Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > The Indian Car Scene


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12th April 2005, 22:29   #31
Senior - BHPian
 
Deeps's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Delhi/Noida
Posts: 1,090
Thanked: 67 Times
Default

Don't have words to comment on your experience. GTO. It is sad to see a person's dream of owning a Merc turn into a nightmare even more so if the person (victim) is a Bhpian. Thankfully you have not had to pay anything out of your pocket....yet. I'd strongly suggest you sell the car before the warranty expires. Even MB can't claim that the owner is at fault here. I was a huge fan of MB until i got on team-bhp. All the threads and links about MB, i read. That convinced me that buying an MB now is just asking for trouble. However, i wouldn't condemn the Germans....just yet. BMW and Audi are still making great cars but their foundation and brand name isn't of the same standard as MB. It is high-time that MB get their act together if they want people like me and you to have faith in their products.
Deeps is offline  
Old 12th April 2005, 23:05   #32
Senior - BHPian
 
karthik247's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: BLR, HYD
Posts: 2,708
Thanked: 16 Times
Default

hey GTO, can't u sue MB for this...and aren't they supposed to give you a new car..well there was an article in autocar or overdrive that this lady had some probs with her merc's kompressor and since they couldn't fiz it....she got a brand new ccar as a replacement
karthik247 is offline  
Old 12th April 2005, 23:29   #33
Senior - BHPian
 
lamborghini's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 4,638
Thanked: 1,266 Times
Default

After reading this,
it seems that mercedes is trying to improve quality on the newer mercs but not all are as good.
I know of quite a few merc owners who swear by their car.
Go back to ACI or straight to DCIL.
lamborghini is offline  
Old 13th April 2005, 01:01   #34
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Mpower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 10,432
Thanked: 1,682 Times
Default

GTO, you are not alone and its not just MB India but in the US too. Ever since Mercedes started cramming electronic gadgets into their cars, things have been going crazy. Worst affected is the C-class.
I have 2 friends with C-Classes one with a C230K sportcoupe and another C240 sedan. Both have had very similar experienes with numerous visits to the dealership.
Here is a forum that for owners to vent frustration.

http://www.troublebenz.com/
Mpower is offline  
Old 13th April 2005, 01:31   #35
BHPian
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: delhi
Posts: 384
Thanked: 3 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by comfortablywacky
I guess most of the MNC's having operating in India over a period of time deteriorate in quality be it cars(Merc,Ford),appareal(Reebok,M&S) foods (Pepsi,Cadbury) just to name a few...[/b]
You are spot on , the quality standards maintained by most of the MNC's is way too low in india compared to the international markets and as you mentioned , its not just limited to the autos and thats because we heartly accept whatever comes our way .

GTO , you should raise this issue very strongly to DCIL . If possible , take one or two journalists(if there is any friend of yours) as i think its going to be a cracker of a news coz in india people aren't aware and think Merc as one of the most reliable cars and you ll see the diff for sure .

Though, its really said to hear .
Beemer is offline  
Old 13th April 2005, 01:48   #36
Team-BHP Support
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 7,315
Thanked: 23,888 Times
Default

Mercedes Benz is concentrating more on quantity rather than quality. That's proved by various surveys conducted all over the world. Unfortunately, the customers are at the receiving end of the stick.
But if you ask Indians, most will still say that Mercedes Benz is the last word in motoring. That's because MB's old cars so good that the mindset of the people was altered to think that way.
I know people who would take a BMW or an Audi over a Merc. Why others, I myself would take a Jaguar over a Merc 10 out of 10 times. But, just see how long have these rival manufacturers been threatening to enter our market without really taking any action. Meanwhile, Mercedes has been bold enough to not only be the first real luxury car manufacturer to step into India, but, also introduce all its cars (including the Maybach and CLS) in record time. Where are the others? Still deciding on where to locate their factories? So, till some of our "favourite" manufacturers actually build and sell their cars in India, MB will continue to have a monopoly and customers will continue to suffer.
Yes, Honda, Ford and Toyota have better cars, but you cannot expect them to compete with Mercedes Benz when it comes to snob value.
Aditya is offline  
Old 13th April 2005, 08:27   #37
Senior - BHPian
 
Revvmaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 1,186
Thanked: 45 Times
Default

Addy... i think its time we really did a reality check.

My conversations with Rudra over Mercedes and their strategies in India left me stunned. Did you know, Porsche India is selling twice its intended target. In the first year of sales alone. Audi has a setup that should rival Mercedes' in another 2-3 years. And to add to that, the new A6 and the A8 beat the pants out of the E and S class.

I don't even need to get to BMW... they are finalising a location (or have finalised) as we speak. Give them two years, since the new 3-series is already receiving rave reviews. Though Bentley, Ferrari and Alfa-Romeo are also in the picture (insignificantly), they too pose a threat. Your Jag babe is here in November. If I am DCIL today, i'd be extremely worried. But it seems that those who are DCIL aren't at all. You know what they say? We'll worry only from 2006 end onwards. Yeah?

