Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > The Indian Car Scene


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12th May 2013, 11:39   #1201
Distinguished - BHPian
 
supremeBaleno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Weekdays@Chennai, Weekends@Kerala
Posts: 5,164
Thanked: 1,638 Times
Default Re: Rationalising diesel prices. *Update: 50p rise/month announced*

Quote:
Originally Posted by hrman
Diesel -petrol price difference in Chennai is approx Rs.12
Hopefully the day might not be far when they will be priced at par. As they should rightly be, instead of the supposedly-subsidised-for-transportation-and-agriculture diesel being used by anything from the Beat to the Merc. Will possibly also help people value the fuel more and helping judicious usage.

Last edited by supremeBaleno : 12th May 2013 at 11:45.
supremeBaleno is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2013, 12:04   #1202
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,457
Thanked: 281 Times
Default Re: Rationalising diesel prices. *Update: 50p rise/month announced*

Quote:
Originally Posted by selfdrive View Post
The tax structure on petrol and diesel is different. To achieve parity in pricing, the taxes need to be similar regardless of same production costs
So either diesel should be taxed more or petrol should be taxed less.
carboy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2013, 12:29   #1203
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: BBS/TVM
Posts: 175
Thanked: 53 Times
Default Re: Rationalising diesel prices. *Update: 50p rise/month announced*

Quote:
Originally Posted by supremeBaleno View Post
Hopefully the day might not be far when they will be priced at par.
Will the price of the vehicles will also then be equal or that is a different matter ?
stringbh is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2013, 14:56   #1204
Newbie
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Chennai
Posts: 17
Thanked: 7 Times
Default Re: Rationalising diesel prices. *Update: 50p rise/month announced*

Quote:
Originally Posted by hrman View Post
Diesel -petrol price difference in Chennai is approx 12 Rs. In Bangalore is approx 15 Rs.

I will stick to Shell diesel from my last fill. Difference of Rs.3.5 between Govt. and Shell Diesel is worth it in every way!
The difference is absolutely worth it. I normally tank up my Figo at an IOC outlet in Chennai. The last time I tanked up at shell since I was running out of fuel. The car returned an impressive 2KMPL more than the regular mileage. I am seriously considering switching permanently to Shell.
n.ananth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2013, 16:12   #1205
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,457
Thanked: 281 Times
Default Re: Rationalising diesel prices. *Update: 50p rise/month announced*

Quote:
Originally Posted by stringbh View Post
Will the price of the vehicles will also then be equal or that is a different matter ?
Diesel engines cost more to manufacture than petrol.
carboy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2013, 17:19   #1206
srh
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 339
Thanked: 139 Times
Default Re: Rationalising diesel prices. *Update: 50p rise/month announced*

Quote:
Originally Posted by carboy View Post
Diesel engines cost more to manufacture than petrol.
Diesel engines do cost more to make, but the additional cost to make is much lesser than the premium that manufacturers charge for diesel cars. I remember some M&M internal presentation which was put up on TBHP. It mentioned that the whole 1.5 ltr engine in the Quanto cost ~75000 to make. Most car manufacturers price diesel cars atleast ~100000 over the petrol. Does that mean the petrol engine is made at 0 cost?
srh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2013, 17:27   #1207
BHPian
 
hrman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 914
Thanked: 359 Times
Default Re: Rationalising diesel prices. *Update: 50p rise/month announced*

Quote:
Originally Posted by carboy View Post
Diesel engines cost more to manufacture than petrol.
That may be true, what with the national Engine- FIAT 1.3 multijet commanding some royalty too. But in any case, it is surely not equal to the price difference being quoted by manufacturers. Once the prices of both fuels are brought down to a very marginal level, this practice from the manufacturers will end too.
I recall when Skoda Octavia was launched, the price difference between the petrol and diesel vehicle was non-existent.
hrman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2013, 17:30   #1208
Senior - BHPian
 
shankar.balan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: BLR
Posts: 8,027
Thanked: 5,325 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hrman View Post
I saw in the news article that after the latest increase, now the Oil companies have an under recovery of Rs.3/- per litre on Diesel. This is at current prices of crude and dollar exchange rate.
At this rate, sel car in 2012, the gap was Rs.34/- per litre (Rs.45 for diesel v/s Rs.79 for petrol). A lot of water has flown below the bridge since. At current prices, it HO.
I have been using Diesel since 2005 and I have seen the way the price has quite literally 'doubled' and 'tripled' over these last several years. However I think that I have taken my money's worth out of the diesel cars I ve owned since 2005.
I think that parity in pricing is the only way forward but this should be achieved by reducing some of the taxes and making the price the same all across India. The power to levy tax on fuel should be withdrawn from states and controlled only by the centre.
shankar.balan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2013, 17:39   #1209
Senior - BHPian
 
cool_dube's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,183
Thanked: 368 Times
Default Re: Rationalising diesel prices. *Update: 50p rise/month announced*

Going by this, sales for petrol cars should pick up and those for diesels should go down, which in turn is good for the environment as petrol cars pollute lesser than their oil-burner counterparts. High time that car manufacturers stop charging a undue premium for diesel cars.
cool_dube is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2013, 18:20   #1210
Senior - BHPian
 
oxyzen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Not fixed.
Posts: 1,026
Thanked: 265 Times
Default Re: Rationalising diesel prices. *Update: 50p rise/month announced*

Quote:
Originally Posted by cool_dube View Post
Going by this, sales for petrol cars should pick up and those for diesels should go down, which in turn is good for the environment as petrol cars pollute lesser than their oil-burner counterparts.
Cant say that so easily. While diesels do generate NOx and PM, Petrol generate more CO2 and HC. And today, GDi engines produce about as much soot as a diesel engine. It is a big debate regaring what is more polluting.


