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Old 2nd November 2008, 08:40   #241
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Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
Y

@Goswami ji, Unbecoming considering you post better than that - your own posts mentions it as the Scorp unit, tractor beech mein kahan se aaya.

And FWIW, Ingenio has been designed to take on the Innova from ground up, and the guys who've tested it speak volumes. Its nowhere like the passover you're making it up to be.

why don't we cut them slack - they delivered the lovely 2.2 scorp afterall - and let real life experiences talk, please?
The original engine with which Scorpio came out and later in CRDe version is a tractor based unit. The engine weighs 350 kg and this is the reason for despite all efforts Scorpio was not a very good handling vehicle. And in case of Scorpio, the engine is mounted relatively higher and this further heightened the problem.

I hope that I am no longer appreciating 2.5. I dont wish that XLYO comes out with this heavy unit. I hope that XLYO comes out with 2.2ltr motor with 120-140 bhp ( may be two power output models ).

I think that I have clarified myself.
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Old 2nd November 2008, 11:21   #242
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@ goswami: from where did you get this information that the scorpio's engine was derived from a tractor engine and it weighs 350 kg?
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Old 2nd November 2008, 15:59   #243
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@ goswami: from where did you get this information that the scorpio's engine was derived from a tractor engine and it weighs 350 kg?
Not sure about the weight but google is your friend :

Quote:
Engine and Transmission
Even though it comes from an agricultural background, the SZ 2600 DI engine is the strength of the Scorpio. Employing a KKK turbocharger, this turbodiesel was developed for Mahindra by famed Austrian engine consultancy AVL from a previous tractor engine it had done for the Mahindra Arjun. The large displacement plus the brilliantly matched turbo makes for torquey power delivery which is a delight and a boon for a vehicle of its girth and weight. On the flip side are noise and high fuel consumption.

Make no mistake about it, the greatest attribute about the new Scorpio is its powerplant which is the way forward for the rest of the industry. And this is not difficult to comprehend. The four-cylinder direct injection all-cast iron engine has cubic capacity on its side to begin with: 2609cc (sporting all-square cylinder dimensions of 94×94mm). This engine was earlier used in some of the Mahindra tractors and because the block could afford a large displacement this was chosen as the mill to be developed by AVL of Austria which designed the powerplant’s internals, gave it an 18.8:1 compression ratio, added a KKK K04 turbocharger (operating at 2.2 bar boost pressures) and gave it robustness to take on tough operating conditions.
Mahindra Scorpio | Automobile and Car Review India
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Old 2nd November 2008, 18:29   #244
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Just read the announcement on the Mahindra website. No specs or pics - seems more like an announcement to investors rather than potential customers.
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Old 2nd November 2008, 19:17   #245
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Originally Posted by bigman View Post
Not sure about the weight but google is your friend :



Mahindra Scorpio | Automobile and Car Review India
great info dude, i was not aware of that even though i had the 2.6 turbo!
i hope the mHawk atleast is not a tractor derived unit. so as goswami said, it should be the one available in the XYLO and not the CRDe. or atleast offer both like they did in the scorpio. position the mHawk as a premium variant. this way the customers will have more options to choose and they wont feel cheated that they are not been offered newer tech (as in, newer mHawk engine) or else potential XYLO buyers may turn towards innova.

Last edited by raj_5004 : 2nd November 2008 at 19:20.
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Old 2nd November 2008, 22:34   #246
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great info dude, i was not aware of that even though i had the 2.6 turbo!
i hope the mHawk atleast is not a tractor derived unit. so as goswami said, it should be the one available in the XYLO and not the CRDe. or atleast offer both like they did in the scorpio. position the mHawk as a premium variant. this way the customers will have more options to choose and they wont feel cheated that they are not been offered newer tech (as in, newer mHawk engine) or else potential XYLO buyers may turn towards innova.
The 2.6 (non CRDE) of the earlier Scoprios (the tractor engine) is a great engine. The very early chain drive (i think it was) has a better feel to it than the later engines. Bags more oomph than the CRDE. Compare an old model with the CRDE and you will think the same.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 00:16   #247
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Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
@ goswami: from where did you get this information that the scorpio's engine was derived from a tractor engine and it weighs 350 kg?
Actually I read in automotive magazines. Never googled it.

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Originally Posted by bigman View Post
Not sure about the weight but google is your friend :



Mahindra Scorpio | Automobile and Car Review India
Thanks Bigman.

Quote:
Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
1)i hope the mHawk atleast is not a tractor derived unit.

2)so as goswami said, it should be the one available in the XYLO and not the CRDe. or atleast offer both like they did in the scorpio. position the mHawk as a premium variant. this way the customers will have more options to choose and they wont feel cheated that they are not been offered newer tech (as in, newer mHawk engine) or else potential XYLO buyers may turn towards innova.
1) The mHawk is not a tractor derived motor. And if I am not wrong, both the Safari 2.2 diesel and Scorpio have the same 2179cc motors mainly from AVL.

2) OK, let me clarify. I believe to meet the emession norms, the 2609cc non CRDe is not coming/must not come. Mostly it will be CRDe version, but to cut cost I am not sure if Mahindra opts for non CRDe.

But as this car, as I hope it comes out to be MPV or MUV and not SUV to challenge Innova, is gunning for Innova, it has to perform better and be as refined as Innova. Innova is an excellent machine with excellent comfort and refinement. Great long distance cruiser ( my father covered Delhi to A'bad in one day ). To challenge this car the powertrain will have to be better than 2.6 ltr one. 2.2 is light and more modern and hence fuel economy will go up, handling will be good. These are required to take fight to Innova. IMHO, Mahindra should not even consider launching this car with 2.6. Just 110-115bhp XLYO, refined, fuel efficient and then Innova will have a good comeptitor.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 00:39   #248
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Did someone notice that the XYLO will also be offered in a 4x4 version? Now that could be a smart catch all move. Considering that their Scorpio mHawk 4x4 is long time in the making (Getaway though has a 4x4 I believe) I wonder whether an MUV with 4x4 will not be a little strange?!
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Old 3rd November 2008, 00:53   #249
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The 2.2 mHawk has bore X stroke dimension of 85X96mm.
If this engine makes it into XLYO, then we will have a best combination of engine and car considering that XLYO will have better ( hopeufully ) aerodynamics and will be a bit lighter.
Surely IMO, this is the only motor that can take it to new level it wants to go. If 4X4 XLYO is going to be available, then Mahindra should sincerely stop Scorpio and name this car as new Scorpio. Scorpio has a good brand image and it will better for this car to capitalize on that.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 01:03   #250
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Originally Posted by Zappo View Post
Did someone notice that the XYLO will also be offered in a 4x4 version? Now that could be a smart catch all move. Considering that their Scorpio mHawk 4x4 is long time in the making (Getaway though has a 4x4 I believe) I wonder whether an MUV with 4x4 will not be a little strange?!
There was talk that transmission + differentials is the reason why the mHawk is not available in 4x4. The old Scorp was, because it developed less power (and more importantly, less torque). Wouldnt be surprised if the 4x4 Scorp's diffs came from CJ or MM heritage, but this is mere speculation based on the Scorp's heritage of CJ/MM chassis and mechanicals.

Therefore if this vehicle is indeed coming in with the old Scorp engine, it should be possible for them to bring out a 4x4 version. However, like Zappo says, whats the point of a 4x4 van????

Last edited by Steeroid : 3rd November 2008 at 01:04.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 01:11   #251
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Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
Wouldnt be surprised if the 4x4 Scorp's diffs came from CJ or MM heritage, but this is mere speculation based on the Scorp's heritage of CJ/MM chassis and mechanicals.
Nope, the Scorpio 4x4 does not have a live axle in the front as in the CJ or MM.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 12:11   #252
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Originally Posted by salvation View Post
i saw ingenio in shimla yesterday!! they didnot allow me to take pictures but still i managed to take out 3 photographs from my mobile. From the looks it has a aerodynamic shape as that of innova .
From outside
It has typical Mahindra grill with chrome in the centre like that of new bolero. Headlights are big and curved (Kinda SX4 type) as shown in the artists impression on first page.
All in all it looks huge , height and width is simmilar to that of scorpio.
Well in center there is a curvature where grill and bonnet meet simmilar to that of impression.
Does that look good? well according to me No! Reason : Sleekness and slantness of bonnet when meets this awkward huge jeep type mahindra grill it really looks awkward along with design of headlights compounding the problem.
They have tried too much on this front part. Had they kept it simple and smaller grill like innova it would have been much better.
From back it looks nice with Back lights are around 18" long with indicators on top.
From inside
Its huge with ample legroom on all fronts. I like the dashboard and music system is integerated and with in drivers reach unlike earlier mahindra boleros.Cant comment on the upholstery as it was a test vehicle. i couldnot see whether there was a.c vents provided in back row as it was covered.
Engine
Person driving the muv wasnt forthcoming on specs. All he told me that it will have detuned engine and engine is not the same as that of scorpio.
When i asked which engine you are talking about scorpio 2.6 or 2.2 same answer: i cannot divuldge. But my feeling is that it will have scorpio 2.2 ltr engine with may be 90-100 bhp for better fuel efficiency.

It is going to be launched within 3 months and definitely will be priced in between bolero and scorpio. It is going to cater mainly to taxi segment as Mahindra doesnot have any proper taxi vehicle.

nice preview.. but if you managed to clicke some from your cellfone then why dont you post them here.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 16:40   #253
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hi,

I have a friend in M&M who informed me that eagle alias m-hawk engine is actually developed for Ingenio or XYLO now....I have an m-hawk and also an Crde SLX, must admit that the m-hawk is close by 70% of behaving liken an SUV>engine/suspensions etc.
If M & M wants XYLO to be successful, they need to ensure the internal fitment quality is way above what they are now offering in any of their products.
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Old 4th November 2008, 15:46   #254
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saw the two xylo's, the same ones which i spotted earlier at Bandra, this time i saw them zooming on LBS road Kurla this morning, wanted to take the pics but unfortunately the Signal was Green and they didnt stop. But those were the same 2 which i saw earlier.
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Old 5th November 2008, 18:25   #255
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to be launched by 15th december....for sure!
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