Get this, the Cayenne will steal sales away from the S-class. Unbelievable but true. The A8 too will do the same. The 5-series and 3-series will create hell hath fury in the Mercedes showrooms. The Boxster will literally lick the SLK apart. And maybe the Z4 too will... someday. The Carrera S will just leave the SL500 in its wake. The 750 and 760 Li will make mincemeat outta the S500. The M-class is as good as dead.. the X5 and Cayenne will not let it survive here. Now tell me one car that will really do well from the Mercedes stable? Sure they have the 3-pointed star, but other than a great spread of service centres... they have nothing else going for them.

Not that companies like BMW and Audi are the epitome of quality. But if, after years, for the first time worldover, BMW will overtake Mercedes in terms of sales figures, it means BMW is doing something right that Mercedes ain't. I know of 7-series that conk-off on the highway at 90 mph, Z4s doing just the same. M3s whose engines have had to be changed twice in a 1,00,000 kms of use with no track-day use. Still they are doing well. Cuz they have better reliability levels than Mercs.. so to speak.

Right now, Mercedes needs a miracle to come out of its problems. 1.3 million cars getting recalled and not an apology from DC on their website? What kinda PR is this? Forget that, not even a mention to customers anywhere on their site to get their cars back. Ridiculous. I wonder how Rudra manages to serve an account such as this which has no concern for its customers. My sympathies to him.

Revvmaster
Revvmaster is offline  
Old 13th April 2005, 08:55   #38
BHPian
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: NO IDeA/Madurai
Posts: 236
Thanked: Once
Default

I don't think it's just in India - IIRC Merc's reliability ratings have fallen all over the world with BMW and Toyota being on top - VW is another manufacturer who's gone below average - but SKoda is stil near the top (I forgot which rankings these were - J.D Power US or worldwide - not sure)

shame about that GTO , to me 'German Car' and especially Mercedes were the best examples of high quality you could give , looks like things have changed.
(Our first car - a 77 VW beetle bought in 82 gave us over 3.5 lakhs Km before we sold it off - we did have plenty of electrical problems though. )
zaphod is offline  
Old 13th April 2005, 09:12   #39
Team-BHP Support
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 11,893
Thanked: 9,731 Times
Default

Some comments of RevvMaster's quotes:


"Audi has a setup that should rival Mercedes' in another 2-3 years. And to add to that, the new A6 and the A8 beat the pants out of the E and S class"

Only issue is that the dealer principals have no experience in retailing maintaining cars (Burman group). PS How do you repair an aluminium bodied Audi ?


"If I am DCIL today, i'd be extremely worried" Agreed
"But it seems that those who are DCIL aren't at all. You know what they say? We'll worry only from 2006 end onwards." Cannot comment - maybe CLS55 could comment as he is nearest the front line
"Get this, the Cayenne will steal sales away from the S-class" The Range rover is doing a better job of this

"Unbelievable but true. The A8 too will do the same" Depends on if they can get rid of the "poor mans mercedes/ overpriced VW" tag


"The 5-series and 3-series will create hell hath fury in the Mercedes showrooms" Agreed - but again Mercedes are slowly enhancing equipment levels in the E Class (sunroofs) / C Class - watch out for new engines and a new C Class shortly

"The Boxster will literally lick the SLK apart" Ones a cruiser, ones a bruiser - both very different

"And maybe the Z4 too will... someday" Outclassed by both so don't worry.

"The 750 and 760 Li will make mincemeat outta the S500". - Depends on pricing - S Class still has the advantage of space and presence. Remeber the S class have been with us since 1999, the BMw since 2001 Expect a new S Class in Frankfurt 2005


"The M-class is as good as dead." Oh no it is not - new one is pretty good all rounder
"the X5 and Cayenne will not let it survive here" - yes it will give competition but X5 is pretty cramped inside.

"Now tell me one car that will really do well from the Mercedes stable? Sure they have the 3-pointed star, but other than a great spread of service centres..." The Eclass is a pretty good car despite conservative looks. C Class has no competition at present but next gen should resolve it

"BMW will overtake Mercedes in terms of sales figures, it means BMW is doing something right that Mercedes ain't". " Product range is much younger than Mercedes also note that BMW include Mini which added 20% of its volume

"I know of 7-series that conk-off .................. Still they are doing well". Cuz they have better reliability levels than Mercs.." - More robust electronics and very good customer care


"Right now, Mercedes needs a miracle to come out of its problems. 1.3 million cars getting recalled and not an apology from DC on their website? " actually, it would be cheaper if they apologised and did nothing - I think actions speak louder than words. They have acknowledged that electronics are the key problem. The recall is more a pro-active corrective action than a problem resolution for the E-class. they could have quietly done this on the sly whern the car is being serviced but they came clean

"What kinda PR is this? ...............ywhere on their site to get their cars back" They contacted the customers directly. More precise and personal - why should they tarnish their name, also how many merc owners visit the website - I never visit the honda website except to see a new model

" I wonder how Rudra manages to serve an account such as this which has no concern for its customers." Other than GTO and some others mentioned, are you sure that 100 % of all customers are dissatisfied? Please note that 10 dissatisfied customers make 50 times more noise than 100 satisfied customers.

