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Old 10th September 2008, 11:27   #31
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Originally Posted by amit View Post
What I find hypocritical is that many of us were commenting that the the Linea with the 1.3L 90hp MJD would be underpowered but are hailing Maruti for giving us the SX4 with the same engine! Many of us even said that paying 10 lacs for a 1.3L engined car isn't justified but are willing to get in line and wait for months for a similarly sized and priced car from Maruti.
he he he. Thats the confidence Maruti has imbibed in their customers. Even you have a Maruti, right ?
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Old 10th September 2008, 13:48   #32
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Originally Posted by amit View Post
What I find hypocritical is that many of us were commenting that the the Linea with the 1.3L 90hp MJD would be underpowered but are hailing Maruti for giving us the SX4 with the same engine! Many of us even said that paying 10 lacs for a 1.3L engined car isn't justified but are willing to get in line and wait for months for a similarly sized and priced car from Maruti.
Very good point . However, I do think that this is not hypocrisy from such people, but they are responding based on the perceptions that the different brands have created in their minds. The fiat will probably also be a better engineered car, as you have pointed out, but the respective companies are fully responsible for the perceptions that have been created - right or wrong.
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Old 10th September 2008, 15:03   #33
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1.3 l DDIS would mean good mileage !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 10th September 2008, 15:23   #34
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If this news is true, then it will be an all-out diesel war between the top 3 diesel sellers in sedan/hatchbacks ( Maruti, Hyundai & Ford)

However, i personally dont like the looks of the SX4, wish they lower the GC and make it leaner to make it more appealing. It is way to high and way to fat at the moment.

However, as someone right said, when they are taking over 6 months to deliver SwiftD, then they have to launch this on war-footing. Probably expand their manafacturing facility multi-folds and improve SCM to deliver them to customers in the fastest possible time.
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Old 11th September 2008, 00:53   #35
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Originally Posted by amit View Post
What I find hypocritical is that many of us were commenting that the the Linea with the 1.3L 90hp MJD would be underpowered but are hailing Maruti for giving us the SX4 with the same engine! Many of us even said that paying 10 lacs for a 1.3L engined car isn't justified but are willing to get in line and wait for months for a similarly sized and priced car from Maruti.
Because we are paying for peace of mind, and assured quality. Not for a bunch of jokers who can't get their act together and sell us third-world stuff to begin with.
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Old 11th September 2008, 00:57   #36
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With the diesel shortages recently, i don't regret my dad's decision to buy the SX4 hot off the oven, so to speak. The car has given us good performance and fuel efficiency upto now. Folks who do city driving will prefer to buy the petrol version. My only apprehension is that the taxi trade will start buying the SX4 diesel.
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Old 11th September 2008, 01:37   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amit View Post
What I find hypocritical is that many of us were commenting that the the Linea with the 1.3L 90hp MJD would be underpowered but are hailing Maruti for giving us the SX4 with the same engine! Many of us even said that paying 10 lacs for a 1.3L engined car isn't justified but are willing to get in line and wait for months for a similarly sized and priced car from Maruti.
I am sure the sx4 will be lighter than the linea.
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Old 11th September 2008, 02:30   #38
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Their son is doing engineering at IIT Delhi and was a head of the project for devloping the Sports car by students, which won last year at the Silverstone circuit
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Originally Posted by nitrous View Post
OT:
When did this happen?

Sports car+ Silverstone = Formula Student(British version of Formula SAE)
If your IIT friend is talking about this then he is surely bluffing. According to theFormula Student2008 website IIT Delhi is participating for the first time this year.

Last edited by revvedup : 11th September 2008 at 02:31.
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Old 11th September 2008, 02:41   #39
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OT: but please bear with me, as exciting as this news was i am equally skeptical about the Gear Box that would be provided for the sx4, it definitely cant be the swiftD's GB, and the initial lots would have to be released and tested for the GB problems, at least maruti has been proved to be notorious in this section with its never ending quest to find ways to cut costs.

i sincerely hope they dont mess things up this time if at all they launch the sx4D, and provide us with a equally good GB and Clutch, after all its gonna have to be released with a VGT so man god help maruthi and sx4's initial customers.
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Old 11th September 2008, 10:21   #40
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Originally Posted by v1p3r View Post
Because we are paying for peace of mind, and assured quality. Not for a bunch of jokers who can't get their act together and sell us third-world stuff to begin with.
You mean like how Honda manufactures and sells the City only for third world countries? How Maruti sells the M800 and Omni only in third world countries like ours? And how Toyota is developing a small car exclusively for third world countries like ours?

By the way, since when were Linea and GP developed and sold only in third world countries?

The hypocrisy on the Linea and SX4 diesel threads is loud and clear to me. What's even more amazing is how people are out of justify their double standards.

As for paying for assured quality, search the forum for problems in the Swift and SX4.
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Old 11th September 2008, 23:26   #41
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You mean like how Honda manufactures and sells the City only for third world countries? How Maruti sells the M800 and Omni only in third world countries like ours?
Actually, the City was sold in Hong Kong, Singapore, as well as certain Middle Eastern countries. And the 800 was sold in Japan, and the Omni was sold in the West. They have outlived their lifespans abroad but we continue to exhibit a demand for them that makes them economically viable. The Fiat Palio, on the other hand, was developed exclusively for Third World countries. You won't find one in Italy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by amit
By the way, since when were Linea and GP developed and sold only in third world countries?
We'll start talking when they ACTUALLY begin to sell them here. This has got to be the longest delayed launch ever.

Quote:
Originally Posted by amit
As for paying for assured quality, search the forum for problems in the Swift and SX4.
I bought a Swift diesel, and I own a Baleno as well. Before which there have been an assortment of Esteems, 800s, OHCs. None of them have every failed me, through hundreds of thousands of kilometres. Someone known to me bought an Adventure at the same time as my Swift, and has already sold it off (at a considerable loss) because it is as reliable as a drunk, blind weatherman.
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Old 11th September 2008, 23:41   #42
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OT:
Quote:
Originally Posted by v1p3r
The Fiat Palio, on the other hand, was developed exclusively for Third World
countries. You won't find one in Italy.
Now I know why I couldn't find EBC brake pads for the Palio when I could find the same for a Tata Sumo and safari.
Ref:http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/modifi...e-upgrade.html (Palio Brake Upgrade)
OT2:

Quote:
Originally Posted by revvedup
Sports car+ Silverstone = Formula Student(British version of Formula SAE)
If your IIT friend is talking about this then he is surely bluffing. According to theFormula Student2008 website IIT Delhi is participating for the first time this year
Thanks for the info,bro.
I knew a Formula Student car from India winning is far far away.
I watched an FSAE project by a very prestigious institute of our country and I could only sigh...

Last edited by nitrous : 11th September 2008 at 23:47.
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Old 12th September 2008, 08:42   #43
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The hypocrisy on the Linea and SX4 diesel threads is loud and clear to me. What's even more amazing is how people are out of justify their double standards.
No, Amit, I still don't see any double standards here. Fiat is a fringe player in our country. The last I checked, it had 0.3% market share as compared to 44.1% of Maruti. And yet,yet, we have multiple threads in this forum on Fiat's future launches. It is quite amazing how much Fiat gets discussed, given the fact it is currently almost non-existent in terms of sales and inspite of all the negative perceptions that exist about the brand in India. I see eager, enthusiastic people in this forum hoping that Fiat will make a big splash and hoping that they will bring in their great cars and back it up with good service.
If a 1.3 L SX4 diesel generating 90 BHP does not cause a murmur, but a Fiat diesel with 90 BHP does, then it is because people expect more from Fiat in terms of performance. That should be considered a positive thing. And the Linea is a car with Civic dimensions, right?
Maruti has an image of a mass market car. Fiat has an image of a performance car. It cannot have a mass market image with 0.3% market share. If it wants to become a mass market car, it has a lot of work to do.
And Fiat has not convinced me that it doing enough to dispel rumours and negative perceptions. I can understand Honda being cagey about the new city launch date- they have existing stocks to clear. Fiat has no stocks to push out. Then, why, pray, we don't have an exact date? Hell, even Toyota gave us a precise date for Altis, when they had stocks of Corolla to push out. Why does Fiat have details of Bravo on their website and no details on Linea or GP? What is going to drive volumes for them - Bravo? Fiat 500?
Maybe, India is not a key market for Fiat. Maybe, Fiat wants to take it slow & steady in India. Afterall, Fiat Corporation is just about back in black after being in the red for some years.
But double standards - no sir! I am still amazed that the Linea and GP launches have generated as much enthusiasm in this forum as the new city launch!
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Old 12th September 2008, 09:34   #44
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Originally Posted by sridharps View Post
No, Amit, I still don't see any double standards here. Fiat is a fringe player in our country. The last I checked, it had 0.3% market share as compared to 44.1% of Maruti. And yet,yet, we have multiple threads in this forum on Fiat's future launches. It is quite amazing how much Fiat gets discussed, given the fact it is currently almost non-existent in terms of sales and inspite of all the negative perceptions that exist about the brand in India. I see eager, enthusiastic people in this forum hoping that Fiat will make a big splash and hoping that they will bring in their great cars and back it up with good service.
If a 1.3 L SX4 diesel generating 90 BHP does not cause a murmur, but a Fiat diesel with 90 BHP does, then it is because people expect more from Fiat in terms of performance. That should be considered a positive thing. And the Linea is a car with Civic dimensions, right?
Maruti has an image of a mass market car. Fiat has an image of a performance car. It cannot have a mass market image with 0.3% market share. If it wants to become a mass market car, it has a lot of work to do.
And Fiat has not convinced me that it doing enough to dispel rumours and negative perceptions. I can understand Honda being cagey about the new city launch date- they have existing stocks to clear. Fiat has no stocks to push out. Then, why, pray, we don't have an exact date? Hell, even Toyota gave us a precise date for Altis, when they had stocks of Corolla to push out. Why does Fiat have details of Bravo on their website and no details on Linea or GP? What is going to drive volumes for them - Bravo? Fiat 500?
Maybe, India is not a key market for Fiat. Maybe, Fiat wants to take it slow & steady in India. Afterall, Fiat Corporation is just about back in black after being in the red for some years.
But double standards - no sir! I am still amazed that the Linea and GP launches have generated as much enthusiasm in this forum as the new city launch!
A very thoughtful writeup, Sridhar. I would agree with most points you have mentioned. But about the enthusiasm generated about GP and Linea, I guess, would be because of the car expected to be good and priced well. If one of these two parameters fails, that is it, they will be failure. If it is good car and priced well, it will sell good enough in spite of all other negative factors (my opinion). And there is no denying that so many people are betting on multijet engines. But it is not just engines. People are betting on the cars overall.

One more thing, if GM starts selling multijet diesel engines in their cars, it can take away pretty good share from Fiat, in addition to what Maruti and Tata will take away.
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Old 12th September 2008, 10:51   #45
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A very thoughtful writeup, Sridhar. I would agree with most points you have mentioned. But about the enthusiasm generated about GP and Linea, I guess, would be because of the car expected to be good and priced well.
Opendro, thanks. I am as much a Fiat enthusiast and am eagerly awaiting the launch of Linea. As you say, if it satisfies the 2 parameters, I would definitely buy it over a SX4 diesel.
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