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Old 15th December 2008, 11:59   #1
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Default Climate plan wants drastic curbs on private cars!

Owning and using private vehicles could become a lot tougher if proposals made by the National Action Plan on Climate Change are
Alarmed by the burgeoning growth of private vehicles in Indian cities and the resultant rise in fuel emissions, a panel under the action plan has suggested a slew of measures that promise to change the face of urban transport.

The measures - proposed by the Mission on Sustainable Habitat under the action plan being prepared by the urban development ministry -include making ownership of parking space compulsory for those wishing to buy new private vehicles, making parking fee reflect the cost of land, imposing a congestion charge and making parts of the city off limits for cars.
More here: Climate plan wants drastic curbs on private cars-Global Warming-Earth-The Times of India
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Old 15th December 2008, 12:49   #2
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I am sure a "climate cess" will also be a part of the final plan. This could be implemented as an additional levy on the existing duties applicable while buying vehicles. In addition, they can add another Rs2 to petrol and diesel in the name of "climate surcharge" and add another 10% on toll charges. Of course, use all these additional money collected to buy more cars and bigger SUVs for ministers and bureaucrats. This "collection and distribution mechanism" always seems to work flawlessly here in India. Rest all proposals are just waste of time.
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Old 15th December 2008, 12:55   #3
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if the ban on private diesel cars comes into play, that will be catastrophic. No more new crdi tech available to buyers, and the resale of existing diesel cars will plummet :(.

this is ironic given that in Europe, diesel is touted as a cleaner alternative to petrol. I remember reading a couple of years ago that the Citroen C6's HDi engine had such a low emission that it oculd not be measured on any of the then available instruments for measuring tailpipe emissions.
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Old 15th December 2008, 12:57   #4
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Adding the cess to fuel seems to be a possible scenario, just hope that the money actually is utilized for environmental purposes.
Adding an increase of 10% to toll is not right since not all car users pay toll. Most toll nakas are at city limits and someone traveling daily outside the city for work will have to pay extra but the majority of people who commute in the city only will not land up paying anything.
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Old 15th December 2008, 13:02   #5
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Originally Posted by himanshugoswami View Post

this is ironic given that in Europe, diesel is touted as a cleaner alternative to petrol. I remember reading a couple of years ago that the Citroen C6's HDi engine had such a low emission that it oculd not be measured on any of the then available instruments for measuring tailpipe emissions.
What do you think of diesel quality in India compared to Europe?

Probably govt should stipulate something like only cleaner diesel to be used for cars. it could be high qulaity diesel (something closer to european quality levels). Then we can say emissions would be lesser for diesel cars. As of now (as per CSE) diesel car emissions are more harmful compared to petrol cars in India.
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Old 15th December 2008, 13:06   #6
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yes its good. Everyone should pay for parking in roads and its should be monitored and accounted for. This will solve most traffic problems. Almost all countries with roads have implemented payed public parking.

May be we can use our Buss terminus as parking space.i.e we can raise the bus terminus into a multi storied parking space, while leaving the ground floor for the buses.

Last edited by ritz830 : 15th December 2008 at 13:19.
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Old 15th December 2008, 13:12   #7
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If in a five minute walk from either home or office I can access a Metro I will happily discontinue using a car for the daily commute.

The Metro is the future of all urban centres.

While any move to lower the carbon footprint we leave behind everyday is welcome providing the alternative should be top priority.

Everytime I read an article in the media which states that someone somewhere in the government has been "alarmed by" some report about some issue I wonder when our government finally will get alarmed about:

1. The increase of murderers and crooks as politicians

2. The rampant corruption in the government and judiciary

3. Drought and the devastating effects of still not linking the rivers and harnessing all that water for irrigation

4. The depletion of our art, architecture and natural heritage which would be a billion dollar industry for India

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Old 15th December 2008, 13:22   #8
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owning and driving a car in the city is already a torture. having to commute without my car is also a torture. so i have got nothing to lose. bring it on!!
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Old 15th December 2008, 15:09   #9
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More hypocrisy from the self serving officials in charge! It's amazing how there is no accountability for those in power. Why not begin with the enormous amounts of waste that occur in every facet of government?

In this instance, ensure that all officials only have one or two cars in their convoys, just for starters. Ensure that public officials do not use separate aircraft for travel to and from the same location. Ensure that electricity (the generation of which is one of the bigger causes of pollution) is not wasted in government offices and by "farmers" who don't have to pay for it. Maybe they should improve the state of our pathetic roads and prevent illegal parking by tour buses so that there are less delays on the roads that cause thousands of vehicles to sit idling away and waste thousands of crores in productivity losses. Take those hundreds of old polluting taxis off the streets or at least make them pay for parking as well at a much higher rate since theirs is a commercial enterprise. Improve mass transit systems to make them more comfortable, safe and efficient. Force the oil companies to produce better fuel and to ensure that adulteration does not take place. Make the vehicle manufacturers improve the emission standards of cars and prevent designs that have not changed in decades from remaining on sale.

If the true goal be the reduction of green house gases and the resulting climate change, there are many more efficient things to do than simply make the public pay more under the pretext that it will somehow solve the problem.

OT, but it's just like public safety. Have the lion's share of the well trained and equipped security forces engaged in keeping fat cat politicians with oversized egos safe from their supposed threats and let the man on the street pay for it both financially and physically when there is trouble.

It really sickens me to my stomach when I hear about these moronic proposals. They start out talking about a problem and inevitably conclude that the solution is to tax people more. I think history proves that this has not achieved the intended goals most of the time.

Last edited by kbk_75 : 15th December 2008 at 15:18.
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Old 15th December 2008, 15:20   #10
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Originally Posted by appuchan View Post
I am sure a "climate cess" will also be a part of the final plan.
Boss, don't give the ideas. Maybe govt will be seeing this and they take a cue from here.
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Old 15th December 2008, 17:42   #11
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bigger cess/taxes in this matter is welcome, provided the cash collected is put to work strengthening the public transport system. if the public transport is efficient, there is no need to drive our own vehicles everytime.

i welcome this proposal, provided public transportation improves.
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Old 15th December 2008, 18:18   #12
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If India provides better roads and infrastructure then I welcome this move, I doubt another minimum 5 years we can see this happen.

They should improve Diesel quality or remove discounts/subsudies on Diesel. I always welcome if private cars are Petrol and taxies as Diesel cars. Thats how it should be.

Only off roaders (should set max speed 60kmph) can be Deisel but people who buy cars for private use should be Petrol.


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Old 15th December 2008, 18:22   #13
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"congestion charges" is an useless concept if u look at any big city like London.
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Old 15th December 2008, 18:28   #14
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I really don't think "better infrastructure" and "fewer cars" will happen on the same day, simultaneously. There *will* be some suffering and friction - but overall, I think this is a progressive step. We need to shrink our cities such that most people live and commute in a small area - sprawl has been proven unsustainable. Wide roads - more cars - same traffic. "Cleaner" tech etc is a moot point if the total volume of vehicles keeps shooting up at the rate it has been. Its rather simple - the fewer kilometres automobiles travel overall, the lesser the congestion/pollution - that should be the aim. Cut down the total number of kilometres travelled to half - in that sense its intra city - esp "cross zone" (once the city is seen as a network of independent zones) - commutes that should be made expensive - not necessarily ownership.

In a lot many cities, cycling is a perfectly doable alternative for a lot of the population - even in Bangalore a huge number of people travel less than 12kms or so to work.

Once there's inconvenience, the voices demanding better public infrastructure will get louder and more organized - the BIAS services to the new airport being a great case in point. Till the effort is towards creating more road space and the like - essentially making life temporarily easier for private vehicle ownership inside cities - these influential voices will not demand good infrastructure but choose the path of lower resistance - driving a safer, climate controlled car to work - maybe even chauffeured so parking is out of the equation - and asking for better roads each time they get to a clogged state.

Last edited by zenx : 15th December 2008 at 18:32.
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Old 15th December 2008, 21:21   #15
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Another one of those proposals with 'good intentions'. Though I am all for a cleaner environment and do use public transport on most weekdays, the problem I see here is one of implementation. For instance you cannot actually begin to impose a 'congestion charge' unless you have good public transportation alternatives (What most people conveniently forget when talking of congestion charges in a city like London is that there was a massive investment in public transport before the charge was levied). So hopefully the planners would have thought of all these issues before forcing the public to leave their cars at home!!
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