GTO and co are rightly aggrieved - You will note that warranty repairs have been done without a quibble however, Merc need to do more in terms of looking after existing customers. They are working towards making the product right - the newer cars A, M, SLK, CLS and E show that they are on the right path.

Last edited by ajmat : 13th April 2005 at 09:18.
ajmat is offline  
Old 13th April 2005, 10:01   #40
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Sahil's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 5,202
Thanked: 2,096 Times
Default

Whatever said and done....BMW will never be able to overtake Mercedes-Benz in India in terms of sale.... coz the Mercedes status for the indian mind is a league above BMW. Maybe not for many of us around here but it is for the generation above us. My dad would never buy a BMW for himself even though he has had a bad experience with the C, he is still willing to give Mercedes one more chance....Why? Coz thats what happens to most people once u r buy a merc u always keep one in the family, u might upgrade to the same model in a few years or move up with all goes well but u r start a new mission once u buy a mercedes which is move up from a C to an E and then aim for an S and so on.
Sahil is offline  
Old 13th April 2005, 10:03   #41
GTO
Team-BHP Support
 
GTO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 47,749
Thanked: 89,404 Times
Default

Quote:
Other than GTO and some others mentioned, are you sure that 100 % of all customers are dissatisfied? Please note that 10 dissatisfied customers make 50 times more noise than 100 satisfied customers.
Not a 100%, Ajmat. But I can assure you that its a majority...its significant enough for the company to lose its long time believers. Consumer reports, as you know, has its reviews majorly based on actual user feedback. They have ranked the Mercedes C/E/S Class as "an unreliable bad choice and strictly avoidable".

To add to what you said, a happy customer will probably bring one more in. But a disappointed customer will drive 10 others away.

GTO
GTO is offline  
Old 13th April 2005, 10:10   #42
GTO
Team-BHP Support
 
GTO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 47,749
Thanked: 89,404 Times
Default

Quote:
Maybe not for many of us around here but it is for the generation above us.
This is the future - That car manufacturers are focusing on. The next generation. Toyota was worried that the average age of its buyer was much higher than that of Honda. Thats why it has implemented marketing strategies aimed at a younger audience. Thats precisely why it launched the Scion brand.

GTO
GTO is offline  
Old 13th April 2005, 10:33   #43
BHPian
 
Scuderia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 127
Thanked: 5 Times
Default

Man.. this is really shocking


A brand such highly thought having such issues

A one-off case would still be accepted , but wid the info provided by GTO, it seems to be a habit


Dude, havent u demanded a replacement?

also, try to hilight it in the press.. if not times.. then atlst mid-day responds to such news...

it will defntly have some reactions

Hope something works out
Scuderia is offline  
Old 13th April 2005, 10:58   #44
Senior - BHPian
 
lamborghini's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 4,638
Thanked: 1,266 Times
Default

Guys,
i really think you should do something.
Press, ACI etc.
Revv, i think the e class will do very well in India.
And i have a feeling that once Audi is better known, it will get more buyers in India once the brand gets known.
I just wish they would launch the A4.
I still feel though that a mojority of mercedes buyers are happy.
Eg -
we are very happy,
Aveeks friend is happy,
But then again the problems are with the old C Class and Old E classes.
Maybe it has to do with the way its being used.
lamborghini is offline  
Old 13th April 2005, 12:04   #45
BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Singapore
Posts: 262
Thanked: Once
Default

[quote=lamborghini]
And i have a feeling that once Audi is better known, it will get more buyers in India once the brand gets known. I just wish they would launch the A4.
QUOTE]

hey Lambo, Audi has been pretty well known in India ever since Ravi Shastri got his gift many decades back.. generation gap??
nitinbhag is offline  
Closed Thread


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Virus problems/spyware problems! post here! SirAlec Gadgets, Computers & Software 10 16th July 2014 00:05
Mercedes to buy Brawn and rename it EDIT: Now called Mercedes Benz Grand Prix McLaren Rulez Int'l Motorsport 43 25th December 2009 13:51
Mahindra Scorpio CRDE 2007 - Problems 'n' Problems chandrda Technical Stuff 3 13th November 2009 09:59


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 06:09.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks