Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > The Indian Car Scene


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 3rd October 2008, 20:21   #436
Senior - BHPian
 
aaggoswami's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Vadodara
Posts: 4,675
Thanked: 1,426 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlokSriva View Post
Am not sure what is the basis of your comment on FE of Fiesta.. my petrol 1.6 Fiesta returns minimum of 11-11.5 kmpl in city driving (bangalore's). Please don't take shots in air..

I have seen that Fiesta 1.6 in A'bad and Rajkot ( where my relatives own this car and find A.S & S. good ) the car delivers the same efficiency as you have mentioned. And father's boss 77bhp G2HC delivers 13-13.5 kmpl in the same cities.
So it is a good enough gain.

And from my above reply I meant that the fuel efficiency might go down from G2HC's good levels down to the level of SX4 and Fiesta. Both, SX4 and Fiesta owners have in general reported around 11-12kmpl in city driving.

And fuel efficiency depends upon many things. So I was not blaming Fiesta in short.
My basic point is still the same. The high specific output Honda motors are not able to deliver bottom end juice, so this results in poor fuel efficiency for city driving. Accord, despite having a relatively ( by Indian standards ) has big motor, still from 2K rpm to 4K rpm, G2HC VTEC feels faster.

But here, both Accord and Civic are not having long stroke engines, but G3HC has a very long stroke engine, so the torque delivery might not be a problem, but owing to some weight increase, there might be a drop in fuel efficiency.
This is same as G13 and G16 offered by Suzuki. Baleno has great toruqe, but Swift/Esteem and Original Zen are famous for poor bottom end torque.
aaggoswami is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd October 2008, 22:19   #437
BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: goa
Posts: 981
Thanked: 43 Times
Default

Was just looking through the specs and prices of the G3HC and the SX4.

Ex-showroom Goa for SMT version is 8.35L, while SX4Zxi with leather is at 7.66. I believe it has everything the SMT has, and more, leather seats/steering, alloys, 6-spk CD system, climate control.

Now I took my own running as the base.
Assuming 14kpl for the Honda, and 11 kpl for the SX4, running 15000km per year, the Honda will make more economic sense after almost 5 years, by which time I would be ready to sell the car.
filcord is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 02:56   #438
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Mpower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 10,432
Thanked: 1,682 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Su-47 View Post
What's EPS?
I know of EPS as Electric Power Steering. Does the HPS pump put so much load on the engine that it affects FE figures?
Yup, same EPS. No other reason for switching to EPS but FE. Everyone is doing it. Good for at least 1-2 mpg.
Mpower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 10:11   #439
BHPian
 
jerish666's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Trivandrum,Kochi,Trissur
Posts: 757
Thanked: Once
Default

In the sept Autocar India issue TD of ANHC they mentioned the tyre is 175/65 R15 and rear they mentioned is 285/35 R18.What does that mean?
jerish666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 10:44   #440
GTO
Team-BHP Support
 
GTO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 47,705
Thanked: 89,029 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jerish666 View Post
What does that mean?
That means its a misprint.
GTO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 10:51   #441
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 3,717
Thanked: 425 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
SX4 owners have in general reported around 11-12kmpl in city driving.
That's too high a figure. I have a feeling that the figures are being inflated by the owners for whatever reason.

In my SX4's case,

-single person.
-70% highway driving.
-Driven normally. Not focussing entirely on FE and not focussing entirely on redlining the car in every gear.
-A/C on 100%
-Tyre pressure at 28psi all round. (Against recommended 33psi)

It's been 11 months of driving the car now. Best average monthly FE was 12.65kmpl in Feb 2008 and worst was 10.80kmpl in June 08.

Driven similarly, my Palio S10's best performance has been 12.73kmpl in Feb 07 and worst of 11.61 in November 06. Palio's air pressure is maintained at 26psi against the recommended 29psi.

Having said that, when comparing mileage between the other C segment sedans and SX4, we have to take into account the poorer aerodynamics of the SX4 due to it's height and the bigger 16" tyres in the Zxi variant too.
amit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 11:00   #442
BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: goa
Posts: 981
Thanked: 43 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by amit View Post
That's too high a figure. I have a feeling that the figures are being inflated by the owners for whatever reason.

In my SX4's case, . . .
-Tyre pressure at 28psi all round. (Against recommended 33psi)

It's been 11 months of driving the car now. Best average monthly FE was 12.65kmpl in Feb 2008 and worst was 10.80kmpl in June 08.
Your tyre pressure is much much too low, and potentially very dangerous if you drive at above 60 kph for long periods of time, as the constant flexing of the soft tyre can lead to a blow-out. Besides which your mileage will suffer by at least 1.5-2 kpl. Always use at least the recommended pressure, and you can even go to 35 psi without any issues (except the ride of course).

Last edited by filcord : 4th October 2008 at 11:01.
filcord is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 11:13   #443
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Goa
Posts: 417
Thanked: 4 Times
Default

One other thing about tyre pressure. I always used to fill air via the digital filling air station that they have at the Indian oil pumps. I recently picked up a digital pressure gauge and found that the petrol pump filling stations gauge was miscallibrated and there was an actual difference of 5PSI. So if I filled 30 PSI at the pump, it was actually 25PSI. Darn, it really helps to have your own pressure gauge.
autoenthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 11:26   #444
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 2,376
Thanked: 528 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by amit View Post
when comparing mileage between the other C segment sedans and SX4, we have to take into account the poorer aerodynamics of the SX4 due to it's height and the bigger 16" tyres in the Zxi variant too.
Effective outside dia of the tyres would be same across all variants irrespective of the rim size. IMO wheel diameter doesnt have influence on FE anyway but the tyre width would have.
Guna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 12:13   #445
Team-BHP Support
 
Eddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Delhi
Posts: 7,398
Thanked: 4,669 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by autoenthusiast View Post
One other thing about tyre pressure. I always used to fill air via the digital filling air station that they have at the Indian oil pumps. I recently picked up a digital pressure gauge and found that the petrol pump filling stations gauge was miscallibrated and there was an actual difference of 5PSI. So if I filled 30 PSI at the pump, it was actually 25PSI. Darn, it really helps to have your own pressure gauge.
But how do you ensure that your own gauge is correct, especially if it is some unbranded chinese ones ?

Edit: I don't mean that yours is a local one, I was talking about the ones flooding the markets.
Eddy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 14:01   #446
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 55
Thanked: 0 Times
Default

Post edited by the Team-BHP Support : Please do NOT use more than 2 smilies per post.

We advise you to visit our board rules section before proceeding any further.


Pray tell me why do these foreign car companies shortchange the Indian consumer and why do we meekly accept.

Like these photographs evidently portray that Honda is no exception to that fact, the new Honda City sold elsewhere indeed does come with Climate Control and some additional buttons on the steering wheel (amongst the first few things that struck me, I haven’t scrutinized and compared it in detail with the Indian variant and I am sure there will be many more differences).

Isn’t the Indian consumer good enough for them or isn’t or money good enough??? Sheer bias and truly unfair trade practice…

Previously many companies have modified their engine capacities to qualify as a small car and avail the nonsensical small car classification passed by the Finance Ministry a couple of years ago but this approach is honestly prejudicial. At least have the decency to launch a model in its entirety and then let the consumer decide if they would like to pay for the same.

I can cite several examples on various car companies that shortchange the Indian consumer but as this is a Honda City thread and I think I have managed to convey my point across and I will stop here. Seems like Honda is extending this bias to most Asian countries as these pictures are for a left-hand drive City signifying it to be an European speck variant.

And to think that we were naÔve enough to believe that Honda were (finally) offering us a state of the art, complete, Internationally specked car whereas in actuality they are selling us a car just as per their whims and fancies. Whilst a feature like Climate Control or additional steering wheel mounted control buttons might not seem much as compared to perhaps say if they were shortchanging us with a lower grade engine – it’s the matter of principal that counts.