Quote:
Originally Posted by cool_dube View Post
High time that car manufacturers stop charging a undue premium for diesel cars.
Diesel engines cost a lot more than Naturally aspirated petrol engine I assure you. It is not just the cost of the additional turbocharger and the intercooler, the whole engine has to be re-designed. To start with, it needs heavier pistons, conrods, cylinder blocks. Most diesel engines have better honed cylinder bore surface to reduce oil consumption. They use Hydraulic lash adjusters instead of rockers/tappets. The Intake is more complicated. Oil circuit needs to be extended to turbocharger. There are requirements of Mechanical fuel pump which weighs a ton. Then there is a vacuum pump which is not needed in NA Petrol engines. The flywheel is heavier. In come cases a dual mass flywheel is used. Even the engine mounts are hydraulic and more expensive.
oxyzen is offline   (3) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 13th May 2013, 10:47   #1211
Senior - BHPian
 
Jignesh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Eindhoven, NL
Posts: 1,603
Thanked: 933 Times
Default Re: Rationalising diesel prices. *Update: 50p rise/month announced*

Quote:
Originally Posted by hrman View Post
At current prices, it does not make sense going for a diesel vehicle only for cost savings. As per my estimates, the fuel cost per km between Petrol and diesel is in the region of Rs.2/- per km. You need to run the car for 80000 kms
Hello Hrman,

Exactly that is what the car buyers could never predict. Even the car manufacturers could not predict this & we have seen most of them increasing Diesel car capacities in India.

Not before six months, most of us believed that Diesel prices will not increase before 2014 general elections due to common man factor. This led to huge demand for Small diesel cars (due to potential savings as difference in Petrol & Diesel was huge) & wait for popular cars like Swift diesel was almost 4 - 5 months.

Finally what you have said it absolutely correct, given the current fuel prices, it does not makes sense to buy a diesel car, only from savings perspective.

Thanks,
Jignesh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th May 2013, 11:43   #1212
BHPian
 
gomzi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 783
Thanked: 125 Times
Default Re: Rationalising diesel prices. *Update: 50p rise/month announced*

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jignesh View Post
Finally what you have said it absolutely correct, given the current fuel prices, it does not makes sense to buy a diesel car, only from savings perspective.
This is probably exactly what someone with no preference for either fuel and a handy calculator will conclude.

I do think demand for diesel powered vehicles will go down, but I think it will be a gradual slowdown, and not a steep drop away from diesel to petrol. Reason being the perception of diesel powered cars as cheap to fuel up. Just to add to this perception is the fact that diesel engines give better mileage which will still pull in buyers.
I've seen friends and relatives with low car usage per month plonking money on diesel cars just so that each tankful is cheaper on the wallet. This perception that diesel cars have created will still see good % of buyers towards diesel variants atleast for some time to come.

The manufacturers will wake up too and start offering discounts on diesel variants to keep sales going and recover investment costs. I read on another thread about Rs. 1L discounts being offered on Micra in Banglore (IIRC). Coupled with lower overall sales, I would not be surprised to see such discounts becoming mainstream on diesel variants.
gomzi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th May 2013, 11:56   #1213
Distinguished - BHPian
 
sgiitk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Kanpur
Posts: 7,160
Thanked: 3,755 Times
Default Re: Rationalising diesel prices. *Update: 50p rise/month announced*

I have a feeling that the change over point, where a Diesel car becomes a better value will shift back to the 20,000km/annum region in due course. One is assuming that the Govt sticks to its policy of eventually deregulating diesel like petrol.
sgiitk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th May 2013, 12:30   #1214
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: BBS/TVM
Posts: 175
Thanked: 53 Times
Default Re: Rationalising diesel prices. *Update: 50p rise/month announced*

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgiitk View Post
Diesel car becomes a better value will shift back to the 20,000km/annum.
Sir, I have my doubts on this, but, i am inexperienced compared to you !

This is all assuming that petrol - diesel parity will remain the way it is; which we do not know for sure. It might remain like this till next general elections. Market conditions are never predictable. One more war, $ fluctuation and petrol shoots up; didn't we think it will go up to 100? Ultimately, it is what you can bet on, keeping long term prospects in mind (not just the current situation). Diesel deregulation seems like an election gimmick for now. My 2 cents.

(OT: good time to buy polo 1.2 Tsi !)
stringbh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th May 2013, 12:33   #1215
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,457
Thanked: 281 Times
Default Re: Rationalising diesel prices. *Update: 50p rise/month announced*

Quote:
Originally Posted by stringbh View Post
Diesel deregulation seems like an election gimmick for now.
Hmm. It was generally believed that diesel non-regulation was a populist measure - i.e. an election gimmick of sorts.
carboy is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Swift Diesel, Saga continues. The DIESEL experience! Part II 72k kms Update Page 182. Now SOLD! Jaggu Long-Term Ownership Reviews 2988 21st September 2017 11:10
BMW to drop prices due to increased localisation. EDIT: New prices announced Aditya The Indian Car Scene 38 10th July 2015 21:19
Hyundai Cut prices- New detailed prices. harry10 The Indian Car Scene 5 9th December 2008 00:45
Are these good prices for Tata\Fiat vehicles? Corporate Offer Prices sahakar The Indian Car Scene 15 8th July 2008 23:03


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 19:06.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks