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View Poll Results: What petrol C segment sedan would you buy?
Honda City 1.5 iVtec 113 55.39%
Fiat Linea 1.4 Fire 91 44.61%
Voters: 204. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 29th January 2009, 08:00   #301
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
Should've done that long back. You have posted your review of the two cars and people are free to disagree. In the case of this brand, we know who the usual suspects will be and what they will have to say so there are no great surprises there either.

Dont bother argueing with people who have some very fundamental beliefs that you cannot change. Just state your case and leave it at that for the benefit of those who may find some use for it.
hey steer,

well said man, i have steadfastedly stayed the hell out of this debate, even though there have been times that i have wanted to jump in!
what surprises me is that people seem to get so het up over their choices and beliefs that it starts to get personal and overtly opiniated...



Quote:
Originally Posted by Max View Post
Well, i OWN NHC and flattered by FIAT LINEA looks + DIESEL ENGINE DUE TO HIGH DEISEL FE but I am very much concerned about quality of FIAT cars and after sales service because we all know TATA MOTORS shaddy practices in various threads here.

Hell, very first reason I am scared to death for buying FIAT is because its guarantee and service will be offered by TATA MOTORS. Yes TATA MOTORS! They are known for their worst after sales service and famous for treating their customers like thugs. Just look at varun roy's thread and my personal experience with TATA group of companies.

Also, I am sure it will have less resale value then HONDA city because honda is honda and the brand has proven itself. Where as FIAT is FAILED BRAND in India.

So, No matter what you say, FIAT is yet to prove itself in India and I will refrain anyone from buying LINEA before its real life report is out. Let people buy it and drive it, buy it next year for the safe side, otherwise its your money and you have right to do whatever you want with it.

hey max,

opinions opinions!!!! lol

i own a fiat and a tata and am on the cusp of owning yet another fiat - so i must be a major flub eh??

to say that fiat is a failed brand in india is a little bit simplistic and a whole lot of nothing! there are enough fiats around to dispel that outright. yes it ain't a hyundai, but it never claimed to be.

yes the service back up is rubbish - but if you mange to get a relationship going with an advisor, you can circumnavigate that as well. there are enough horror stories around for honda dealers and maruti dealers - even on this forum, but that does not make the brand fundamentally bad.

unfortunately fiat and tata have done themselves no favours by not making their 1st as well as recurring point of contact as painless as possible for their customers... but both of the marquees offer products at phenomenal price points, blowing away their respective competitions in terms of price if nothing else - in a market as sensitive to price as ours - that is really the smart way to play the game.

also - if all of us waited for a car to be around for a year before buying it - pretty much all car companies may as well shut shop and have some tea

i'm not going to get into the honda vs fiat debate because its been done to death all over the forum and frankly it is of no use. its like comparing apples to oranges. irrespective of how level headed you are, car buying is still an emotional decision for most of us - all of us have our reasons to stick to a brand, so we all must respect that - especially within THIS car mad community.

but, as they say, "opinions are like...."

Last edited by Technocrat : 29th January 2009 at 12:25. Reason: Only two smilies per post allowed
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Old 29th January 2009, 08:35   #302
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Well its too easy criticize, and retort to name calling, as you did in your very first post in this thread calling things a joke. You perhaps think that writing things in bold makes your arguments stronger
That's another of you assumptions. Same like your assumptions on most people wont buy the emotion plus pack and ad infinitum. Most people know that putting a word in bold is to highlight the selected words, not to make an argument stronger. I see you yourself have used it in your threads - see my quotes from you below. Anyway, if you used it without knowing what it was meant for, now you know. You are welcome

Quote:
Originally Posted by aseem View Post
your very first post in this thread calling things a joke
Another assumption. I didn't call this thread a joke. I merely said your safety rating was a joke. And it was not a personal attack - I was stating a fact as i see it. I still maintain it is a joke.

See the two different comparisons you have down in this thread. See how much your own ratings changed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aseem View Post
Linea Safety
......
Safety Rating: 2.5/5 (As I dont see many buying Emotion Option Pack)
Honda City Safety
.......
Saftey Rating: 4.5/5
Quote:
Originally Posted by aseem View Post

Safety City

Gets all credit in my book. Enough has been said.
Rating 5/5

Safety Linea
Enough has been said. The fact is that apart from Emotion Plus no model gets airbags. I still stand by my argument, as safety is not mandatory across models and the % of ppl that dont by Emotion Plus wont get Airbags, and those that dont buy Dynamic Plus wont get ABS either.
Rating 3/5
so, you make an assumption(rather than being objective) and set a rating. And then you come back in your second review and decide to change your own rating. Even Honda City rating is bumped up to 5/5 in your second rating - i am sure you found something in your second review to increase the rating by 0.5


Quote:
Originally Posted by aseem View Post
as being a Fiat owner you took Honda coming on top personally. If anything, your views are more biased than me, as you own a Palio and I am neither associated with Fiat or Honda.
Quote:
Originally Posted by aseem View Post
For the record, I dont own a Honda but you most definitely own a Fiat. And I am quite capable of discussing and putting my point across. I suggest you should be more open in accepting criticism about Fiat and its cars.
Beware of too many assumptions, you don't know what that makes you. I didn't say anything about City coming on top - i said about two objective aspects. In fact if its just a case of making City win i will recommend a a simple way which not many can find fault with. Include Brand Value as a parameter and put Honda as 5 and FIAT as 1. Simple enough.

And please don't tell me I own a Palio makes me a FIAT fan and i cannot comment on any threads. That way the only people who can write comparo's here would be people who don't own cars.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aseem View Post
If you'd have spent more to read the review than getting excited and flaming the review, you would have realized that I myself have pointed out the poor quality door panel for power windows and ac controls in ANHC being downmarket.
Another assumption that i haven't read what you said. Perhaps if you have though about why i mentioned it you would have realized that i see you making a passing mention of it, but your rating don't reflect it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aseem View Post
Why compare the S model, why not compare the 7.5 Lakh ex showroom E model?
For one E is not yet available for purchase (will be available in Feb or so). And since you are so indulgent in assumptions, can you assume so far most people would have purchased S version?

Last edited by SkyWalker : 29th January 2009 at 08:47.
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Old 29th January 2009, 08:41   #303
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Default peace guys...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyWalker View Post
And please dont tell me I own a Palio makes me a FIAT fan and i cannot comment on any threads. That way the only people who can write comparo's here would be people who dont own cars.
hey skywalker dude -

chill man and let it go.... not worth the aggro.

stay safe and stay sane.
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Old 29th January 2009, 08:53   #304
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guna View Post
Are we talking about perceived quality of plastics or actual quality? Magazines tend to comment based on what they percive. Of course the feel of plastics and other materials is very important but it does'nt end there.
Guna, while we cant objectively measure it -I sat in both and TD'd both and i felt Linea interiors have better quality.

I just bought in the magazines in as an independent source. Agree with you that we have to go by our own assessment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bIte tHe bulLet View Post
hey skywalker dude -

chill man and let it go.... not worth the aggro.

stay safe and stay sane.
well dude, no aggro really. But you are right. This thread is just getting into a debate. I am pulling out. Peace


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Old 29th January 2009, 09:00   #305
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Never has so much aggression has been seen on TBHP. That's the passion for automobiles we have! Be it Fiat or a Honda or any other motor company everyone has the right to say what he wants to. We share our views on this virtual forum as sometimes there's no one who would listen to us offline. My humble request to all Bhpians is to maintain peace and harmony of this forum and the quality of posts. If we too post the crap that other forums have been publishing, we have no reason to exist.

Honda City or Fiat Linea both are good quality cars. Let the person who has the money to afford these cars decide what he wants. Debating over a issue again and again is not going to prompt Fiat to add safety features in lower variants or Honda to lower its price.

Chill. Have a pleasant day ahead.

I remember a saying from my Bangalore days "Swalapa Adjust Maadi"
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Old 29th January 2009, 09:31   #306
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Originally Posted by SkyWalker View Post
Guna, while we cant objectively measure it -I sat in both and TD'd both and i felt Linea interiors have better quality.

I just bought in the magazines in as an independent source. Agree with you that we have to go by our own assessment.
No I did not mean that we should not trust what magazines report or we should do our own assessment. I was just pointing out that whatever people (us and magazines) are reporting seem to be based on the percieved quality of plastics/materials then the actual quality. In other words materials used in a car may appear 'cheap' or 'rich' due to the colour and texture used but it may or may not be a good from engineering perpesctive (grade, strength, durability, dimensional accurecy, tolerences etc)

I have read comments in magazines such as 'cost cutting is evident, looking at the quality of plastics used'. It is difficult to comment reliably unless they are experts in plastics and value engineering.

But as a layman or a potential buyer, we go by what the materials convey through their appearence and it is just fine.

Last edited by Guna : 29th January 2009 at 09:33.
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Old 29th January 2009, 10:04   #307
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amtak View Post
Honda City or Fiat Linea both are good quality cars. Let the person who has the money to afford these cars decide what he wants. Debating over a issue again and again is not going to prompt Fiat to add safety features in lower variants or Honda to lower its price.

Chill. Have a pleasant day ahead.

I remember a saying from my Bangalore days "Swalapa Adjust Maadi"
Well Said amtak...Whatever written after the first say 10 pages is just the repeat. People have their own opinion and criteria in choosing which is best for them. Finally everything boils down to the price of the car. I'm not repeating again.
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Old 29th January 2009, 10:05   #308
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Take the mags with a big pinch of salt. Technically they are Ok, but the other factor namely service availability of spares, ans resale value do not bug them. If you are paying for your own car then all these become imprtant parameters.
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Old 29th January 2009, 10:19   #309
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Quote:
See the two different comparisons you have down in this thread.
From the Oxford dictionary:

Quote:
definitive

adjective 1 (of a conclusion or agreement) decisive and with authority. 2 (of a book or other text) the most authoritative of its kind.
From what I have read on this thread, everyone who disagrees with certain points is either a Fiat owner or biased but everyone who agrees is not a Honda owner or biased!

With gems like the ones above, this thread has lost all crediblity and is pulling the crediblity of the whole forum down with it.

This particular thread stopped being about cars long back. It's about one individual.
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Old 29th January 2009, 10:34   #310
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Never a dull moment on a thread that has anything to do with Fiat on TBHP
Before people flame me, i am not accusing anyone of being biased or anything.

But i have a very basic question.

How does one judge the quality of plastics in a car? When you say it has poor plastics, does it mean the look and finish is not smooth? Does it break when you tap it? Is it coming apart at corners when you say its poor plastics? Do you open the glove compartment and twist the lid to see how flexible it is?
If someone can put down things to look for to judge the "quality" of plastics inside a car, it would be very helpful when i go TD a car in... some years
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Old 29th January 2009, 10:43   #311
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Originally Posted by amitoj View Post

How does one judge the quality of plastics in a car? Lay man - By the appearance

When you say it has poor plastics, does it mean the look and finish is not smooth? The texture would be rough/hard edges/not so smooth cuts etc. I can also add that results in poor ergonomics.

Does it break when you tap it? some times it may break if you put some extra pressure. E.g Door Handle. Remember the door lock on old marutis used to break so easily.

Is it coming apart at corners when you say its poor plastics? Do you open the glove compartment and twist the lid to see how flexible it is?

For first part, Yes. Second part, how badly it rattles.

If someone can put down things to look for to judge the "quality" of plastics inside a car, it would be very helpful when i go TD a car in... some years

From a layman's perspective.
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Old 29th January 2009, 10:56   #312
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Originally Posted by amtak View Post
From a layman's perspective.
Thanks amtak. That seems pretty clear cut. Wonder what the whole plasticky debate is about then.

By the way, i think Linea's TV advertisement is one of the best car adverts to come out in recent times. And A Star's ad makes no sense.
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Old 29th January 2009, 11:40   #313
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Originally Posted by amitoj View Post
Thanks amtak. That seems pretty clear cut. Wonder what the whole plasticky debate is about then.

By the way, i think Linea's TV advertisement is one of the best car adverts to come out in recent times. And A Star's ad makes no sense.
Keeping in mind the tone of this thread, I would like to bring to notice the ANHC advertisement, which cleverly commented on how Honda is only competing with itself, "Khud se aage jaana hai" (improving on its already successful product). Also it didn't hurt that it was shot well with some good visual effects to boot.
The best advertisement by far for some time. The only exception I can remember is probably the Lancer advertisement a long time back which had Wake me Up (Evanescence) as the soundtrack.
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Old 29th January 2009, 11:52   #314
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The only exception I can remember is probably the Lancer advertisement a long time back which had Wake me Up (Evanescence) as the soundtrack.
I agree with you. The lancer ad was by far the best ad I've seen. Sorry for being
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Old 29th January 2009, 12:38   #315
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Have been following this thread for a a while now and have noticed the following;

this thread started out on a very good note and the intentions of the thread starter were very genuine. Somewhere down the lines, things got personal. I mean that Fiat owners and Honda owners got against each other as if it meant survival. Please guys, refrain form such meaningless banter. If someone has a different point of view, post it but do not ridicule the other's point of view. We all have the right to express our views, provided it stays that way, as an expression. Without taking names i can see, that some of us (and we individually know who we are) are getting too persoal with our views. Everyone does not have to share your views, please learn to respect that. Making exaggerated claims also, amounts to your thrusting down you opinion on others. Please keep the discussion healthy.

Having said that I have not driven either the Linea nor the New City. I have been driven in them. I liked the comfort factor in the Linea better than the City, especially the rear seat (i have sat both in the rear and the front) The driver (the same man for both cars) told me that the Linea handles like a dream and hugs the road better. I also found that the Linea takes pot holes and irregularities in our roads with great aplomb which is fantastic. The City is more wobbly an jumpy, especially at higher speeds on irregular roads. It feels safer to be in the Linea than the City on high speeds, especially on the expressway. Both engines are gems but the City takes the cake here. In most other departments, including value fr money, the Linea takes tha bakery. Now before any of you go about and start calling me names like Fiat owner or something like that (not that i mind it, im proud of it) it would do better for you guys to know that i have had the good fortune to own both, a Fiat and a City.

IMHO the city will sell because of its reputation and he fact that Indians follow the trodden path but if Fiat get their act together, they have a winner which can rival the City truly. I will be driving them myself and posting my driving report. Expect it to be totally unbiased

Thanks!!
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