Point is can and will we do anything about this???
Attached Thumbnails
EDIT: Now Launched :All New Honda city (Indian version)-full specs & features .-hondacity_2009_1600x1200_wallpaper_06.jpg  

EDIT: Now Launched :All New Honda city (Indian version)-full specs & features .-hondacity_2009_1600x1200_wallpaper_07.jpg  

EDIT: Now Launched :All New Honda city (Indian version)-full specs & features .-hondacity_2009_1600x1200_wallpaper_08.jpg  

EDIT: Now Launched :All New Honda city (Indian version)-full specs & features .-hondacity_2009_1600x1200_wallpaper_09.jpg  


Last edited by GTO : 4th October 2008 at 15:11.
freddie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 14:13   #447
Senior - BHPian
 
GeekSrik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,279
Thanked: 8 Times
Default

is this thread digressing from original topic?
GeekSrik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 16:25   #448
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Goa
Posts: 417
Thanked: 4 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddy View Post
But how do you ensure that your own gauge is correct, especially if it is some unbranded chinese ones ?

Edit: I don't mean that yours is a local one, I was talking about the ones flooding the markets.
Well this one is a branded digital pressure gauge that I picked on my trip to the US.
autoenthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 16:29   #449
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Goa
Posts: 417
Thanked: 4 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by freddie View Post
Pray tell me why do these foreign car companies shortchange the Indian consumer and why do we meekly accept.

Like these photographs evidently portray that Honda is no exception to that fact, the new Honda City sold elsewhere indeed does come with Climate Control and some additional buttons on the steering wheel (amongst the first few things that struck me, I havenít scrutinized and compared it in detail with the Indian variant and I am sure there will be many more differences).
Hello Freddie, the way I look at it, Honda tried to keep the cost of the new model within reasonable limits. It's still a pretty good package, though a bit of a premium charged for it. Knowing Honda, 2 years down the line they would launch an anniversary edition or an updated version with all those features (ACC, Alloy Wheels etc..).
autoenthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 18:07   #450
oss
BHPian
 
oss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Chennai
Posts: 683
Thanked: 4 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by freddie View Post
Pray tell me why do these foreign car companies shortchange the Indian consumer and why do we meekly accept.

Like these photographs evidently portray that Honda is no exception to that fact, the new Honda City sold elsewhere indeed does come with Climate Control and some additional buttons on the steering wheel (amongst the first few things that struck me, I haven’t scrutinized and compared it in detail with the Indian variant and I am sure there will be many more differences).

Isn’t the Indian consumer good enough for them or isn’t or money good enough??? Sheer bias and truly unfair trade practice…
It's not just the auto climate control; it also has all wheel disc brakes, alloys ofcourse and fog lamps in the front.

I can't buy the cost argument as the Indian versions are no cheaper. For the price that is demanded, i think these should come as standard fitment.

We can't really do much as there is not much of competition for City in this segment, and that's what helps them in taking us for a ride
Attached Thumbnails
EDIT: Now Launched :All New Honda city (Indian version)-full specs & features .-hondacity_2009_1024x768_wallpaper_02.jpg  

EDIT: Now Launched :All New Honda city (Indian version)-full specs & features .-hondacity_2009_1024x768_wallpaper_04.jpg  


Last edited by oss : 4th October 2008 at 18:11.
oss is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Windows XP SP3 Rc version released. EDIT : Full Version now released. JPL Gadgets, Computers & Software 40 27th January 2012 17:02
Tata Aria : Driving Impressions. EDIT : FULL specs, features & variants on page 18 FlyingSpur The Indian Car Scene 526 12th October 2010 00:51
New Nissan Micra : Full details & specs. EDIT - Launch on 14th July! sidindica The Indian Car Scene 374 28th June 2010 17:34
Facelifted Honda city launched -Possible changes for Indian version rahul_intlad The International Automotive Scene 23 14th August 2008 13:49
Maruti Suzuki to unveil new version of SUV (New Vitara) EDIT: Now Launched rangaraj The Indian Car Scene 239 15th July 2007 00:22


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 15:56.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks