfan seems to be the best thing since sliced bread.
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Old 1st August 2008, 14:47   #96
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Originally Posted by reignofchaos View Post
Question to both opendro and dieselfan - Have you been in a C+/D segment petrol before trying to fight with me? Here's an open challenge. Lets meet over the weekend and see if there's a perceptible difference between the swift diesel and my cedia... at idle/when cruising and lets see if the sounds of trucks and autos filter through. It'll end this pointless debate once and for all. I myself am very interested in this as well cos I know for sure that 1.3MJD is one of the least noisy diesel engines around.

Interested? Maybe I'm wrong but I strongly believe I'm not and this is the only way to find it.
You missed the whole point. We are not debating whether a specific car is better insulated than the other. We are debating whether a petrol Swift will be more silent than a diesel Swift, etc. etc. Whether you stop your bike or standing beside a swift petrol or diesel in the traffic or whether you are watching a swift petrol or swift diesel zip beside you in the early morning or whether you sit inside a swift petrol or diesel in regular driving, you are going to experience the same, i.e. the predominant noise of the tyre or the other vehicles around than the engine noise of the swift. It is only when you idle your vehicle in an isolated silent place that you really hear the distinctive difference. I hope you got it clear this time. And I don't think that we need to meet for this.

Last edited by opendro : 1st August 2008 at 14:49.
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Old 1st August 2008, 14:52   #97
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Opendro now where did the santro come into the picture? I was talking about the swift diesel which to dieselfan seems to be the best thing since sliced bread.
Did I mention santro? Must have been a mistake.
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Old 1st August 2008, 14:54   #98
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Of course a petrol car will be more silent. Esp at cold start. Case in point, stand outside a Verna petrol or a Verna diesel.
But the more important thing is that even though diesels make more noise, its much less compared to how much older diesels made. Of course some people may find it intrusive, but for the majority, in cabin noise, esp in C-D segment diesel cars should not be an issue
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Old 1st August 2008, 15:20   #99
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Let me also some other noises. A/C air blows and music are also much more prominent than the diesel engine intrusion.
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Old 1st August 2008, 15:30   #100
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opendro, there is no end to this argument, because everybody has different hearing sensitivities.
For example, for me Indica diesel noise is not intrusive because I feel the tire noise etc,m is equivalent.
But I know people who cannot stand being inside an old indica diesel.
So a petrol and a diesel car will make different noise. Whether than noise is too much or not, that depends on a person to person. If Mr. X finds it intrusive, Mr X is right, because he is entitled to his feelings.
So no point debating it. Its like saying Chicken chettinad is delicious and anybody finding it too spicy to eat is lying.
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Old 1st August 2008, 15:45   #101
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Its like saying Chicken chettinad is delicious and anybody finding it too spicy to eat is lying.
agreed its too spicy

I prefer petrols because of the high revving fun. Add a turbo to the petrol and you have the torque surges of diesels with the high revs of the petrol.
I have not driven a diesel, but the engine noise puts me off. Having said that pocket rockets like getz crdis may still be on my list of possibilities
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Old 1st August 2008, 15:50   #102
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Originally Posted by prabhuav View Post
Reighnofchaos:

Compare cars in the same segment. Let us meet and see if how your one year old cedia and my 4 year old Hyundai stack up on the following:

In cabin noise - do you have a db meter?
0-100 acceleration - tadu, can we borrow your iphone?
point to point on a curvy road of your choice - this will test suspension and handling too right?

Vijay
Certainly.... I don't have a problem with that . Also this assumes we are measuring an unmodded car with an unmodded car. Acceleration with a pete's box or a boost controller with boost increased to 20psi doesn't count . Let me see if we can find a db meter somewhere. Mysore road should be a good test. A hilly one should be even better but finding one thats not completely crowded is the issue.

Last edited by reignofchaos : 1st August 2008 at 15:53.
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Old 1st August 2008, 15:57   #103
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Originally Posted by reignofchaos View Post
Certainly.... I don't have a problem with that . Also this assumes we are measuring an unmodded car with an unmodded car. Acceleration with a pete's box or a boost controller with boost increased to 20psi doesn't count . Let me see if we can find a db meter somewhere. Mysore road should be a good test. A hilly one should be even better but finding one thats not completely crowded is the issue.
you guys have way too much time dbmeter and all it seems!!
I would say settle with tsk1979's point of view and move on
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Old 1st August 2008, 17:02   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prabhuav View Post
Compare cars in the same segment. Let us meet and see if how your one year old cedia and my 4 year old Hyundai stack up on the following:

In cabin noise - do you have a db meter?
0-100 acceleration - tadu, can we borrow your iphone?
point to point on a curvy road of your choice - this will test suspension and handling too right?

Vijay
Is that a Accent CRDI? If yes, thats suicidal mate as age certainly brings this beauty down to some extent. Maybe i am wrong.

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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
So no point debating it. Its like saying Chicken chettinad is delicious and anybody finding it too spicy to eat is lying.
Perfect example. To each its own.

having driven petrol engines extensively from M800, Santro, Ford Ikon, Palio to OHC, i still get the kick from a diesel only. I am a diesel head to the core and i would buy a diesel only again and again.

I bought mine paying a premium just to enjoy what these modern day diesels offer and mind you it is not just good FE

When the title says driving pleasure. If people who want their drive to be super silent, no cabin noise and for those segment of people, its the petrol engine ofcourse.

but, for dieselheads, the diesel clatter ( is it really a clatter? i love that sound now ) whatever minimum is pure bliss and the torque surge is simply irreplacebale.

Somehere in this thread Tadu mentioned, don't you feel guilty pangs when you keep your foot on the accelarator when driving a petrol as it brings down your FE to a huge notch. Whereas the same thing you do with a CRDi and the FE difference is about 1km/L and i am talking about gear changes always between 2.5K rpm to 3k rpm.

I perfectly agree with Tadu here, people who own petrol cars would love to show off their machines are better with that one off ripping of their cars ( probably during tbhp meets) whereas we diesel heads can afford to drive like that on our daily drives ( i drive like my a** is on fire on a daily basis)

I think it would be a good idea to have a poll of how many would opt for diesel vs. petrol. I am very very confident the diesel numbers will overwhelm the petrol ones.

Anyways, to cut the long story short, give me a diesel anyday
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Old 1st August 2008, 17:49   #105
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As I see it, diesel engines appeal more to those who want a less involved driving experience. Thats why diesel fans rave about 'in gear' acceleration or 'rolling acceleration'. Whereas, anybody who is enthusiastic about driving would know that the fastest way to accelerate from 50 km/h to 100 km/h is not in 4th or 5th gear but in 2nd gear, and while burning petrol! Also, if you're too lazy to downshift then please buy an automatic and certainly dont waste time talking about 'driving pleasure'.

On a similar note, diesel engines also appeal more to those who want a frugal driving experience. The very thought of burning lots of petrol at 6000rpm makes them cringe and check their wallets/bank accounts to check if the money is still there. Anyone who says that a petrol engine only "purrs" has never taken one to the red-line, and is thus not doing it any justice.

In conclusion:

best for driving convenience = diesel
best for driving pleasure = petrol
Thats "your" conclusion. Its basically flawed because like many have pointed out it all depends on the segment. I guarantee you that your conclusion will not apply to say the 5 series [just an example]. Low end torque that a good diesel gives is phenomenally addictive.

And you think the new good auto transmissions dont give great driving pleasure? Have you tried any paddle shift/tiptronics or the DSG boxes?
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